Hello dewardh
OK
How do you now it's optimal?
Same as before.
How are you going to know what it will sound like?
Max SPL makes sense but no measurements?? How do you even know what you have of where your issues are?? Are you considering the measurements as trivial??
Hello Simon
I have a couple of systems and in my HT my mains are fullrange and do act as distributed subs in line with a pair of LFE subs. What you are saying makes sense as long as you can get the imaging and placement you want along with good LF placement.
Hello Earl
You use your own room optimization software. Is there anything similar out there along the same lines. I have used a room mode calculator that was effective and did a good job at predicting where problem placements for both speakers and the listening position. That's old school, anything new out there??
Rob🙂
OK
How do you now it's optimal?
Same as before.
How are you going to know what it will sound like?
Max SPL makes sense but no measurements?? How do you even know what you have of where your issues are?? Are you considering the measurements as trivial??
Hello Simon
I have a couple of systems and in my HT my mains are fullrange and do act as distributed subs in line with a pair of LFE subs. What you are saying makes sense as long as you can get the imaging and placement you want along with good LF placement.
Hello Earl
You use your own room optimization software. Is there anything similar out there along the same lines. I have used a room mode calculator that was effective and did a good job at predicting where problem placements for both speakers and the listening position. That's old school, anything new out there??
Rob🙂
I don't like headphone much either, but the DTS demo changed my mind. It's the poor man's Smyth Realizer. I thought for sure they were cheating the demo with a sub blended in. Nope, all in the headphones.
I've yet to hear the Smyth, but a few confirmed headphone haters I know have, and fell in love.
I've yet to hear the Smyth, but a few confirmed headphone haters I know have, and fell in love.
You don't, and it doesn't matter . . . the room was the "given", and odds are that the "listening area" will be determined by a) the spouse, and b) placement of the television.
It will sound like you make it sound . . . that's the "do it" in "do it yourself".
Pretty much. Whole measurement systems cost only a few hundred dollars now, and some (like the Sound Easy UE) are so automated that they will even design and tweak the crossovers for you, while others (like REW) will address final equalization.
If the driver choices and radiation pattern are good (appropriate to the room) the rest falls easily into place. The problem comes when one designs some sort of "optimum" box and then tries to shoehorn it into an inappropriate position in a room where it cannot possibly work well. That's the "mass production" route, and the result will be a lot of wasted effort and a result no better than buying a "system" from some big-box retailer would get you.
Since the end goal is good sound at a particular location in a particular room that is where good design starts. You work back from there to get it. Of course there will always be some final "adjustments" . . . no design ever makes it from paper to product without. But no amount of "measurement" and "correction" is going to fix a design that is simply wrong for the application from the outset.
You mean the falling in love part? Back in October. I was supposed to hear the Smyth system, but came up lame and couldn't make the demo. But there are 3 well known guys here on diyAudio who were very impressed.
Hint: Check Linear Audio magazine.
Hint: Check Linear Audio magazine.
I hear that a lot but actually nobody ever tried it. Once the sound is fully externalized (due to binaural processing) I doubt that much is missing that can't be recreated with bass shakers.
Hello Markus
Have you ever tried them?? With the demo I tried they wouldn't fool anyone. It's just not the same there no sense of preasure and the vibrating seat feels like a vibrating seat. You don't have the feel on your skin.
Rob
Hi Rob,
When the seat is vibrating then there's too much shaking (at the wrong frequencies). It needs to be barely noticeable to "sound" realistic.
When the seat is vibrating then there's too much shaking (at the wrong frequencies). It needs to be barely noticeable to "sound" realistic.
Hello dewardh
I am talking about a fixed room, I didn't say placement was fixed. It makes no sense to put speakers in the worst room positions and then rely on EQ to "fix" them. You want to get it right as best you can with placement and use the "fix" tools as little as possible.
So how do you predict best placement in a given room without the old tried and true way of moving them around a half a dozen times.
This is getting off the track of what I asked Earl.
Rob🙂
Rob
The math behind room modes calculation is certainly not new, but I have not seen a piece of software that does what I look for, namely drag and drop movement of mains and multiple subs (with real acoustics and amp parameters), with five listener locations, variable wall damping on each set of walls, the statistics (frequency variance at each listener and the total spatial variance) all in real time with instant updating.
If there is a program out there that does this, I haven't seen it.
The math behind room modes calculation is certainly not new, but I have not seen a piece of software that does what I look for, namely drag and drop movement of mains and multiple subs (with real acoustics and amp parameters), with five listener locations, variable wall damping on each set of walls, the statistics (frequency variance at each listener and the total spatial variance) all in real time with instant updating.
If there is a program out there that does this, I haven't seen it.
It depends on the room, and the designated listening area within that room. There is no general, or "one size fits all", answer. A quick sketchup of the primary room modes will give a good hint of where and at what frequencies your "problems" will be, and that in turn will lead to possible placements (and other techniques) that minimize those problems. But what works best in a small and highly reflective room may not work (or even be necessary) in a large and lossy room.
"If there is a program out there that does this, I haven't seen it."
Not exactly but very close to your spcs, Earl!
Three different simulations, the last one lets you move the speakers and mic in 3D.
hunecke.de | Calculators
Not exactly but very close to your spcs, Earl!
Three different simulations, the last one lets you move the speakers and mic in 3D.
hunecke.de | Calculators
The problem is that for subwoofers in small rooms it cannot be. That makes things a little more difficult . . .
Hello Earl
I didn't think so thanks. Your software sounds impressive.
Hello Markus
When my HT is going I get quite a bit of furniture shake so to speak, I would have to say the demo was too high. But still no pressurization pants flapping or the growl in your chest.
Rob 🙂
I didn't think so thanks. Your software sounds impressive.
Hello Markus
When my HT is going I get quite a bit of furniture shake so to speak, I would have to say the demo was too high. But still no pressurization pants flapping or the growl in your chest.
Rob 🙂
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