... High intelligence?
I thought the main reason we became the dominant species was our aggression towards other sentient creatures?
Human taxonomy - Wikipedia
Just look at the various "reality" shows for a more up-to-date close reference, the smartest and most physically able people are cast out early in the process by the people that seek to reduce competition.
It may well be, that we have effectively eliminated far more gifted creatures using our "intelligence" and highly agressive way of dealing with other contenders of land, resources and food.
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Not to mention that we live in a society where the most intelligent and useful people get fewer children than anyone else. Homo Sapiens as a race, is most likely a race breeding itself into stupidity.
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That my friend is the most intelligent thing I’ve seen posted on this forum since joining, and is no joke!
I just want to point out that I did not think about any particular social group or culture.
It just seems to be a general trend worldwide, that very clever and highly functioning resourceful individuals, get fewer children than most others.
Perhaps it's based on planning, the people that plan carefully, and think ahead, have more concern of needs, development and costs, than those who "screw around" in more than one sense.
It seems to be a trend regardless of which part of the world you look at.
It also happens to coincide with our, in general, exploiting and judgemental nature.
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Resourceful: Able to deal skillfully and promptly with new situations, difficulties, etc.
It's not about the money!
It just seems to be a general trend worldwide, that very clever and highly functioning resourceful individuals, get fewer children than most others.
Perhaps it's based on planning, the people that plan carefully, and think ahead, have more concern of needs, development and costs, than those who "screw around" in more than one sense.
It seems to be a trend regardless of which part of the world you look at.
It also happens to coincide with our, in general, exploiting and judgemental nature.
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Resourceful: Able to deal skillfully and promptly with new situations, difficulties, etc.
It's not about the money!
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This is I guess how Mother Nature wants it
: those wasting their outstanding resourcefulness on stuff not leading to reproduction, while may get many things done, get outnumbered/phased out.
We should be careful not to stray into the area of reproductive rights.
Reproductive rights - Wikipedia
There was three kings into the east,
Three kings both great and high,
And they hae sworn a solemn oath
John Barleycorn should die.
They took a plough and plough'd him down,
Put clods upon his head,
And they hae sworn a solemn oath
John Barleycorn was dead.
But the cheerful Spring came kindly on,
And show'rs began to fall;
John Barleycorn got up again,
And sore surpris'd them all.
These are the first three verses from the poem 'John Barleycorn' by Robert Burns in which he refers to the process of reaping the barley, malting and distilling to create the Uisge Beatha or Water of Life.
I'll drink to that!
This is I guess how Mother Nature wants it
And it's also very important to snag useful items off the resourceful people, since they have no right having something other people don't.
Not to mention there's no point paying full price for the highly useful items, since they'd be too expensive then, and profit is better divided to one self when selling to the next man.
"Ah, I see you have fallen into a predicament, I know a man that can help, but it's gonna cost you."
I have faith in humanity, IE I have no faith.
At my "new" house I've planted redcurrant bushes, some various garden blueberry bushes, an apple tree, and there's a cherry tree already. Though I really had to trim the cherry tree, as it was too tall, hoping for cherries next year. Got some rhubarb going as well.
Next year I'll also get some potatoes, radishes and carrots going, this years season is bust, better use it for helping the planted bushes and trees develop root systems. So I'll pinch most of the apples off.
Hoping for lots of mushrooms and berries in the forest, I'll buy some moose or deer off a farmer.
Firewood enough on my tiny property for quite some years.
If anyone has any suggestions for good-to-have plants that come back year after year, I'd really appreciate it.
What about the right of children ???? Is it wize to have many children when you have not enough to eat or give them at least as much chance as you had yourself ?
Most of the time, number of children is more about education and/or culture. Not a right as in many countries like India, many african ones, but also in some western area depending about social groups or education, just the males decide and the women have no right. Many countries have gvts knowing that and they work about giving more right to future women with school, information programs... not an easy task where culture and traditions are strong but they have consciousness about that because people whom rules have often more education and informations themselves. I don't think gvt people like to see children borning in the camps of United Nations and still being there 40 years after ! What a life, what a right for those children 40 years after still living into those camps ?!
Everywhere before we had a strong children mortality then we had healing and planing possibilities going towards more individual possibilities... but I would not call that a right as far it is an unilateral decision that imply a life to come. If we had to talk about right in advanced civilizations where people try to be fair getting out cultural traditions then we would have to talk about children rights too . Hey that's the difference between morale and ethic ! I don't care too much about moral if ethic is flawed !
In that sense the eater is responsible of what he eats.
Just my 2 cents...YMMV
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It's about your local climate and ground type : ask to the locals gardening associations, they know. Analyse the acidity and type of the ground soil for better choice and results. If climate is ok but not the ground, you can decide to add the ground soil for the area of your chosed plants. Make also your own hummus
Apples and cherries very often only bear fruits every other year. They say that one can combat this by pruning, fertilizing, thinning undeveloped fruit, choosing right cultivars, etc. but not sure if this really works -- I grew up eating fresh apples, cherries and plums every other year: one year you fatten up before winter on fresh fruits, the next mostly on preserved fruits. Forest berries, though, cropped every year.
Here is a real world example of the problem I have with it.
I'm god and I have a new angel to mentor. I've let him copy an existing good dna project to get started. But now his new product has hiccups. Not all the time just occasionally. Me (god) cannot give that to the world.
In firmware programming we have a vector table, It may be 100 bytes long or 1k words long. Does not matter. If a vector is not used, me (god) put a dummy spacer to always have the dna in proper register. If an accident happens the dna will vector to a safe place. Its just one of my god secrets.
Well the angel decided that since the vector is not used it can be removed.
So he uses his nifty dna editor and deletes the space holder and writes a comment about how great of an angel he is.
*Somehow* the dna continued to operate but very strangely. The angel said I (god) gave him defective dna and it was a mean trick. He had spent six months trying to get the new dna product out the door. All of the other angels were angry because they produce great dna but this angel can't make any useable dna for the world....
So I (god) and my FDA angel took a look at his project dna. I did not see any problem in the sequence, now me (god) scratching my head. So me worked late one day and looked at every line of the dna. Ahhhh eurika I saw the problem. The angel said "well there is no manual how was I supposed to know that".
There is the logic problem with us (the world) screwing around with God's design. We just don't know what the hell we're doing.
There are many social, cultural, religious and economic reasons why parents in the developing world have large families. Here are just two examples:
- Because child mortality rates in the developing world are so high, parents may intentionally have large families because the grim reality is that sometimes children don't survive.
- In some developing countries, the government doesn’t provide a pension or social security benefit, so parents must rely on their children to care for them in their old age. Couples may choose to have large families to ensure they are supported when they’re older.
We are all whales or cows if you prefer
That basicly happen when monney is too much concentrate on few percent of people... these last having most of the lands & groves and economical trigers they economicly "slave" these parents : more people = more monney for richest owners whom becom somewhat human meat eater (as the parents btw because of many children).
But notices richest may also want children to take care of them because eating too much grease, sugar, trans meat, intoxited sea food can give earth disease and strokes !
As eating became a global economy like the parodic & paradoxal above illustration, I surmise a diet ethic should not only care about animals protein eated by humans but take care of all the Earth animal chain, so human being included. If veganism is an anthropomorphism I think it scratchs only the surface as vegetable VS meat is a limited thinking if it's about moral and/or ethic for our own species.
It's not only about eating meat or bad butchers as any vegies/vegans may also somewhat be human meat eaters as non controlling the economy and human cycles involved in what they (and everyone as we are all in the same train) eat.
Time to merge several concepts as cunsumers ourselves: slow food, local supplychain and green food as non polluting and save ressources like water, space, transport and so on. Living ressources management, food economy management? I mean not FAO or lobbys but from and for final cunsumers and responsible people we should be.
Something has worried me: cereals and non manufactered food are stocked because people can gamble on their stock exchange value. Some others give themselves the right to licencie cereals or clonage , change genes for a standalone season or to work in harmony (resist) with pesticids of the same brand. Disparition of species because of guru medecine, exotic expensive food, cosmetic or cloths industries, extensive agriculture, farming and fishing, etc.
I'm agree we are defintly not clever as a species, I like the idea than eating as a fundamental animal need could be a good start to winn more inteligence and let allow us to raise a global consciousness in a true politic targett. Politic word taken in the noble and original sense : live together in the city a la Platon, not an individual opinion that cause fight on forums because it's about individual (ego). The global to attribute back individual "hapyness" (=ethic to reword it). And btw brain need mainly carbo hydrate (few proteins and grease for maintenance purpose... viva B12 vitamins, etc)
Walt, gives me Bambi back, and not only for its meat.
That basicly happen when monney is too much concentrate on few percent of people... these last having most of the lands & groves and economical trigers they economicly "slave" these parents : more people = more monney for richest owners whom becom somewhat human meat eater (as the parents btw because of many children).
But notices richest may also want children to take care of them because eating too much grease, sugar, trans meat, intoxited sea food can give earth disease and strokes !
As eating became a global economy like the parodic & paradoxal above illustration, I surmise a diet ethic should not only care about animals protein eated by humans but take care of all the Earth animal chain, so human being included. If veganism is an anthropomorphism I think it scratchs only the surface as vegetable VS meat is a limited thinking if it's about moral and/or ethic for our own species.
It's not only about eating meat or bad butchers as any vegies/vegans may also somewhat be human meat eaters as non controlling the economy and human cycles involved in what they (and everyone as we are all in the same train) eat.
Time to merge several concepts as cunsumers ourselves: slow food, local supplychain and green food as non polluting and save ressources like water, space, transport and so on. Living ressources management, food economy management? I mean not FAO or lobbys but from and for final cunsumers and responsible people we should be.
Something has worried me: cereals and non manufactered food are stocked because people can gamble on their stock exchange value. Some others give themselves the right to licencie cereals or clonage , change genes for a standalone season or to work in harmony (resist) with pesticids of the same brand. Disparition of species because of guru medecine, exotic expensive food, cosmetic or cloths industries, extensive agriculture, farming and fishing, etc.
I'm agree we are defintly not clever as a species, I like the idea than eating as a fundamental animal need could be a good start to winn more inteligence and let allow us to raise a global consciousness in a true politic targett. Politic word taken in the noble and original sense : live together in the city a la Platon, not an individual opinion that cause fight on forums because it's about individual (ego). The global to attribute back individual "hapyness" (=ethic to reword it). And btw brain need mainly carbo hydrate (few proteins and grease for maintenance purpose... viva B12 vitamins, etc)
Walt, gives me Bambi back, and not only for its meat.
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Yes ofcourse, it is possible to twist arguments in this discussion, so that it correlates with economic data.
But it's just not true.
Child bearing statistics in developing countries, closely follow the amount of education for females.
There are several other advantages to securing and maintaining a public education system for every single person in this world, it is about giving people a basic and conformed insight in how things work, that can enable people to see the resources at hand for what they are, and what they can do with them.
Not saying everyone should have an university degree, but 10-12 years of school should be common.
People manage to have religious buildings and priests even in (or perhaps "especially in", since it's easier to turn to some invisible deity when you have no education and shtf) the poorest societies. Previously, priests had the role of scholars, and had a big role in basic education for the surrounding population. It's not like that anymore.
I do not suggest making priests into teachers, but if the available resources out in hard to reach places, where redirected a little bit I am certain there would be some change.
But no. The responsibility lies with the rich people in this world, education should be a basic human right for everyone. We should not be counted amongst the more intelligent animal species, unless we manage to secure some form of basic insight in physics, science, math and language for every person with functioning eyes and/or ears.
Equal education for all, will eventually lead to equal rights for all: male or female, rich or poor, farmer or politician.
We "intelligent" people of this world, are so clever, we even have the exact same context on closely resembling proverbs, all over this world.
"Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime."
But we cannot, for some reason, live true to our wise words, even when we've probably had clever lines like this for thousands of years, we are not able to live by them.
Instead, we focus on bickering with our neighbours or close ones, cast away and reject people solely in effect of silly "group dynamics" psychology, and strive to the best of our ability to take what we can to secure ourselves.
"Me first, screw everyone else." Seems to be a common mantra.
There's always something to be said about the usefulness of the highly varying quality in school books and teachers, but basic school systems are useful in giving people a slightly more equal chance to deal with and understand the world we live in.
We all have some differences in focus and body chemistry that enables us to have different views and physical abilities, it is important to cherish this, and not see it as some hindrance. If everyone was equal, we would not be able to effectively delegate different tasks to different people. Everyone would be equally useless.
A big part of our great potential lies within our diversity.
... Did I kill another thread?
It was not by intention.
At any rate, I think that if Vegans are Vegans because of various moral reasons, it is based on a lacking and incomplete view of the worlds real problems. That was my point, though perhaps it failed to come across.
And Vegans somehow reinforce certain issues by behaving like some sort of "Moralist Elite", that take focus away from the real problems in this world.
Better to make some small effort in your surrounding environment, to do some small thing where you are, to make the world just a tiny bit better.
It can be a large number of things, but the most important to do anything at all, "the power of example" is the best and strongest influence most of us can make.
And for those around us where "The power of example" may be less effective, we still have the wonderful feeling of "Envy" that can be very effectively utilized, and particularly amongst certain neighbours. I think that perennial plants, fruit trees, berry bushes and just a tiny bit of planning and prepwork can get you far.
Aiming to make the interest for DIY food resurface in my neighbourhood. It already seems to have a modicum of impact. But it has to be relatively low maintenance gardening, as there is the modern problem of "time" being the limiting factor.
Information sharing is paramount in knowing which plants can grow where and how, and books are not always very helpful since they often have a huge list of plants, most of them can be relatively useless, so it is often hard to sift through all the information to get to the gems that suit YOUR environmental surroundings.
So in sum, to make life just a tiny bit more sustainable, I think a modicum of initial effort can help things along nicely, and in the end it will not be a whole lot more work than grocery shopping (remember, you still have to carry the food, and spend time to and from, parking etc.).
If the "Easy way out" is still more tempting, I've found that in many cases if you purchase fruits or berries fresh, to make your own stuff for "shelf life", it is often cheaper than buying the processed end products like jam or lemonade type products. And it tastes a lot better too.
In two to three years, I am hoping to get enough food to avoid grocery stores or shopping in general, 4-6 out of 12 months on average.
Perhaps it is easier to get suggestions if people know what I have and plan to get?
Here's a list of what I have planted this year:
4 Redcurrant bushes
4 various gardening variety Blueberry bushes
1 "Summer Red" Apple tree
Rhubarb
Some "Climbing Spinach" type perennial.
Lovage
There where already some cherry trees, I had to trim away the tops and some branches as it was 15 years overdue... Have to remove some of the smaller trees. Hoping for berries next year.
What I will get/look for:
2 Gooseberry bushes
3 Blackcurrant bushes
Asparagus
Anything else I should look around for? "Low maintenance" and "perennial" being the key objectives.
I also have some very limited amount of knowledge about wild edible plants, and can easily make a salad and find a few herbs to spice things up in 15-20 minutes just looking around in some random area. My reportoire will get boring in a day or two though...
There's also some fun to be had going "mushroom hunting", they are good at hiding, the worlds largest living organisms.
It was not by intention.
At any rate, I think that if Vegans are Vegans because of various moral reasons, it is based on a lacking and incomplete view of the worlds real problems. That was my point, though perhaps it failed to come across.
And Vegans somehow reinforce certain issues by behaving like some sort of "Moralist Elite", that take focus away from the real problems in this world.
Better to make some small effort in your surrounding environment, to do some small thing where you are, to make the world just a tiny bit better.
It can be a large number of things, but the most important to do anything at all, "the power of example" is the best and strongest influence most of us can make.
And for those around us where "The power of example" may be less effective, we still have the wonderful feeling of "Envy" that can be very effectively utilized, and particularly amongst certain neighbours. I think that perennial plants, fruit trees, berry bushes and just a tiny bit of planning and prepwork can get you far.
Aiming to make the interest for DIY food resurface in my neighbourhood. It already seems to have a modicum of impact. But it has to be relatively low maintenance gardening, as there is the modern problem of "time" being the limiting factor.
Information sharing is paramount in knowing which plants can grow where and how, and books are not always very helpful since they often have a huge list of plants, most of them can be relatively useless, so it is often hard to sift through all the information to get to the gems that suit YOUR environmental surroundings.
So in sum, to make life just a tiny bit more sustainable, I think a modicum of initial effort can help things along nicely, and in the end it will not be a whole lot more work than grocery shopping (remember, you still have to carry the food, and spend time to and from, parking etc.).
If the "Easy way out" is still more tempting, I've found that in many cases if you purchase fruits or berries fresh, to make your own stuff for "shelf life", it is often cheaper than buying the processed end products like jam or lemonade type products. And it tastes a lot better too.
In two to three years, I am hoping to get enough food to avoid grocery stores or shopping in general, 4-6 out of 12 months on average.
Perhaps it is easier to get suggestions if people know what I have and plan to get?
Here's a list of what I have planted this year:
4 Redcurrant bushes
4 various gardening variety Blueberry bushes
1 "Summer Red" Apple tree
Rhubarb
Some "Climbing Spinach" type perennial.
Lovage
There where already some cherry trees, I had to trim away the tops and some branches as it was 15 years overdue... Have to remove some of the smaller trees. Hoping for berries next year.
What I will get/look for:
2 Gooseberry bushes
3 Blackcurrant bushes
Asparagus
Anything else I should look around for? "Low maintenance" and "perennial" being the key objectives.
I also have some very limited amount of knowledge about wild edible plants, and can easily make a salad and find a few herbs to spice things up in 15-20 minutes just looking around in some random area. My reportoire will get boring in a day or two though...
There's also some fun to be had going "mushroom hunting", they are good at hiding, the worlds largest living organisms.
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... Or given birth to a gardening thread!
I wonder if a higher percentage of vegans grow their own fruit and vegetables compared to the general population?
I have grape vines in my back yard. No idea where they came from! Just started growing on a dying tree a few years back.
Around here sweet corn takes regular watering but by staggering planting I should have 6 weeks of fresh corn.
Potatoes are easy to grow and around here have high yields.
My strawberries require watering of they don't do well.
My try at blueberries failed. Put them near my property edge and someone drove over them.
My basement garden is under LED grow lights and my second planting seems to be going poorly! So I will need to experiment a bit more.
Around here sweet corn takes regular watering but by staggering planting I should have 6 weeks of fresh corn.
Potatoes are easy to grow and around here have high yields.
My strawberries require watering of they don't do well.
My try at blueberries failed. Put them near my property edge and someone drove over them.
My basement garden is under LED grow lights and my second planting seems to be going poorly! So I will need to experiment a bit more.
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