Congratulations my dear friend Carlos for another nice, relatively simple but very likely reliable and good sounding design. Just continue with your work... you "amp-monster"!🙂
Thank you very much dear Bora..nice support from you
Your acceptance of my amplifier design seems to me alike to receive a prize... a golden medal.
Thank you... i do not know how to produce that wonderfull sound stage and focus your amplifiers can reproduce but i am trying hard to improve my amplifiers.
regards,
Carlos
Your acceptance of my amplifier design seems to me alike to receive a prize... a golden medal.
Thank you... i do not know how to produce that wonderfull sound stage and focus your amplifiers can reproduce but i am trying hard to improve my amplifiers.
regards,
Carlos
I have found as a very good idea not to place part numbers into the board Alex
I see that you have engaged the brain on that...as the final schematic is beeing produced and may be published today or tomorrow.
the schematic has some part numbers we are discussing about.... and something may change a little...even the presence of part numbers is beeing discussed as this will not be sold as kit...this will be offered to DIY audio community, for free, and they do not need to know (not too much) if 100 ohms into the differential emitter is R2, or R4, or R232.... they need to know it is a 100 ohms 1/4 watts resistance...only this is needed.
Of course... if some problem happens.... to refer to R2 into the place to talk about that resistance alike:
- "that 100 ohms resistance soldered into the emitter of the first transistors into the differential pair"..
Of course...the above information is worse...but the mess into the board, having values and part numbers is terrible too.
I am discussing that with Todd Johnson and i would be happy to know your opinnion about that Alex mm.
regards,
Carlos
I see that you have engaged the brain on that...as the final schematic is beeing produced and may be published today or tomorrow.
the schematic has some part numbers we are discussing about.... and something may change a little...even the presence of part numbers is beeing discussed as this will not be sold as kit...this will be offered to DIY audio community, for free, and they do not need to know (not too much) if 100 ohms into the differential emitter is R2, or R4, or R232.... they need to know it is a 100 ohms 1/4 watts resistance...only this is needed.
Of course... if some problem happens.... to refer to R2 into the place to talk about that resistance alike:
- "that 100 ohms resistance soldered into the emitter of the first transistors into the differential pair"..
Of course...the above information is worse...but the mess into the board, having values and part numbers is terrible too.
I am discussing that with Todd Johnson and i would be happy to know your opinnion about that Alex mm.
regards,
Carlos
As I mentioned in email, I think part numbers are more important for the schematic, for conversations and questions, than they are for PCBs. Values are good for PCBs as long as they don't change, and as long as there are NO mistakes.
Alex's PCB layout uses different parts configurations than the schematic, so I would NOT use part numbers for the PCB. For example, the rail capacitors are split into sub-groups, as are the output emitter resistors. That makes perfect sense for a PCB, but not necessary for a schematic.
..Todd
Alex's PCB layout uses different parts configurations than the schematic, so I would NOT use part numbers for the PCB. For example, the rail capacitors are split into sub-groups, as are the output emitter resistors. That makes perfect sense for a PCB, but not necessary for a schematic.
..Todd
Please Alex mm, keep your boards without any part number.
This way is better...less confused.
I have never appreciated parts numbers....i think they are an unnecessary step to work.
We have to watch a list to see if R2 is 100 ohms or other value..better to see 100 ohms and install the correct value in place.
Using values into a schematic, and part numbers too...i think is double information, when the value is what matters.
regards,
Carlos
This way is better...less confused.
I have never appreciated parts numbers....i think they are an unnecessary step to work.
We have to watch a list to see if R2 is 100 ohms or other value..better to see 100 ohms and install the correct value in place.
Using values into a schematic, and part numbers too...i think is double information, when the value is what matters.
regards,
Carlos
Todd Johnson have finished the schematic and made the special
kindness to remove the part numbers from the schematic...but he has a sample with part numbers if we find it needed to debugging or some easier communication during debbuging of assembling errors.
I will give him time enougth to post by himself.
regards,
Carlos
kindness to remove the part numbers from the schematic...but he has a sample with part numbers if we find it needed to debugging or some easier communication during debbuging of assembling errors.
I will give him time enougth to post by himself.
regards,
Carlos
Attachments
new PCB , not tested ......
......I have made an new PCB , this time with output transistors in line 🙂 (same side ) , what doo you thing about this ? PSU included with large capacitors , and fast rectifiers mounted with heatsink . http://i28.tinypic.com/29psu1z.jpg or in black and grey http://i31.tinypic.com/11to902.jpg . Regards alex mm
Sorry again my bad english 🙁
......I have made an new PCB , this time with output transistors in line 🙂 (same side ) , what doo you thing about this ? PSU included with large capacitors , and fast rectifiers mounted with heatsink . http://i28.tinypic.com/29psu1z.jpg or in black and grey http://i31.tinypic.com/11to902.jpg . Regards alex mm
Sorry again my bad english 🙁
I think it is great...better than the last one... as expected
The problem, dear Alex mm, is to learn to control ourselves not to create a sittuation alike unfinished melody.... that art work that never finishes.... we can make everything better, so, this second one can be substituted by the third, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh and this way never stops.... please, create some control on you to finish your board creation into the next one, the third one...and this if needed.
Why?
Because we have to offer something stable to builders.... if they perceive we are not stable enougth in our decisions, that something may change tomorrow, so, they will not start to buy parts, buy transformers...they will do nothing.... stopped, just waiting we finish our things here.
Nothing is perfect.... even this one can receive some modifications to be even better, also the next one, and the one that will follow that last next one i have told...this never finishes.... start a neurothical cicle that must have an end.
This board is much better, it is more pretty, more ballanced, more simetrical, more rational, more clever and less DIY...because our communitty use to make amplifiers and supplies in different boards... separated boards...so...this approach, the supply into the board, is LESS FASHION, less normal in our group and looks comercial amplifiers, where they put everything together into a board to reduce costs and to have less parts into their inventory..well...to make things cheaper....not exactly what we need...to do exactly alike Professional do...we can make even better...we do not have their limits...the cost limits, the size limits... to acomplish some task, something from the Philosophic High Management Staff.... we are doing for ourselves, to home use, and we want the best possible, following some rules (fashion... cultural things, uses, tradition) of our own environment (our forum).
Keep this one as option, and offer the black and white line...but take care into that...to be sure this will be good for DIY audio communitty you will have to build all boards you offer...so...if you offer 15 boards, you may have to build to give folks the guarantee of reliability...if not, your name, and my name will be sent to trash.
BTW, tell me please, what is your age dear Alex.
Congratulations by your board...but please.....this is excelent, but need big, long heatsink...this may be a limiting factor.... the first one was good too.... try not to make more than three...and be aware that i will be asking you , continuously, to produce those boards and post pictures to make them " a real thing" to forum folks...so...more boards, more options, means more work, more responsability in front of your forum friends.
In the reality...you can see into the forum history, that boards not tested, no pictures showing they were made and tested into real life, was not accepted by our communitty.... the boards were posted and no one have build.... the boards built, related my work here was the ones Greg Erskine tested, i have tested too...also the HRII that Nordic have tested and i have tested too...and Precision 1.... only the built ones, tested, were something that continued alive..others felt down and entered the back hole of forgot things.
Want to do correct?, want to be remembered?, want to be accepted and to be respected?..do the whole job, produce pcboards design and build them to guarantee folks the board are correct and will not cause any problem.
Schematic was built, and will be build once again..tested..hard tested..works and works fine and works stable...also sounds good...but each board must be tested.
Big responsability.
Very serious.
Carlos
The problem, dear Alex mm, is to learn to control ourselves not to create a sittuation alike unfinished melody.... that art work that never finishes.... we can make everything better, so, this second one can be substituted by the third, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh and this way never stops.... please, create some control on you to finish your board creation into the next one, the third one...and this if needed.
Why?
Because we have to offer something stable to builders.... if they perceive we are not stable enougth in our decisions, that something may change tomorrow, so, they will not start to buy parts, buy transformers...they will do nothing.... stopped, just waiting we finish our things here.
Nothing is perfect.... even this one can receive some modifications to be even better, also the next one, and the one that will follow that last next one i have told...this never finishes.... start a neurothical cicle that must have an end.
This board is much better, it is more pretty, more ballanced, more simetrical, more rational, more clever and less DIY...because our communitty use to make amplifiers and supplies in different boards... separated boards...so...this approach, the supply into the board, is LESS FASHION, less normal in our group and looks comercial amplifiers, where they put everything together into a board to reduce costs and to have less parts into their inventory..well...to make things cheaper....not exactly what we need...to do exactly alike Professional do...we can make even better...we do not have their limits...the cost limits, the size limits... to acomplish some task, something from the Philosophic High Management Staff.... we are doing for ourselves, to home use, and we want the best possible, following some rules (fashion... cultural things, uses, tradition) of our own environment (our forum).
Keep this one as option, and offer the black and white line...but take care into that...to be sure this will be good for DIY audio communitty you will have to build all boards you offer...so...if you offer 15 boards, you may have to build to give folks the guarantee of reliability...if not, your name, and my name will be sent to trash.
BTW, tell me please, what is your age dear Alex.
Congratulations by your board...but please.....this is excelent, but need big, long heatsink...this may be a limiting factor.... the first one was good too.... try not to make more than three...and be aware that i will be asking you , continuously, to produce those boards and post pictures to make them " a real thing" to forum folks...so...more boards, more options, means more work, more responsability in front of your forum friends.
In the reality...you can see into the forum history, that boards not tested, no pictures showing they were made and tested into real life, was not accepted by our communitty.... the boards were posted and no one have build.... the boards built, related my work here was the ones Greg Erskine tested, i have tested too...also the HRII that Nordic have tested and i have tested too...and Precision 1.... only the built ones, tested, were something that continued alive..others felt down and entered the back hole of forgot things.
Want to do correct?, want to be remembered?, want to be accepted and to be respected?..do the whole job, produce pcboards design and build them to guarantee folks the board are correct and will not cause any problem.
Schematic was built, and will be build once again..tested..hard tested..works and works fine and works stable...also sounds good...but each board must be tested.
Big responsability.
Very serious.
Carlos
Alex,
Your English is very good. Don't be concerned about it.
The PCB looks GREAT.
The problem with putting big power capacitors on the PCB, is that they are heavy and will be hanging horizontally (I presume), putting odd pressure on the PCB. Also, these capacitors come in MANY sizes and shapes (and connections), so my preference would be to mount them in my chassis using P2P wiring.
I really like the transistors in a single row. Very good!
Build it! Discover the problems. 🙂
..Todd
Your English is very good. Don't be concerned about it.
The PCB looks GREAT.
The problem with putting big power capacitors on the PCB, is that they are heavy and will be hanging horizontally (I presume), putting odd pressure on the PCB. Also, these capacitors come in MANY sizes and shapes (and connections), so my preference would be to mount them in my chassis using P2P wiring.
I really like the transistors in a single row. Very good!
Build it! Discover the problems. 🙂
..Todd
Yes TAJ, 100 percent agreement on that
Roger on that!
Roger came from Radio Amateurs and Citizen Band radio...means everything understood, 100 percent clear message received.... means also "it is all rigth"... or "you have agreement"... means "Great".... and "fine"... also was used 10-4 to say the same.... some, now a days truckers, may know that very well.
Means also "afirmative,you've got the point!"
regards,
Carlos
Roger on that!
Roger came from Radio Amateurs and Citizen Band radio...means everything understood, 100 percent clear message received.... means also "it is all rigth"... or "you have agreement"... means "Great".... and "fine"... also was used 10-4 to say the same.... some, now a days truckers, may know that very well.
Means also "afirmative,you've got the point!"
regards,
Carlos
The DC offset adjust trimmer is missing. It should replace one 82R resistor, or connect in series with a smaller resistor.
..Todd
..Todd
Hey Alex,
Nice work. I like the diodes and heatsinking on one side. I'm curious what size this board would be with 12 output transistors like the schamatic?
Anyway, I've been waiting for parts to be delivered for the hrii I've been working on. I went ahead and ordered parts for this amp. I have the right power supply.
I'll get a printer cord in a week or so and I'll be able to do a toner transfer board, if I can figure that out.
I appreciate your work on this. Keep up the good work.
best wishes,
Brian
Nice work. I like the diodes and heatsinking on one side. I'm curious what size this board would be with 12 output transistors like the schamatic?
Anyway, I've been waiting for parts to be delivered for the hrii I've been working on. I went ahead and ordered parts for this amp. I have the right power supply.
I'll get a printer cord in a week or so and I'll be able to do a toner transfer board, if I can figure that out.
I appreciate your work on this. Keep up the good work.
best wishes,
Brian
hi dx,
i am just watching your refresh circuit design but i didn't understand few things.
how much power supply ampare require and whats the watts will be deliver to 8hms? if i apply 60vdc.
how about the bias adjusting as like DX- prec-1....
do we need to adjust the bias?
best regards
michael
i am just watching your refresh circuit design but i didn't understand few things.
how much power supply ampare require and whats the watts will be deliver to 8hms? if i apply 60vdc.
how about the bias adjusting as like DX- prec-1....
do we need to adjust the bias?
best regards
michael
The power is the same.... power depends on the supply voltage
amplifier A, B, C or D, having the same supply voltage, will have almost (more or less) the same power output.
Precision 1 is much more powerfull compared your measurements and thread published.
This one will have the same bias setup adjustment.... the difference is the huge power into 4 ohms, 2 ohms and 1.5 ohms.
Into 8 ohms it is the same power amplifier....modifications were made to face "heavy duty" work for powerholics.
BTW.... i use to produce some amplifier above 100 watts, this may seem i hardly appreciate power...the opposite... i love efficiency, speakers that can work with 5 watts...high sound pressure without too much power....BUT.... Brazilian folks are powerholic, maniac, almost all them...so.... i did this one to those crazy folks.
Using 70 volts supplies you will have sligtly more power compared to the Precision 1..... also it has not too much losses into rail regulators because not using them...this needs bigger and awfull enormous condensers (whale sized) into the boards (I hate that!).
The idea is to give you punch, into low impedance..when people join a lot of speakers and decide to demolish the house or to bother neighboor.... this way.
regards,
Carlos
amplifier A, B, C or D, having the same supply voltage, will have almost (more or less) the same power output.
Precision 1 is much more powerfull compared your measurements and thread published.
This one will have the same bias setup adjustment.... the difference is the huge power into 4 ohms, 2 ohms and 1.5 ohms.
Into 8 ohms it is the same power amplifier....modifications were made to face "heavy duty" work for powerholics.
BTW.... i use to produce some amplifier above 100 watts, this may seem i hardly appreciate power...the opposite... i love efficiency, speakers that can work with 5 watts...high sound pressure without too much power....BUT.... Brazilian folks are powerholic, maniac, almost all them...so.... i did this one to those crazy folks.
Using 70 volts supplies you will have sligtly more power compared to the Precision 1..... also it has not too much losses into rail regulators because not using them...this needs bigger and awfull enormous condensers (whale sized) into the boards (I hate that!).
The idea is to give you punch, into low impedance..when people join a lot of speakers and decide to demolish the house or to bother neighboor.... this way.
regards,
Carlos
HOLD ON! the ones are building DHR!
I have found better solutions, also i have found one weekness...so... during hard testings i have made some modifications.... 5 pairs into the output...the same transistor used into the output is used as drivers too..... diodes as heat sensor are now transistor junction or diodes junction.
The amplifer had operated into full power and 1.5 ohms.
Into 4 ohms...clean sound is near 500 watts... and can go much more if you accept some small distortions (the majority do not perceive that small distortion..when start to clip)
Sorry folks.... sorry Alex mm... and sorry Todd Johnson...but i am trying to unstabilize the amplifier.... as i could unstabilize i am tweaking and now it is stable...but hold on for 24 hours please.
Schematic will be different.... alike this one...but this one will be tweaked a little too.
Wonderfull sound...more reliable.... this is what i am achieving.
relax...wait a minute... this beautifull amplifier is cooking and you will be happy with it.
Carlos
I have found better solutions, also i have found one weekness...so... during hard testings i have made some modifications.... 5 pairs into the output...the same transistor used into the output is used as drivers too..... diodes as heat sensor are now transistor junction or diodes junction.
The amplifer had operated into full power and 1.5 ohms.
Into 4 ohms...clean sound is near 500 watts... and can go much more if you accept some small distortions (the majority do not perceive that small distortion..when start to clip)
Sorry folks.... sorry Alex mm... and sorry Todd Johnson...but i am trying to unstabilize the amplifier.... as i could unstabilize i am tweaking and now it is stable...but hold on for 24 hours please.
Schematic will be different.... alike this one...but this one will be tweaked a little too.
Wonderfull sound...more reliable.... this is what i am achieving.
relax...wait a minute... this beautifull amplifier is cooking and you will be happy with it.
Carlos
Now i am using resistive load...have tried before several speakers in parallel
A sample of this audio goes to the speaker to monitoring.... load smokes a lot...will not show that dirty thing to you now.
Load is 1.5 ohms...and operation is full undistorted power.... more than 700 watts... electric shower wire resistance used...it turns red, almost melted....1.5 ohms is hot resistance, not cold resistance..... of course.
regards,
Carlos
A sample of this audio goes to the speaker to monitoring.... load smokes a lot...will not show that dirty thing to you now.
Load is 1.5 ohms...and operation is full undistorted power.... more than 700 watts... electric shower wire resistance used...it turns red, almost melted....1.5 ohms is hot resistance, not cold resistance..... of course.
regards,
Carlos
Attachments
Huge control of thermal drift is required.
Because of that i am using 4 transistors junction, big ones, attached to the heatsink as heat sensors... as thermal diodes.
Working fine till now.
1 to 3 miliamps stay into the emitter resistances..now 1 ohm each and 5 pairs of transistors into the output.
Huge amplifier..... enormous power... even into 1.5 ohms.....
A Monster!
regards,
Carlos
Because of that i am using 4 transistors junction, big ones, attached to the heatsink as heat sensors... as thermal diodes.
Working fine till now.
1 to 3 miliamps stay into the emitter resistances..now 1 ohm each and 5 pairs of transistors into the output.
Huge amplifier..... enormous power... even into 1.5 ohms.....
A Monster!
regards,
Carlos
Attachments
- Status
- Not open for further replies.