Beryllium Oxide is one of the most dangerous materials used in electronic components. Only when used safely the risks are acceptable in the eyes of some countries. It may come as no surprise that these are the same countries that dump their chemical waste in the 3rd world for some money.
Ok, but what if one buys a Gainclone from you and has it repaired after some years ? The one who repairs it can slip with his screwdriver and then...
This kind of discussion we had before about asbestos. There still are a lot of countries that think the risks are acceptable.
My parents had a friend that drew technical drawings ar a shipswarf. He died of asbestose and never even worked with the stuff. He just walked to his office everyday and passed the workshop.
IMO opinion all these materials should be banned because there are too high risks involved if people don't know what they are working with. There is not a sign on it that says it has Beryllium in it does it ? You know how careless people can be.
Ok, but what if one buys a Gainclone from you and has it repaired after some years ? The one who repairs it can slip with his screwdriver and then...
This kind of discussion we had before about asbestos. There still are a lot of countries that think the risks are acceptable.
My parents had a friend that drew technical drawings ar a shipswarf. He died of asbestose and never even worked with the stuff. He just walked to his office everyday and passed the workshop.
IMO opinion all these materials should be banned because there are too high risks involved if people don't know what they are working with. There is not a sign on it that says it has Beryllium in it does it ? You know how careless people can be.
At the risk of repeating, here is some of the info found at:
http://www.hostboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=3729&t=114
Beryllium's dangers
"Beryllium is a gray metal lighter than aluminum but stiffer than steel. It is used to make other metals stronger and more resistant to bending. It makes golf clubs harder, bicycle frames lighter and nuclear weapons more powerful.
"The metal is so toxic that in 1949 the government adopted a maximum exposure limit of 2 micrograms per cubic meter of air over eight hours. That is the equivalent of pulverizing a beryllium marble and dispersing it into the air six feet high over one square mile.
"Last year (1999), the Department of Energy concluded that the standard should be only one-tenth that amount. But there was no standard at all in the early 1940's, when beryllium became an element vital to the nation's nuclear weapons program. And it was used in Kansas City from the time the plant began making nuclear weapons components in 1949.
"The greatest danger comes from breathing beryllium dust. So those most at risk are the craftsmen who drilled, ground and shaped beryllium-copper alloys into the parts that make warheads work. The metal included about 2 percent beryllium to add strength to the copper.
"But other workers -- including hundreds of people who tested, inspected or processed beryllium copper alloys at the Kansas City plant -- could have been exposed, Energy Department officials said.
"Because people react differently to beryllium, even incidental exposure to the metal's dust can trigger the disease in some people.
"At other weapons plants, some secretaries, security guards and others who never handled beryllium were diagnosed with CBD. Even some women whose only contact with the dust was through handling their husbands' dirty work clothes came down with the disease.
"CBD is particularly insidious because it often does not show up for 10 to 30 years after exposure, government researchers said. That means even people who originally test negative to beryllium sensitivity can become sensitive years after the last exposure.
'Some people develop the sensitivity within months of exposure,'(I got sick immediately - TWW) Cragle said. 'Others won't show sensitivity for more than 20 years. ... We have no idea how long after sensitivity that a person will develop CBD. Those data are just now being gathered.'
http://www.hostboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=3729&t=114
Beryllium's dangers
"Beryllium is a gray metal lighter than aluminum but stiffer than steel. It is used to make other metals stronger and more resistant to bending. It makes golf clubs harder, bicycle frames lighter and nuclear weapons more powerful.
"The metal is so toxic that in 1949 the government adopted a maximum exposure limit of 2 micrograms per cubic meter of air over eight hours. That is the equivalent of pulverizing a beryllium marble and dispersing it into the air six feet high over one square mile.
"Last year (1999), the Department of Energy concluded that the standard should be only one-tenth that amount. But there was no standard at all in the early 1940's, when beryllium became an element vital to the nation's nuclear weapons program. And it was used in Kansas City from the time the plant began making nuclear weapons components in 1949.
"The greatest danger comes from breathing beryllium dust. So those most at risk are the craftsmen who drilled, ground and shaped beryllium-copper alloys into the parts that make warheads work. The metal included about 2 percent beryllium to add strength to the copper.
"But other workers -- including hundreds of people who tested, inspected or processed beryllium copper alloys at the Kansas City plant -- could have been exposed, Energy Department officials said.
"Because people react differently to beryllium, even incidental exposure to the metal's dust can trigger the disease in some people.
"At other weapons plants, some secretaries, security guards and others who never handled beryllium were diagnosed with CBD. Even some women whose only contact with the dust was through handling their husbands' dirty work clothes came down with the disease.
"CBD is particularly insidious because it often does not show up for 10 to 30 years after exposure, government researchers said. That means even people who originally test negative to beryllium sensitivity can become sensitive years after the last exposure.
'Some people develop the sensitivity within months of exposure,'(I got sick immediately - TWW) Cragle said. 'Others won't show sensitivity for more than 20 years. ... We have no idea how long after sensitivity that a person will develop CBD. Those data are just now being gathered.'
... I know how careless i was when i was 12-16. I unsoldered my parts from dozens of old TVs and radios. And the greatest you can get in this situation is old computer stuff from university labs etc. I don´t know how much toxic stuff i inhalated that days...
I quote Aavid Thermalloy again:
>Beryllium oxide is chemically inert and completely safe to use in its fired state. Handling of finished parts presents absolutely no health hazards.
Beryllium oxide,however, is toxic when dust, mist or fumes containing particles small enough to enter the lungs are inhaled.<
I tried to grind beryllium oxide washer, and there was absolutely no dust produced. The material is ceramic like, it got red hot, but I couldn't shave off any material. The same goes for trying to scratch it with a screwdriver. Anyway, it is always covered with thermal paste, so how anybody can inhale the particles?
>Beryllium oxide is chemically inert and completely safe to use in its fired state. Handling of finished parts presents absolutely no health hazards.
Beryllium oxide,however, is toxic when dust, mist or fumes containing particles small enough to enter the lungs are inhaled.<
I tried to grind beryllium oxide washer, and there was absolutely no dust produced. The material is ceramic like, it got red hot, but I couldn't shave off any material. The same goes for trying to scratch it with a screwdriver. Anyway, it is always covered with thermal paste, so how anybody can inhale the particles?
The risk itself should be enough to refrain from using it. You only need 1 or 2 microgram in your lungs to die. It will oxidise in your lungs and then the toxidity is at its best. ( or worst actually ).
That's why it is forbidden for a long time now in Europe.
BTW I don't know Aavid Thermaloy but is there a chance they are the ones that produce the poison ?
That's why it is forbidden for a long time now in Europe.
BTW I don't know Aavid Thermaloy but is there a chance they are the ones that produce the poison ?
So one can assume that a ban on cigarettes will be coming to Europe eventually as well. Not that I oppose to that.😉
But I was surprised seeing people smoking inside European airports, something that is unacceptable in Canada.
But I was surprised seeing people smoking inside European airports, something that is unacceptable in Canada.
Maybe there will be a ban on cigarettes. Maybe we will have that same stupid thing like in the USA that it is forbidden to smoke outside in some cities.
...But since I smoke myself I can tell that I choose to smoke and I am very well aware what risks are involved.
I think the Beryllium thing is something else. Probably most people that became ill from BeO only learnt the risks afterwards. They did not have an opportunity to choose...
Please don't advise people to use this stuff or to recommend it.
Alu Oxide, Mica or even silicone sheets are really good enough for a DIY amp. We're not building space gear here. That 0.1 degree difference that it makes, we will survive that.
Recommending it will create demand and production will continue.
No demand means no production and more research for environmental acceptable materials.
...But since I smoke myself I can tell that I choose to smoke and I am very well aware what risks are involved.
I think the Beryllium thing is something else. Probably most people that became ill from BeO only learnt the risks afterwards. They did not have an opportunity to choose...
Please don't advise people to use this stuff or to recommend it.
Alu Oxide, Mica or even silicone sheets are really good enough for a DIY amp. We're not building space gear here. That 0.1 degree difference that it makes, we will survive that.
Recommending it will create demand and production will continue.
No demand means no production and more research for environmental acceptable materials.
yea, coming back to diy audio
Hmm. I don´t want to criticize with the following statement. I´m not able to hear differences in different power cords, caps, resistors.
I´m able to hear difference between different speakers and listen room situations. (door window open or closed, where speakers are placed etc)
I don´t belive the device makes a differnce - not with the SE class A amps. 2 amperes DC are 2 amperes DC - no matter what kind and how many cables and transformers between power station and amp.
If i want to make tests on this my experience until now says i need to complete the new speakers - see my forgotten horn thread - Nelson needs to publish the active XO , so i could biamp, best if i complete the ax for the TL1601a, and i need my new listening room under the roof, 2 years of work.
If there is a difference maybe i will dicover then. I will make a 3*230V 2,5mm^2 Cu cable to the new listening room - so i´m able to make 3 phase power supplys for the next generation of amps.
Hmm. I don´t want to criticize with the following statement. I´m not able to hear differences in different power cords, caps, resistors.
I´m able to hear difference between different speakers and listen room situations. (door window open or closed, where speakers are placed etc)
I don´t belive the device makes a differnce - not with the SE class A amps. 2 amperes DC are 2 amperes DC - no matter what kind and how many cables and transformers between power station and amp.
If i want to make tests on this my experience until now says i need to complete the new speakers - see my forgotten horn thread - Nelson needs to publish the active XO , so i could biamp, best if i complete the ax for the TL1601a, and i need my new listening room under the roof, 2 years of work.
If there is a difference maybe i will dicover then. I will make a 3*230V 2,5mm^2 Cu cable to the new listening room - so i´m able to make 3 phase power supplys for the next generation of amps.
This statement can´t be true in every case. Different amplifiers work in very different ways. It may be the device has influence on some amplifier types. But if so, there will be a difference of this influence if different amplifier topologies are used.
btw, i don´t belive anyone can hear. This can change at the moment i hear it, but not earlyer. And : i belive the influence of the type of glass used on the window of the listening room is more important. (no joke)
Regarding the 'Class A' mods. I removed my 1.5 K resistor to hear the difference again. I do not really know what's better. With resistor the sound is warmer and without the sound is more lively...
(always those choices...)
Echo echo...
(always those choices...)
Echo echo...
awesome
Man, this thread has an awesome quantity/ quality and diversity of information!
I was colecting idata on GC paciently over a year and now in a matter of days, this information is condensed here from theory of inverting gizmos to insolator and heat radiation.
I think the only data I still need is a not very expensive brand of caps to use betwwen the GC and the fragile mid horns and tweeters I use. It was suggested the audiocap. Anyone can provide a source in the US market for this? Or any substitution?
Cheers
Ric--amazed
Man, this thread has an awesome quantity/ quality and diversity of information!
I was colecting idata on GC paciently over a year and now in a matter of days, this information is condensed here from theory of inverting gizmos to insolator and heat radiation.
I think the only data I still need is a not very expensive brand of caps to use betwwen the GC and the fragile mid horns and tweeters I use. It was suggested the audiocap. Anyone can provide a source in the US market for this? Or any substitution?
Cheers
Ric--amazed
Re: awesome
--Jordan
EDIT: ya know, I was looking on the audience-av page, and it seems there's a nice discount for bulk orders of auricaps.. Would anyone be intersted in doing a group-buy wiki type thing for them? Just a thought...
Auricap (not audiocap). You can get them from partsconnexion in Canada, or from Michael Percy in the US.Ricren said:
--Jordan
EDIT: ya know, I was looking on the audience-av page, and it seems there's a nice discount for bulk orders of auricaps.. Would anyone be intersted in doing a group-buy wiki type thing for them? Just a thought...
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