Agree time fly away in it was friday 02. December 2016 so in few months 4 years ago our good host served warm tower coffee and splendid acoustic performance..
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I came here as soon as I saw the news.
Very sad indeed. Many parties were attended with Van Halen playing ... Loud!
When I was in High School you had a lot of hard core metal heads who
worshiped bands like Metallica. I was more in the classic rock crowed.
Then there were the pop rock people who liked Michael Jackson & more
modern rock bands. Rap was new but just starting to catch on. WE ALL
AGREED that Van Halen was good music. Van Halen brought us all
together, so it was a safe party play. EVERYONE would like hearing Van
Halen. We need to find more things that bring us together!
I just listened to a remixed version of the Eddie Solo titled
Eruption...it's beautiful. How many guitar players did that inspire?
If you have never paid Van Halen much attention, start with 1984, every
song was good on that album. Eddie played on the Michael Jacks on
Thriller Album. Listen for his sound and influence there.
I'd say let's have a moment of silence for Eddie, but he would rather we
PLAY IT LOUD for him.
worshiped bands like Metallica. I was more in the classic rock crowed.
Then there were the pop rock people who liked Michael Jackson & more
modern rock bands. Rap was new but just starting to catch on. WE ALL
AGREED that Van Halen was good music. Van Halen brought us all
together, so it was a safe party play. EVERYONE would like hearing Van
Halen. We need to find more things that bring us together!
I just listened to a remixed version of the Eddie Solo titled
Eruption...it's beautiful. How many guitar players did that inspire?
If you have never paid Van Halen much attention, start with 1984, every
song was good on that album. Eddie played on the Michael Jacks on
Thriller Album. Listen for his sound and influence there.
I'd say let's have a moment of silence for Eddie, but he would rather we
PLAY IT LOUD for him.
There is never a bad place to share the passing of a great artist.
"The flame that burns twice as bright burns half as long." - Lao Tzu.
One of the video clips that stuck with me was from an interview back in the early 90's where he laid it out that the music wasn't a job to him, it was what he loved to do. Spending a life doing what you love to do is a good lesson for all of us.
RIP, Eddie.
-b
Hey, what's with the Fostex boxes? Get them outta there
Haha, those were a hand-carried gift from me to Byrtt, so don’t blame Byrtt or Wesayso!
I actually have several Fostex. They do have their place.
FF85WK enabled, FF105WK, and Radio Shack 40-1197 or FE103 equivalent. Those old ones are nice sounding!
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I did that once, as a virtual audition. Just for fun I might add. It gave the opportunity to compare the arrays to 2 JBL videos from Kendrick Audio, a firm that used to post a lot of videos but apparently they are gone?
In no way does this clip show off my musical taste (lol). The song was chosen to compare it to both of those big JBL setups, too bad time has erased those videos.
Original link: https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/242171-towers-25-driver-range-line-array-92.html#post4269420
This was done a long time ago, about a year later I knew much more about processing (lol). It might give at least an impression but don't take it too seriously.
I can't remember the exact JBL models, but it was something like this:
gmad, Thanks! It is fun! just spent some time listening to my room on my headphones. I'll post a clip when I get new measurements because I changed the downward slope that this measurement has with about 2 dB less downward slope and removed the bump I had in the bass. But it did let me enjoy a comparison to 2 youtube videos I liked quite a while ago.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1tWyOGaylY
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T09m0IqSV10
2 very different speakers with very different sound
But I got the track to see if I could get near to the big ones in bass.
That goal was for my Car by the way
Ah, what the heck, I'll just post this one first, I'll notify when I change the song to the latest spec of my arrays
www.rsr-concepts.com/diyma/linesample.m4a
Right click download and saveas as I'm not sure my server will stream it, it's a full 6 minute aac file @ 350kb/s
Song convolved with left and right IR response as measured at the listening position. I did throw in standard Crossfeed as defined in JRiver.
In no way does this clip show off my musical taste (lol). The song was chosen to compare it to both of those big JBL setups, too bad time has erased those videos.
Original link: https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/242171-towers-25-driver-range-line-array-92.html#post4269420
This was done a long time ago, about a year later I knew much more about processing (lol). It might give at least an impression but don't take it too seriously.
I can't remember the exact JBL models, but it was something like this:
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I see now it actually was one JBL setup and an Avantgarde Nano.
The video still exists here: Avantgarde NANO - KENRICK SOUND jbl43 – Видео Dailymotion
The video still exists here: Avantgarde NANO - KENRICK SOUND jbl43 – Видео Dailymotion
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Hi - I read through this thread some years ago with much interest, but coming back to it now. I presently run LX521's, but really what I want is an even wider sweet spot, yet still maintaining the soundstage and imaging (to be fair LX mini did this better than LX521 in my recollection, but is SPL limited). I have experience with point source, but not with how line arrays image/soundstage.
Thanks you so much for the great summary on Vandermill-Audio – A DIY journey into audio
Can you summarize where you are at with dsp, and are the files shared somewhere so the project can be replicated. Could maybe a link be added to the first post or on your website?
Are you still using JRiver and just the single stereo amplifier (with the subs powered separately)?
Thanks you so much for the great summary on Vandermill-Audio – A DIY journey into audio
Can you summarize where you are at with dsp, and are the files shared somewhere so the project can be replicated. Could maybe a link be added to the first post or on your website?
Are you still using JRiver and just the single stereo amplifier (with the subs powered separately)?
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I think fluid would be at a better place to answer this question than I am, as he has experienced the LX521 and line arrays. He even started with the original Orions.
While the arrays are still powered by a Stereo amp, I do consider my ambient setup (2x full range Scan Speak 10F behind listening position powered by their own stereo amplifier) as part of it all, together with the separately powered subwoofers.
I'm still using JRiver + a number of plugins to work with the 6 channels. I did post my DSP templates a long time ago and shared more recent versions among other line array users. You'd get the same deal from me, a private exchange of files, either from me or I'm pretty sure from one of the other line array afiniciado's. I feel like we are trying to help out each other out to advance our hobby. I think none of them is running exactly what I have, and my templates are always a moving target anyway.
I do a lot of experiments with my setup, I have to start over soon, after a living room renovation. It has become quite complicated when looked upon on first sight, but it didn't start out that way.
DRC-FIR is still the base for my DSP together with the build in DSP of JRiver. But on top of that I run some psychoacoustic trickery (Either mid/side EQ or cross talk cancellation) to get even better results. The room treatment, in my case 3 big panels, is also an integral part of my success.
Currently, beside upgrading my room, the arrays will get a frequency dependent shading on their top end, making them deviate from the full range straight array I have been using for the past ~5+ years. No telling what the outcome of that will be, though the sims do look promising:
The current unshaded array with an arbitrary amount of floor and ceiling reflection added:
Compared to the frequency shaded array with the same amount of floor and ceiling reflections:
The middle graph on the left shows the in-room prediction in orange. The improvement is there for the entire bandwidth, but especially on the top end.
The red line is the Directivity Index.
Another comparison, this time to a single TC9 in room with about an equal amount of power supplied:
Same floor and ceiling conditions applied here...
The difference between the top two is this second proposal has passive networks that shade the outer drivers in groups, the further they are away from the (ideal) listening height/axis.
I've already build the needed passive components:
All that I need now is time to get them inside the enclosures. The arrays are parked in my garage and waiting for me to operate on them.
No predictions from my side if this will be a valid upgrade, the sims tell me it will be worthwhile. Time will tell and it should be reversible if it doesn't work out.
That's the trouble with my project, it's in my nature to see if I can advance, learn more and get an even better result. That's why this thread has become monstrously long and impossible to get trough.
The results have been very satisfactory without these plans in place. I'm just curious enough to see if this could make it another step up from what I had.
I'm just wired that way, the punishment is that I will have to listen to a lot of music, keep myself busy and get to enjoy this process. What's not to like?
While the arrays are still powered by a Stereo amp, I do consider my ambient setup (2x full range Scan Speak 10F behind listening position powered by their own stereo amplifier) as part of it all, together with the separately powered subwoofers.
I'm still using JRiver + a number of plugins to work with the 6 channels. I did post my DSP templates a long time ago and shared more recent versions among other line array users. You'd get the same deal from me, a private exchange of files, either from me or I'm pretty sure from one of the other line array afiniciado's. I feel like we are trying to help out each other out to advance our hobby. I think none of them is running exactly what I have, and my templates are always a moving target anyway.
I do a lot of experiments with my setup, I have to start over soon, after a living room renovation. It has become quite complicated when looked upon on first sight, but it didn't start out that way.
DRC-FIR is still the base for my DSP together with the build in DSP of JRiver. But on top of that I run some psychoacoustic trickery (Either mid/side EQ or cross talk cancellation) to get even better results. The room treatment, in my case 3 big panels, is also an integral part of my success.
Currently, beside upgrading my room, the arrays will get a frequency dependent shading on their top end, making them deviate from the full range straight array I have been using for the past ~5+ years. No telling what the outcome of that will be, though the sims do look promising:
The current unshaded array with an arbitrary amount of floor and ceiling reflection added:
Compared to the frequency shaded array with the same amount of floor and ceiling reflections:
The middle graph on the left shows the in-room prediction in orange. The improvement is there for the entire bandwidth, but especially on the top end.
The red line is the Directivity Index.
Another comparison, this time to a single TC9 in room with about an equal amount of power supplied:
Same floor and ceiling conditions applied here...
The difference between the top two is this second proposal has passive networks that shade the outer drivers in groups, the further they are away from the (ideal) listening height/axis.
I've already build the needed passive components:
All that I need now is time to get them inside the enclosures. The arrays are parked in my garage and waiting for me to operate on them.
No predictions from my side if this will be a valid upgrade, the sims tell me it will be worthwhile. Time will tell and it should be reversible if it doesn't work out.
That's the trouble with my project, it's in my nature to see if I can advance, learn more and get an even better result. That's why this thread has become monstrously long and impossible to get trough
.The results have been very satisfactory without these plans in place. I'm just curious enough to see if this could make it another step up from what I had.
I'm just wired that way, the punishment is that I will have to listen to a lot of music, keep myself busy and get to enjoy this process. What's not to like?
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Maybe, I am not as much of a soundstage imaging aficionado as you, but these days I am getting there.
I only ever listen in one position so I can't really speak to as to how wide the sweet spot is as regards imaging in my current setup, and I had little interest in it while I had the LX521's or Orion's.
What I can say is that controlling the first reflections and toeing the speakers in more towards the listening position has given me a totally new perspective on imaging and with the right source material (Tool's Chocolate Chip trip for example) the position and movement of images is amazing.
An array like this is not a plug and play speaker. If you build one wesayso or any of the other array tweakers can help get you in the ball park but they need a lot of measuring and tinkering to sound their best, and some of that comes down to your own personal taste.
They do not respond like a traditional speaker where someone can make a semi anechoic measurement to set it up and it will then sound somewhat similar in any other room if placed sensibly. An array needs and can work with the room, so each installation is a new setup entirely.
wesayso and I are going to have to do that again as we have both destroyed and rebuilt our rooms differently
I got a request in PM for the 3D model I made of the Vifa TC9 FD18-08. I've had similar requests before and made a "branded" version to share.
On the magnet and basket spokes it will read: Vandermill Audio
Hope you guys will keep that embossed in there and not just run away with my work
Here's the model: http://www.rsr-concepts.com/diyma/Vifa-Branded.zip
Hi Wesayso,
I just downloaded the model - beautiful work! Thank you for providing this model to the community. Detail down to the braided wire and suspension.
Cheers,
X
Let me clarify it a little more. My original domain is rsr-concepts.com, that is where I store my uploads and my vandermill-audio.nl redirects to that domain, see:
vandermill-audio.nl and:
Vandermill-Audio – A DIY journey into audio
Which are exactly the same. However the rsr-concepts domain does have a SSL certificate, the vandermill-audio.nl does not. As it simply is a redirect.
As the download does point at rsr-concepts.com I did not expect a warning or blockage.
vandermill-audio.nl and:
Vandermill-Audio – A DIY journey into audio
Which are exactly the same. However the rsr-concepts domain does have a SSL certificate, the vandermill-audio.nl does not. As it simply is a redirect.
As the download does point at rsr-concepts.com I did not expect a warning or blockage.