well, you can count on scott wurcer to keep on talking to use as if we were 5yo kids...I had no ideas haters and naysayers could kill a thread, I thought mods were here to avoid exactly that. anyway, yeah we're not potential nobel prize winners
I work with electronics and let's say a customer has a problem with a circuit. I go there replace one part and test, this without consulting the schematic. When the day is done and I write my report I will come to very certain conclusions. I would be laughed at, that's for sure.
Scott is right here. If you have a circuit and a pcb, you can't take an opamp, put it there and really believe that it will work at it's optimum and from that draw conclusions. Some opamps may consume more power, more sensitive against capacitive load and lot's of other phenomena.
For fun and as a hobby you can test different opamps and perhaps notice differences but you must take this less serious.
Andrea: LT1028 really sucks. it's the worse opamp ever made.
Hi Andrea,
Hmmm... so in some way's we do actually think alike (that's a scary thought)
Forgetting opamps for the moment, and talking about the way the music "sounds" when reproduced at home, I agree with what you say about having the "odd" reference CD that sounds really good versus the rest of your collection.
This point really hit home to me with my latest amp, after listening to many over the years, after buying commecrcial products on the strength of technical excellence, after building so called "blameless" designs etc etc. And they all had one thing in common to a greater or lesser extent... some recordings (not many) sounded "good" (the so called demonstration recordings) but far far more sounded much less so, boring I would describe it as, no depth, no feeling. And this amp turned all that on it's head... suddenly I was listening to music, now 95% of my CD's sound wonderful... you can really hear what the music is about... it encourages you to listen more, to different music.
It's so hard to describe and yet so obvious when you hear it. It even sounds fairly good with DAB radio at 192kbs. It's both revealing in that it lets you hear all that is on the recording, yet it seems to do something "magical" to the sound at the same time.
So in that regard I do understand that you genuinely hear differences.
Where I differ is that I don't think you can say that opamp A is better than opamp B as a general statement. It depends so much on the individual application.
Hmmm... so in some way's we do actually think alike (that's a scary thought
) Forgetting opamps for the moment, and talking about the way the music "sounds" when reproduced at home, I agree with what you say about having the "odd" reference CD that sounds really good versus the rest of your collection.
This point really hit home to me with my latest amp, after listening to many over the years, after buying commecrcial products on the strength of technical excellence, after building so called "blameless" designs etc etc. And they all had one thing in common to a greater or lesser extent... some recordings (not many) sounded "good" (the so called demonstration recordings) but far far more sounded much less so, boring I would describe it as, no depth, no feeling. And this amp turned all that on it's head... suddenly I was listening to music, now 95% of my CD's sound wonderful... you can really hear what the music is about... it encourages you to listen more, to different music.
It's so hard to describe and yet so obvious when you hear it. It even sounds fairly good with DAB radio at 192kbs. It's both revealing in that it lets you hear all that is on the recording, yet it seems to do something "magical" to the sound at the same time.
So in that regard I do understand that you genuinely hear differences.
Where I differ is that I don't think you can say that opamp A is better than opamp B as a general statement. It depends so much on the individual application.
Well, you still have to restrict the otherwise infinite possible choices don't you? Many popular (in forums), jewel-like opamps, just don't sound natural per se, for my ears - I'd prefer to listen through an NE5532 to using them alone.
I guess I don't clearly know what I like the most, but I surely know what I like the least.
But I always stay open to exceptions. For instance, I don't dream of pretending that that 20000 euro CD player with an OPA627BP in the signal path won't sound good...
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In the end, the OPA627 sounds like its name's numbers just as everything else. Even though there are more and less favorable number associations, and 6-2-7 sure isn't the most inviting ever, in the practical use of an opamp it all comes down to the synergy (sonic I mean) with the rest - an idea that this numerical thing would provide one objective foundation to, no?
only annoying ppl take themselves seriously, we definitely don't...and you got that right, it's fun as a hobby.
so that's how wars start
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this thread should definitely be locked, we are turning good members into believers
What is it you don't like? I haven't heard it myself.LT1028 really sucks. it's the worse opamp ever made.
That makes sense to me, Dane, as my application is a low frequency equalizer that comes into play mostly below 1kHz, and rolls off above that point. So treble anomalies really shouldn't come into play very much in my application. The high frequencies bypass the opamp completely. I do love the bass and mids from the 827, however. They are very clear and dynamic compared to the other opamps I have tried. I tried to stay with Fet-input opamps since that's what was in the original design.
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Andrea: LT1028 really sucks. it's the worse opamp ever made.
My DAC (Zhaolu D3 - also using CS4398) came with a pair of LT1028CN8, it sounded crap right from the start and within days I decided to just bypass it, and it was a huge improvement - with the op-amps the sound was constricted, harsh, and as if it was trying to output a lot of but poor quality highs and bass, without the op-amp it sounded much more natural, and better bass control and impact at the same time.
And I wasn't the only one thinking that way - when I brought it to a DAC shoot-out another person who heard the D3 unmodded was suprised at how good mine sounded.
I didn't have the heart to tell this to break the threadstarter's heart nor did I had any interest of participating in such a self-satisfying thread, but the easy and obvious reason would be that the different circuits in which the op-amp is used affect how the final sound will be like, which is what many have been trying to tell the threadstarter since around the start of this thread, yet apparently threadstarter is not open-minded enough to consider. Or should I say, too-open-minded that everybody else is just too closed-minded for their opinions to be worth considering.
Oh my... I'm sorry for you! It must hurt. This makes you a unique, anyway. Either you, or your DAC.
Don't you think that what you have bypassed is the entire, unnecessary output buffer stage (because if I'm not wrong the D3 has already an opamp to unbalance the output of the CS4398)? It must've been very much screwed up...
No, seriously... you can't come tell me that the LT1028 is rubbish, when I've tried all the countless opamps I've tried... especially, you can't pretend to be taken seriously by me when you describe it exactly as the opposite to what I've always heard so far from this chip (in two different DACs and in a "cmoy").
BTW, what are all these bad feelings around someone else's non-standard opamp judgments? Has the globalization of thought really reached this degree? Oh my...it would be a nightmare.
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Do not take yourself so seriously...it doesn't do good to you.
We're just having fun (well, we were).
Oh my... I'm sorry for you! It must hurt. This makes you a unique, anyway. Either you, or your DAC.
Don't you think that what you have bypassed is the entire, unnecessary output buffer stage (because if I'm not wrong the D3 has already an opamp to unbalance the output of the CS4398)? It must've been very much screwed up...
No, seriously... you can't come tell me that the LT1028 is rubbish, when I've tried all the countless opamps I've tried... especially, you can't pretend to be taken seriously by me when you describe it exactly as the opposite to what I've always heard so far from this chip (in two different DACs and in a "cmoy").
BTW, what are all these bad feelings around someone else's non-standard opamp judgments? Has the globalization of thought really reached this degree? Oh my...it would be a nightmare.
Here you are whining about how people are not taking your non-standard opamp judgement well, when you completely reject others' opinions when they're not what you like.
I never expected my experience be taken seriously by you considering you're the clergy of LT1028. But while both me and my DAC may appear freak in your eyes, have you ever considered that you may appear so in the eyes of others?
Do not take yourself so seriously...it doesn't do good to you.
I doubt anyone is taking this thread seriously. Well sorry if you had.
I'd say ditto, but I guess the harm done has already reached an ireversible level, so I won't bother saying that.
talk about blind rolling
2*LT1124ACN8(on the DAC output) going through 4*LT1028ACN8 (as final buffer) gives a HELL lot of bass and very clear trebles...but through the Burson(as final buffer) it's very much bass shy, trebles are fantastic though.
OTOH 2*NJM4580D through the Burson sounds really good, tons of bass...clear trebles(yet a bit dark). NJM made a great chip w/ this 4580...no wonder it's so widely used.
I'll order some 5532 for the hell of it, maybe it'll improve the trebles over the 4580...they're pretty dark in my current setup.
2*LT1124ACN8(on the DAC output) going through 4*LT1028ACN8 (as final buffer) gives a HELL lot of bass and very clear trebles...but through the Burson(as final buffer) it's very much bass shy, trebles are fantastic though.
OTOH 2*NJM4580D through the Burson sounds really good, tons of bass...clear trebles(yet a bit dark). NJM made a great chip w/ this 4580...no wonder it's so widely used.
I'll order some 5532 for the hell of it, maybe it'll improve the trebles over the 4580...they're pretty dark in my current setup.
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