A new thought
Scott or others:
I just thought of using auto pinstripe tape to make Enables that are
reversible and does not depend on a steady hand with a draftsman's s pen.
How would that work? Pinstripe tape should be available in white black and some other colors. Pinstripe tape is available from hobby suppliers that sell hot rod replicas and stuff.
Scott or others:
I just thought of using auto pinstripe tape to make Enables that are
reversible and does not depend on a steady hand with a draftsman's s pen.
How would that work? Pinstripe tape should be available in white black and some other colors. Pinstripe tape is available from hobby suppliers that sell hot rod replicas and stuff.
208/T90A BIB
I don't think I have ever posted on this forum, but would like to try to join the club. First I would like to thank all for the info on this forum. A very special thanks to Scott for helping me get my 166 Voigt Pipes to the point that I could really enjoy them a few years ago, and put up with me again during this BIB project. Also, thanks to seventenths who brought his 166 BIBs to a Bottlehead meet where I found out how much more bass a BIB has than even a BSC'd Voigt Pipe. Also a very special thanks to Daniel who invited be to email him about his Fostex 208 BIB's, and also put up with me thereafter. I have asked both Scott and Daniel a lot of questions that I needed to, and some that I probably didn't need to.
I listened to James Taylor tonight. Just amazing!
I continue to try different things. Once I think I have made my mind up about what sounds best as far as placement, damping, crossover, etc., a different recording changes my mind a little. I am getting curious about what measurments of some kind (other than my ears) would tell me. You can do so much to change the sound of these things! Right now, I have a "banner" in the 2nd half of the horn, the 208 is wired out of phase with the T90A, using a 1.0 cap and a fair amount of attenuation on the T90A.
Tomorrow I hope to see if I can shut off all sound above 300Hz from coming out the end of the horn by adding fiber fill in the bottom, and see what that sounds like. I did find that adding some dampening material to the wall behind the speakers helped, but the sleeping bags on the walls did not pass the WAF. I may have to come up with something that can.
Some day I will call it good, seal everything up, and put on a nice finish. Then, maybe I can post a picture.
I would be interested to hear from any about how the fine tuned thier BIB, before I seal mine up, and finish it.
Sincerely,
Benjamin
I don't think I have ever posted on this forum, but would like to try to join the club. First I would like to thank all for the info on this forum. A very special thanks to Scott for helping me get my 166 Voigt Pipes to the point that I could really enjoy them a few years ago, and put up with me again during this BIB project. Also, thanks to seventenths who brought his 166 BIBs to a Bottlehead meet where I found out how much more bass a BIB has than even a BSC'd Voigt Pipe. Also a very special thanks to Daniel who invited be to email him about his Fostex 208 BIB's, and also put up with me thereafter. I have asked both Scott and Daniel a lot of questions that I needed to, and some that I probably didn't need to.
I listened to James Taylor tonight. Just amazing!
I continue to try different things. Once I think I have made my mind up about what sounds best as far as placement, damping, crossover, etc., a different recording changes my mind a little. I am getting curious about what measurments of some kind (other than my ears) would tell me. You can do so much to change the sound of these things! Right now, I have a "banner" in the 2nd half of the horn, the 208 is wired out of phase with the T90A, using a 1.0 cap and a fair amount of attenuation on the T90A.
Tomorrow I hope to see if I can shut off all sound above 300Hz from coming out the end of the horn by adding fiber fill in the bottom, and see what that sounds like. I did find that adding some dampening material to the wall behind the speakers helped, but the sleeping bags on the walls did not pass the WAF. I may have to come up with something that can.
Some day I will call it good, seal everything up, and put on a nice finish. Then, maybe I can post a picture.
I would be interested to hear from any about how the fine tuned thier BIB, before I seal mine up, and finish it.
Sincerely,
Benjamin
flush mount
I noticed a substantial improvement by flush mounting.
Others will be able to say if flush mounting is significant for the larger 208s.
I've used the banner/pennant but removed it after making the
flush mount. I do the listening test at the mouth and don't hear much mid coming out that way.
I noticed a substantial improvement by flush mounting.
Others will be able to say if flush mounting is significant for the larger 208s.
I've used the banner/pennant but removed it after making the
flush mount. I do the listening test at the mouth and don't hear much mid coming out that way.
You're welcome Benjamin.
Re the damping, I think I mentioned before, it's very much a case of what works for your particular room & system, so beyond the basic damping above & behind the driver, & on the base, it's a case of adjust to taste.
Interesting that you mention James Taylor. I was listening to Hourglass earlier on today & nearly jumped out of my skin at least twice, shouting 'where did that come from?!' I won't say exactly what caused it, or why, but it's a fanstastic album guys, so if you don't own it, I strongly advise you to grab a copy. And you'll know exactly what I'm on about when you hear it -comes as a surprise.
Re the damping, I think I mentioned before, it's very much a case of what works for your particular room & system, so beyond the basic damping above & behind the driver, & on the base, it's a case of adjust to taste.
Interesting that you mention James Taylor. I was listening to Hourglass earlier on today & nearly jumped out of my skin at least twice, shouting 'where did that come from?!' I won't say exactly what caused it, or why, but it's a fanstastic album guys, so if you don't own it, I strongly advise you to grab a copy. And you'll know exactly what I'm on about when you hear it -comes as a surprise.
What's with the iiiiiiiiiiiiiii's? 
Anyway, particularly with the former, you're moving away from the original quasi-conical expansion, so it would need to be carefully calculated in advance. Increasing the area of the terminus isn't a bad idea, as it will improve the acoustic impedance match, and / or provide a degree of end correction. Whether the difference would be audible or not however would depend on exactly what is done.
Anyway, particularly with the former, you're moving away from the original quasi-conical expansion, so it would need to be carefully calculated in advance. Increasing the area of the terminus isn't a bad idea, as it will improve the acoustic impedance match, and / or provide a degree of end correction. Whether the difference would be audible or not however would depend on exactly what is done.
I am all for improving the BIB design but one of the great benefits of a BIB is simplicity.
Straight lines from top to bottom.
Corner placement in a room.
Single driver implementation.
All the above is subject to personal taste, room decor, ability of builder, artistic desire, enhancement on top with super tweeter or on bottom with subwoofer, etc. Every BIB, regardless of how elaborate or basic, can result in excellent sound and excellent value for music lovers.
Damn the measurments! Listen with your ears not your eyes and you will find the BIB is a superior speaker design.
Straight lines from top to bottom.
Corner placement in a room.
Single driver implementation.
All the above is subject to personal taste, room decor, ability of builder, artistic desire, enhancement on top with super tweeter or on bottom with subwoofer, etc. Every BIB, regardless of how elaborate or basic, can result in excellent sound and excellent value for music lovers.
Damn the measurments! Listen with your ears not your eyes and you will find the BIB is a superior speaker design.
Don't look at me. 
My 167s have some basket damping & phase plugs, but they're not EnABL'd. I can say that both of the former are generally worth doing, albeit the extent of the benefits will vary from driver to driver. You could also ground the chassis to the - terminal on the driver too if you felt like it. Regarding EnABL, my experience with it is minimal, so I'm defering any conclusions until I have some more experience.
My 167s have some basket damping & phase plugs, but they're not EnABL'd. I can say that both of the former are generally worth doing, albeit the extent of the benefits will vary from driver to driver. You could also ground the chassis to the - terminal on the driver too if you felt like it. Regarding EnABL, my experience with it is minimal, so I'm defering any conclusions until I have some more experience.
loninappleton
EnABL process always goes on last, over all of your other driver mods. Regardless of the arm waving in the technical thread, the patterns control the final surface emissions into the air. You may or may not want to put the Gloss coat on and you may or may not want to develop a mid cone ring set for cone and whizzer. Just depends upon how much information you want from the drivers.
As for tape of any kind, it has been done and it is said to work. A lovely young woman in GB applied the patterns to her Lowther mono system and to her relief, found music in place of Hi Fi. I am not certain about the properties of pin stripe tape, but if it is as wide as a pen applied block would be they is should suffice. Certainly worth trying out.
Scottmoose,
Did you ever come up with a tasty cabinet for the F200 A? The owner of the pair I treated calls me once a week to go on about what new things he has accomplished with his system, using those amazing drivers as his reference. His are in closed cabinets, of fine looking build quality, but the drivers were just perfect while playing nude on stands, as Omni radiators. Maybe a box with those Tang Band 8 inch bass drivers as the 100 Hz and lower transmission line, or perhaps a half chang, or even a variant of Terry's BIB without a TB woofer?
Bud
EnABL process always goes on last, over all of your other driver mods. Regardless of the arm waving in the technical thread, the patterns control the final surface emissions into the air. You may or may not want to put the Gloss coat on and you may or may not want to develop a mid cone ring set for cone and whizzer. Just depends upon how much information you want from the drivers.
As for tape of any kind, it has been done and it is said to work. A lovely young woman in GB applied the patterns to her Lowther mono system and to her relief, found music in place of Hi Fi. I am not certain about the properties of pin stripe tape, but if it is as wide as a pen applied block would be they is should suffice. Certainly worth trying out.
Scottmoose,
Did you ever come up with a tasty cabinet for the F200 A? The owner of the pair I treated calls me once a week to go on about what new things he has accomplished with his system, using those amazing drivers as his reference. His are in closed cabinets, of fine looking build quality, but the drivers were just perfect while playing nude on stands, as Omni radiators. Maybe a box with those Tang Band 8 inch bass drivers as the 100 Hz and lower transmission line, or perhaps a half chang, or even a variant of Terry's BIB without a TB woofer?
Bud
')
Re: flush mount
By flush mounting, do you mean not using a "spacer baffle"? If so, I think I am out of luck on that one, because I did not have enough space to get the driver in without it, and I oversized the driver hole in the box. I did get a major improvement in sound by reaming the holes out good, and at an angle on the inside to make it a little less like a "tube" behind the driver. I also got an improvement by sealing things up (i.e. with weather stripping.) This was awhile back.
What I did today was to trade my 3 layers of 3/8th felt on the bottom for about 3 or 4 inches of fiber glass. Yes, I lost some bass, but I had bass to spare. The bass I have now is tighter. So far, I think I like them this way. It is hard to drag myself away from them. Thanks all!
Sincerely,
Benjamin
loninappleton said:
By flush mounting, do you mean not using a "spacer baffle"? If so, I think I am out of luck on that one, because I did not have enough space to get the driver in without it, and I oversized the driver hole in the box. I did get a major improvement in sound by reaming the holes out good, and at an angle on the inside to make it a little less like a "tube" behind the driver. I also got an improvement by sealing things up (i.e. with weather stripping.) This was awhile back.
What I did today was to trade my 3 layers of 3/8th felt on the bottom for about 3 or 4 inches of fiber glass. Yes, I lost some bass, but I had bass to spare. The bass I have now is tighter. So far, I think I like them this way. It is hard to drag myself away from them. Thanks all!
Sincerely,
Benjamin
Yes to all the flush mounting info that has followed. And I think he means by 'reamed out' that a chamfer was cut into the backside. I do that as well.
Since there is no subgroup called Craftsmen's Corner on here I will say that I am still baffled by how to do really accurate flush mounts on
non circular driver frames like the FE127e. I have the article-- I'm looking at it-- but there is some stuff about stepping down the size stepping up the size of the router bit and winding up with a jig that can hog out the shape of the driver frame from a template which is 3/8 larger than the driver frame. I have done this freehand but it doesn't have a nice finished look.
Even without the nice finished look, I recommend doing the procedure but trust Scott and the rest that it might be unnecessary for the larger driver with a different profile.
And this template would somehow be free standing and clamped
to the front baffle and hopefully everything is centered.
That's the piece in AudioXpress. If there is another source for this
sort of info please advise. I'm just not getting it.
Since there is no subgroup called Craftsmen's Corner on here I will say that I am still baffled by how to do really accurate flush mounts on
non circular driver frames like the FE127e. I have the article-- I'm looking at it-- but there is some stuff about stepping down the size stepping up the size of the router bit and winding up with a jig that can hog out the shape of the driver frame from a template which is 3/8 larger than the driver frame. I have done this freehand but it doesn't have a nice finished look.
Even without the nice finished look, I recommend doing the procedure but trust Scott and the rest that it might be unnecessary for the larger driver with a different profile.
And this template would somehow be free standing and clamped
to the front baffle and hopefully everything is centered.
That's the piece in AudioXpress. If there is another source for this
sort of info please advise. I'm just not getting it.
I believe the Ax process works.
But in the text there's some stuff that sounds like the old Robert Benchley essay called "Insert Flap 'A' and Throw It Away".
Somebody must have done this or at least seen the article. Pictures accompanying the text were few and small. Small I can deal with but
there were some things that weren't shown, hence the Benchley reference.
But in the text there's some stuff that sounds like the old Robert Benchley essay called "Insert Flap 'A' and Throw It Away".
Somebody must have done this or at least seen the article. Pictures accompanying the text were few and small. Small I can deal with but
there were some things that weren't shown, hence the Benchley reference.