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#2,882
#2,883
Re: whatever you think of evolution...

dorkus said:
it's clear that Pres. Bush has somehow escaped it, or has managed to reverse it...
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Hi dorkus,

I think it's really..really sad that your country....in many respects the greatest country on earth got saddled with the bush clan...

Ounce was careless...but twice...common man!?!:bigeyes:
 
#2,886
Jocko Homo said:


Some of you guys don't get it....................

Having your **** sucked at work, by a subordinate, is called sexual harassment. Even talking about having your **** sucked at work to/with/around a subordinate is called sexual harassment. And that means that you will get fired. Try it sometime if you think otherwise.

So, lying about "dalliances with the hired help", which may be in fact be "totally irrelevant", become a matter of survival in such situations. And since it is slimeball politicians who gave us these laws, then they should be held up, or is it down, to the same level compliance. If we can get fired for expressing our natural hormonal urges, then they should to. Sounds like it is not only fair, but perhaps the only way to rid ourselves of the whole stinking lot of them.

And then their replacements too.

Lying at work is an everyday routine, employed by everyone from the lowest peon trying to save his/her butt, all the way up to the CEO who commits the largest accounting scandal in history (making schnooks like me broke in the process). Few, if any, get fired for lying. I don't think any large company could survive if lying at work was as illegal as talking about having your **** sucked at work is. Hell, politicians don't say or do anything except lie. Must be in their job description. Expecting any of them to be truthful is really quite naive when you think about it.

And as for "lying about..........", thanks to Clinton the bar has now been raised (lowered?) for what constitutes lying. This is the guy who said that he "did not have sexual relations with that woman.........Miss Lewinsky". Did he mean "that women" as the wench he is married to, or some other unspecified woman, he says as he directly addresses Miss Lewinsky. (Yes, "English" allows for such subtle tricks to come into play.) Or did he mean what we really thought that he meant in that "having his **** sucked" is not sexual relations. Hey, it is just his interpretation of the situation. He saw it differently, so his eye, he did not lie.

So......as for the present occupant of the house that my tax dollars pays for.........did he lie?? In order to lie, you have to know the truth, and that what you are saying is not the truth. All of you people who revile him so claim that he is the dumbest man on the face of the earth. So, if he is so dumb, then how can you expect him to even know the truth? In that case, he is doing the best that he can, which probably means that he is doing a lot better than we should expect.

No, I think that lying is the incorrect allegation. I believe that, like in the sketch of perhaps the most famous of all Monty Python shows.......... the one about "Spam", that the publisher of the Hungarian-English phrase book, that turned out to be a dirty Hungarian-English phrase book, the proper claim should be:

"I plead incompetence."

Works for all politicians, of all persuasions, of all countries, for all times.

Also works for some people here who post constantly just to................wait, enough about you-know-who......behind his back even..............he is paranoid enough already without more encouragement.

As for "real choices to be made at the ballot box".................... sure you have. You can chose what group of crooks is going to take your money, who, in turn, waste it on pet projects, or cronies, of their choice. The end result is the same: my money goes to people that have no right to it, and do almost nothing to better my lot. And sometimes make it worse.

(If anyone wants to know how the FDA, upon some irrational whim, decided to virtually kill lots of people like me who were trying hard not to die, send me an e-mail. Too long for here.)

Hell, they can't even my sales tax return back and forth to the corrupt government agency who gets the pleasure of taking other people's money, who, in turn, penalizes me because they never got it. That is government, and politicians, for you.

I guess that makes me a cynic, too. So I plead guilty.

Jocko, still alive despite government's attempt to the contrary.
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It is great to see not one response to Jocko's post. Of all the seemingly "pro Bush" posts in this thread to go unchallenged, of which there were none, and this one went for around 13 days in favor of a running discussion on wether or not to teach Darwinism in the classroom.
Congradulations, to all the European posters, for exhibiting that wonderful American trait, that they've been so critical of, of ignoring the issue to persue something meaningless in light of an obvious injustice. So you've become what you despise? Well, I will reply to you Jocko, since I am obviously amused at your "sliding this under the wire".


😉

Did Bush lie, no one will ever prove it for there are too many people who will fall on the knife. If there is one lesson that American presidents should have learned by now it's never leave written or audible proof of anything. Even Bush wouldn't be that stupid, and by the way I don't think he's stupid at all. I believe he's smarter than slick Willie, because he hasn't been caught yet. Of course slick Willie went almost eight years before he got caught so the jury is still out on Bush. I don't think the proper argument is wether or not Bush lied, and I desoise those liberals who cloud the real issue with this kind or crap. There are far more substantial points to attack Bush on which are being chucked by the wayside in favor of this garbage. If people don't start focusing on these issues Bush will get re-elected which you may or may not favor, but that is your perogative because as I've also noticed no one questioned your patriotism for thirteen days either.😉
 
#2,887
I didn't bother reading anymore, since I quit the discussion here a long time ago. But it's funny how you say all presidents should just not keep audible or recorded proof of anything.

That's just great, but you know what's better? Having good intentions and talking about it out loud! If Bush, had such great intentions, nothing to hide, etc... he would have been praised around the world for being such a great leader, but he's not so nuff said. I am not engaging in the stupendous arguments. 🙂

It would seem the best 'come back' bush loyalists have against the criticism of iraq war is "Oh so sadam should have been left?" Ignoring ALL the other reasons given for war. A thousand lies vs one possible fact.. I won't be swayed into foolishness 🙂 Of course that's forgetting ENTIRELY the ROOTS of the US invovlment with Iraq.. that entire region. Iran is almost forgotten. The sha is forgotten. Funny only a decade ago another scandal Iran-Contra took place.. and funny.. reagen, rumsfield, bush sr., etc... were around. Republicans screwing up as usual for their own little wallets. Not to mention, NOW AGAIN, Iran is a possible target, man that's alot of messing around with that region if you ask me.

Bye bye 😛 Most people don't reply anymore because it's impossible to take the blindness off your eyes 🙂 Go kiss bush and say hi or something. Why is this thread going anymore heh, WOW, out of all the forums on the internet I've ever been on this is the longest thread ever 🙂 If bush told you right out, "I lied to you", you would probably say "everyone makes mistakes, you are only human" or something haha..

Funny how you say 'liberals' or whoever else, cloud the issues, but you say that Bush and republicans should not leave any proof of what they do.. fascinating. You are hopeless 🙂
 
#2,890
Gigatron,

I'm not sure what your point is.

CBS's original headline turned out to not be supported by the evidence (I guess you could say that what they said in their first headline was false). This can happen when you are in a rush to publish. The second headline matches what the evidence on the subject actually supports.

As I recall the substance behind this is that the CIA had "reservations" about the reliability of the source of this data. The controversy is about Bush chosing to ignore this "reservation", not that Bush deliberately lied. Deciding to ignore the reservations of one of your advisors is not the same as saying something you know to be false.

Phil
 
#2,891
PassFan said:


It is great to see not one response to Jocko's post. Of all the seemingly "pro Bush" posts in this thread to go unchallenged, of which there were none, and this one went for around 13 days in favor of a running discussion on wether or not to teach Darwinism in the classroom.
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who said Jocko's post was "pro Bush"? i read it more as a realistic view of politics than anything else. and he's right. all politicians lie, that's a fact. we KNOW Bush lied, as has every other president who has held office probably. that's not the issue (if you're still trying to make it an issue, then i believe you need a serious wake-up call to reality). i accept lies from politicians as a fact of life really. it's what he lies about, and the ulterior motive for lying, that is really the issue.

anyway, i don't think i need to make any more comments about the Bush administration. the facts speaks for themselves, and it's look more and more likely that he might not get re-elected (praise the Lord) so i'm going to just sit tight and hope for the best.
 
#2,893
gigatron said:
I didn't bother reading anymore, since I quit the discussion here a long time ago. But it's funny how you say all presidents should just not keep audible or recorded proof of anything.

That's just great, but you know what's better? Having good intentions and talking about it out loud! If Bush, had such great intentions, nothing to hide, etc... he would have been praised around the world for being such a great leader, but he's not so nuff said. I am not engaging in the stupendous arguments. 🙂

It would seem the best 'come back' bush loyalists have against the criticism of iraq war is "Oh so sadam should have been left?" Ignoring ALL the other reasons given for war. A thousand lies vs one possible fact.. I won't be swayed into foolishness 🙂 Of course that's forgetting ENTIRELY the ROOTS of the US invovlment with Iraq.. that entire region. Iran is almost forgotten. The sha is forgotten. Funny only a decade ago another scandal Iran-Contra took place.. and funny.. reagen, rumsfield, bush sr., etc... were around. Republicans screwing up as usual for their own little wallets. Not to mention, NOW AGAIN, Iran is a possible target, man that's alot of messing around with that region if you ask me.

Bye bye 😛 Most people don't reply anymore because it's impossible to take the blindness off your eyes 🙂 Go kiss bush and say hi or something. Why is this thread going anymore heh, WOW, out of all the forums on the internet I've ever been on this is the longest thread ever 🙂 If bush told you right out, "I lied to you", you would probably say "everyone makes mistakes, you are only human" or something haha..

Funny how you say 'liberals' or whoever else, cloud the issues, but you say that Bush and republicans should not leave any proof of what they do.. fascinating. You are hopeless 🙂
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Are you so emotionally unstable that you can't understand english or is it not your native tongue?
I never said Bush shouldn't leave audible or written evidence, I said that by now they should know better, after what happened to Clinton being hounded for eight years and Nixon getting caught with all those tapes. Do I have to take the idiot by the hand and spell out what I mean?

Hardcore Liberals are accusing Bush of lying, something, given a lack of evidence, they cannot hope to prove. They can tie it to the white house but who will take the fall, Bush? Too many people who will take the heat for him, so these liberals are wasting the real argument. What's the real argument, how about Bush said we have to get these wmd's out of Iraq and now he can't find them. He failed and he hasn't been pressured to show his original evidence of WMD's, why not? Too many idiots trying to call him a liar. No one will ever prove some one else didn't hand him the lie to read.

Perhaps you could take the time to go back and see on which side of the issue I stand. Right now you have the pot calling the kettle black.
 
#2,894
dorkus said:



who said Jocko's post was "pro Bush"? i read it more as a realistic view of politics than anything else. and he's right. all politicians lie, that's a fact. we KNOW Bush lied, as has every other president who has held office probably. that's not the issue (if you're still trying to make it an issue, then i believe you need a serious wake-up call to reality). i accept lies from politicians as a fact of life really. it's what he lies about, and the ulterior motive for lying, that is really the issue.

anyway, i don't think i need to make any more comments about the Bush administration. the facts speaks for themselves, and it's look more and more likely that he might not get re-elected (praise the Lord) so i'm going to just sit tight and hope for the best.
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Jocko was responding to some members attempts at blowing off Clintons lie as somehow being less than Bush's, which, to me is SEEMINGLY defending Bush. Sorry to be misleading.
 
#2,895
Are you so emotionally unstable that you can't understand english or is it not your native tongue?

...

Do I have to take the idiot by the hand and spell out what I mean?
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:cop: PassFan: I'd appreciate it if you'd argue to the point without resorting to personal attacks against another member. I understand the frustration, but this is out of bounds.

</cop> I'm not certain, but I gather from context that English indeed is not Gigatron's native language, though his excellent proficiency might suggest otherwise. Gigatron, you can correct me if I'm wrong.
 
#2,898
To passfan:

LoL, liberals 🙂 I love that word.., Reagen, Nixon, Bush Sr., and now Bush Jr. etc... are a buncha double crossing, double agenda, multi-lying pieces of poo.

Yes it really is relavent whether they lie or not and yes you made a very valid point, Bush isn't the only man, he is just a puppet on strings, there are those behind him who influence and give him instructions and ideas more or less.

Regardless, the lies should not be let by PERIOD. One lie, oh just a mistake, another lie, we were fooled, another lie.. we all make mistakes, another... lie... misunderstanding...

Oh and stop stumbling over your own lies will you 🙂

If there is one lesson that American presidents should have learned by now it's never leave written or audible proof of anything. Even Bush wouldn't be that stupid, and by the way I don't think he's stupid at all. I believe he's smarter than slick Willie, because he hasn't been caught yet. Of course slick Willie went almost eight years before he got caught so the jury is still out on Bush.
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Steering away from the fact that yes they did lie only proves the point that you DO support them... but are trying to twist as much as they are twisting the truth.

I don't think the proper argument is wether or not Bush lied, and I desoise those liberals who cloud the real issue with this kind or crap. There are far more substantial points to attack Bush on which are being chucked by the wayside in favor of this garbage.
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A play on words, basically "screw the liberals they BS" and "who cares if bush lied".

If people don't start focusing on these issues Bush will get re-elected which you may or may not favor, but that is your perogative because as I've also noticed no one questioned your patriotism for thirteen days either. 😉
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*Yay*....

How do people KNOW bush, rice, rumsfield, powel, cheyney, ashcroft (a *beep*en nazi) and the rest of the crew LIED?

Hmm, for instance.... first and foremost... inconsistencies! Saying one thing, doing another. Making poor excuses. Changing information, changing what was first said into something else. The secrecy around issues.. if they were so good-willed the world would be welcoming them with flowers and praising them for being good world leaders... but they are not.. are they now?

And the still bush supporting folks are plain and simple brainwashed.. for instance.. remember the 'mobile-labs', that was 'irrefutable evidence' (haha I love quoting little cliches), now most that I talk to don't remember that, or deny it. QUITE WEIRD! Or what about the aluminum tubes? OR lol... what about the undug 'nuclear power plant equipment'.. LMAO! That was the worst and most desperate attempt 🙂 Hmm there was other instanceus where they 'almost' found wmd and chemical, biological weapons.. but the word here is almost. There was 'irrefutable evidence' of WMD, what was presented by Colin Powel to the UN. I watched it Live uncut (CNN one was cut a little bit if I'm not mistaken heh... as usual -- the reporters bud in to 'explain things', and there are usually malufunctions strange... the same happened when Blix was talking).

The whole damn war was fought on a bunch of lies. And worst of all do you really think this was liberation? People would be cheering with flowers.. AND if the US' intention was just to remove Saddam and 'liberate the people' now would be nice to leave.. but of course that is because the US is so THIRLLED to rebuild Iraq... so the army is staying.. regardless of the iraq's people's opinions.

What the hell ever happened to Bin Laden? It's like people entirely forgot. What happened to Saddam? Those 'reconstructed' sons of his looked like a bunch of grease rubber dummies could have been anyone underneath.

What do you get? A faceless everchanging enemy, and a never ending war... business for a buncha rich *beep*ers, much like Iran-Contra for instance... and again the irony is how the US supports, arms, destroys, then supports, arms countries in this case... Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq..

Anyways.. I don't see the point arguing 🙂 Those who support Bush and his big-little crew... will continue to support if they are concious of WHY they really want to support... if they realize that this is all lies and other bad little things.... maybe they won't support... but I doubt it.. and of course those that are against bush and his big-little crew... will never support bush and his big-little crew...

I dislike labeling myself on the political spectrum, "Liberal, Republican, Democrat, whatever".... I just follow what's moral.. and this war was NOT moral... it didn't see the letter M of moral for several miles...and nor is Bush (hah, it's funny that he's a devout Christian... what another great shame on the church.. or whichever church he is part of).

To SY:
Nope English is not my mother language, Former-Yugoslavian is.. although now that's split and no longer existing.. so I'd have to chose wether it's Bosnian, Croatian or Serbian... but I don't want to chose heh. The differenceus between Bosnian, Croatian and Serbian LANGUAGES is like .. little to no difference. Bosnian is similar to Croatian but uses many words like Serbian. Serbian would have words like belo and lepo while Bosnian and Croatian would have bjelo and ljepo. That use of j would not be quite present in that form.. hard to explain. And of course Serbian uses cyrilic alphabet. And then I learned English, Arabic and French in North Africa. English is the easiest to learn but it's inevitable to always make mistakes heh :cannotbe:
 
#2,900
gigatron said:
To passfan:

LoL, liberals 🙂 I love that word.., Reagen, Nixon, Bush Sr., and now Bush Jr. etc... are a buncha double crossing, double agenda, multi-lying pieces of poo.

Yes it really is relavent whether they lie or not and yes you made a very valid point, Bush isn't the only man, he is just a puppet on strings, there are those behind him who influence and give him instructions and ideas more or less.

Regardless, the lies should not be let by PERIOD. One lie, oh just a mistake, another lie, we were fooled, another lie.. we all make mistakes, another... lie... misunderstanding...

Oh and stop stumbling over your own lies will you 🙂



Steering away from the fact that yes they did lie only proves the point that you DO support them... but are trying to twist as much as they are twisting the truth.



A play on words, basically "screw the liberals they BS" and "who cares if bush lied".
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, I do not have the luxury of sitting on the outside and watching. I have to fight to get rid of Bush and I have to do so according to the rules and practices of my country and not your morals.
Bush lied, sure he did. His whole administration is based on deciet and Corporate favoritism. The Republicans are labeling us as liberals. Hard core liberals are a bunch of winers and are not taken seriously by the majority of Americans because of their wining. There are enough real things that can be proved about Bush that can be used to get rid of him and his administration. Lying is a real thing and we all know they all do it but in America, wether you like it or not, you must be caught red handed. Thinking that Bush lied and having concrete evidence of it are two different things. Do I think Bush lied, yes. Can I prove it, no. If I can't prove it and I yell it out anyway I am disregarded as a wining liberal. How can I hope to get rid of Bush if I"m not taken seriously? If you have'nt figured it out by now, I am against Bush, I was against the war in Iraq, for more reasons than you have. Since Bush was elected we have lost a million jobs a year, mine was one of them. He wants to destroy the enviornment, he wants to destroy livelihoods, he is Satan to me, and you misunderstand what I write and label me a supporter. All this war thing is, is taking peoples minds of what he is screwing up here. What a sham, and you think I support Bush? Perhaps if I could understand and converse in your native language we would not have so big a misunderstanding, or do you just not like any Americans?


😕
 
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