In this case, would be better to use Cyclops as kickbins and not as subwoofer?
Symetrical path gives us a lot of efficiency and tunning a little high for kickbin and help to reduce a little the box volume. Finnaly, the folded path would not be a problem for frequency till 300Hz, right?
For higher frequency crossover maybe the superplanar from Matthew Morgan J or straightforward horn would be better.
Straight is an easier build than angle. Also, negative tapers are not efficient when it comes to SPL.
Depends on the amount of taper
. My POC6 for example still ends up with a vent that's 2/3rds Sd, so vent compression is kept pretty low.
I have yet to see a negative taper ported enclosure on diymobileaudio.com or Steve Meade Designs website. The vents usually have positive flare at each end to reduce port noise. When going SQ, they use sealed enclosures. Shoot, I have a sealed enclosure in my truck because I don't have room for any type of vented alignment with two 15's. But, I got four 8's so I can build either a BP4 or a tapped pipe (STRAIGHT flare tapped horn).
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Almost all the "TL" designs I see on those two sites also follow the obsolete "classical" approach to designing and building TLs, and don't even do that correctly too, as they don't use any stuffing, which is required to reduce the terrible resonances that can occur at both ends of the passband when mounting a high-Q, Low-Vas driver at one end of a large pipe. Who knows - maybe that decidedly non-flat response is exactly what they're aiming for in-car to get high SPLs at specific frequencies. I wouldn't hold any design I see on those two sites up as some sort of "benchmark" for designing or building a TL.
I'm not really in the PA business, but if I was, and I was looking for a kickbin build, I'd be looking for one that has a smooth response between at least 60~300 Hz.
Interestingly enough, I was able to get a lower resonance point out of a Cyclops layout by messing around with its external dimensions to make it more "square", like a THAM. I've attached one example - a smaller Cyclops for a 12" driver that theoretically reaches 42 Hz. It's starting to look like a variation of one of those "Paraflex" designs
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I don't. I'd prefer to build a simple ported box over a
TL. I was only stating why the car audio guys build "boring straight TL's."
For that you don't need/want a tapped horn, you want boring old front loaded. About 180 liters, maybe 200. If you use a 12, the null caused by the offset driver comes in around 600 hz, with nothing to fight between there and the low end cut off.
Tackling the W-Bin
I thought for my first (and perhaps only) foray in to FLHs I'd try to put together a design workbook for the "W-Bin" type fold. A simple fold that's turning out to be a bit more complex than I thought to map out.
Anyway, here's what the workbook looks like at the moment. It's nowhere near finished - I might be able to complete it by tomorrow night - got too much else to do this weekend! I'm thinking about slot-venting it, and that will eventually be built into the workbook. Right now I'm working with an 18" driver in mind, but if you have any particular drivers that you want me to concentrate on for the first sim, let me know...
I thought for my first (and perhaps only) foray in to FLHs I'd try to put together a design workbook for the "W-Bin" type fold. A simple fold that's turning out to be a bit more complex than I thought to map out.
Anyway, here's what the workbook looks like at the moment. It's nowhere near finished - I might be able to complete it by tomorrow night - got too much else to do this weekend! I'm thinking about slot-venting it, and that will eventually be built into the workbook. Right now I'm working with an 18" driver in mind, but if you have any particular drivers that you want me to concentrate on for the first sim, let me know...
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Looks like it's coming along well. Up to v0.3 now. I'm going to work on adding the venting to the chamber tonight. Some interesting things are coming out of the analysis, like this definitely looks like kickbin-type stuff.
Note that I didn't bother to continue the horn's taper right down to the throat of the horn. Simulating the impact of doing this in Hornresp didn't produce results that were any better than just adjusting the distance of the chamber from the back wall of the enclosure.
Note that I didn't bother to continue the horn's taper right down to the throat of the horn. Simulating the impact of doing this in Hornresp didn't produce results that were any better than just adjusting the distance of the chamber from the back wall of the enclosure.
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OMG, now I know why the vented version of the W-Bin was so popular as a bass horn - these things are LOUDER THAN BOMBS. Check the sim'd results of one that's vented to 42 Hz using one of the popular 18" drivers, in a box that's 42" high, 20" wide and 28" deep. Put it in a corner and the passband is at 115dB/2.83V/1M from 40 Hz to 200 Hz..! And my cousin has two of the damned things positioned like that in his small club...
The workbook is virtually finished at this point. However the F6 (refresh) routine in Hornresp to reload the export from the workbook while the Loudspeaker Wizard is open doesn't seem to be working as expected. David, are you listening in?
The workbook is virtually finished at this point. However the F6 (refresh) routine in Hornresp to reload the export from the workbook while the Loudspeaker Wizard is open doesn't seem to be working as expected. David, are you listening in?
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Hi Brian,
The F6 refresh functionality works just fine with the test BOXPLAN spreadsheets I have. Could you perhaps post a zipped-up .xls version of your latest spreadsheet on the Hornresp thread, so that I can investigate further? Many thanks.
Incidentally, your recent "OD1 S3 Auto" request has now been implemented in Hornresp.
Kind regards,
David
The F6 refresh functionality works just fine with the test BOXPLAN spreadsheets I have. Could you perhaps post a zipped-up .xls version of your latest spreadsheet on the Hornresp thread, so that I can investigate further? Many thanks.
Incidentally, your recent "OD1 S3 Auto" request has now been implemented in Hornresp
.Kind regards,
David
the Klipsch forums seem to still have some love for the old W-bin.
DJK's vented La Scala scheme should work well with an EQ like the old EV - Interface box. Just add about 2 cubic foot of riser base to La Scala or Belle, port and enjoy. La Scala already had that volume in its top mid and treble horn container.
DJK's vented La Scala scheme should work well with an EQ like the old EV - Interface box. Just add about 2 cubic foot of riser base to La Scala or Belle, port and enjoy. La Scala already had that volume in its top mid and treble horn container.
Hi Brian,
The F6 refresh functionality works just fine with the test BOXPLAN spreadsheets I have. Could you perhaps post a zipped-up .xls version of your latest spreadsheet on the Hornresp thread, so that I can investigate further? Many thanks.
Incidentally, your recent "OD1 S3 Auto" request has now been implemented in Hornresp
Kind regards,
David
Hi David, see current version of the spreadsheet attached.
Three things I noticed...
1. The "lossy Le" option is automatically selected. This is happening with all of the spreadsheets though, so I suspect it was introduced with a recent version of Hornresp.
2. If the Loudspeaker Wizard is on the "Schematic" option and you do an F6 "refresh", the schematic is replaced with an "Fr1 is too large" error, even when no changes are made to the import file before the refresh
3. If the value for Ap, is changed in the import file, this change is not reflected during an F6 "refresh" under Loudspeaker Wizard.
4. In Loudspeaker Wizard, "Vtc" is listed twice. It looks like the Ltc label was replaced by Vtc. I suspect that it does not change either during a refresh.
Thanks for the updates - I will have a play with them later today...
