I noticed that there are a fair amount of folks that aren’t afraid to research, you get results if you’re willing to put in the time and pick through the misinformation, weirdness, and that just happens on the web unfortunately, human factor and all...
Definitely the best forum I have encountered so far!
Definitely the best forum I have encountered so far!
Please don't do this! Since when has democracy been a good way at arriving at truth? This is not facebook or some other social forum where people have to gain 'likes' in order to retain their street cred. I really don't care whether other people 'like' my posts; I do care whether my posts are true and helpful, but I don't trust a button to tell me this.TonyTecson said:
i let you in on this.....having plenty of likes is by no means a measure of truth, science is not-negotiable.....it is a measure of how many appreciated the post..or many else think the same....
i agree that it is not, science can be bloody and scientist have died in the pursuit of knowledge..
But I don't wish to know how many think the same. If you introduce this feature will I be able to switch it off? Ideally so my posts don't have the button or the score; failing
that, hide it from me at least. I already have to ignore any 'friend' requests coming in; rejecting them may seem rude, but accepting them seems silly, so I just ignore them.
that, hide it from me at least. I already have to ignore any 'friend' requests coming in; rejecting them may seem rude, but accepting them seems silly, so I just ignore them.
nice input there, i hope Jason can read your post and take note....
like i said our board is a voluntary forum and no one is forced to do anything other than follow rules...
Yes, words are good.
If we have a 'like' button then before long there will be calls for a 'dislike' button. Trolls, idiots and their friends will then have been handed a weapon to use against the rest of us. We know that many modern folk, even ones who think they are educated liberals, can easily move from 'dislike' to 'must not be said'. Some of the people who think that this forum is intimidating will do so because of this mindset; having been corrected they claim that they have been silenced, when the existence of the correction is proof enough that they have not been silenced!
No, if people like what I say then they can say so. If they dislike it, then they can offer an alternative.
If we have a 'like' button then before long there will be calls for a 'dislike' button. Trolls, idiots and their friends will then have been handed a weapon to use against the rest of us. We know that many modern folk, even ones who think they are educated liberals, can easily move from 'dislike' to 'must not be said'. Some of the people who think that this forum is intimidating will do so because of this mindset; having been corrected they claim that they have been silenced, when the existence of the correction is proof enough that they have not been silenced!
No, if people like what I say then they can say so. If they dislike it, then they can offer an alternative.
Any time you install some sort of relative meritocracy it will evolve into a popularity contest for a sizable percentage of the participants, whether consciously or not, it happens.
Gene Welch (CEO of GE) started doing this with his employees, and it was adopted by several companies including Motorola (my employer) after he published his "Topgrading" book. I saw sweeping changes in the way people worked together, where cooperation was exchanged for an atmosphere of competitiveness. I consciously modified my behavior to use this to my advantage, and it lowered my work output as a result but extended my career for several years. Look at where both companies are today.....
Youtube's own search engine now finds videos based on views and likes. Even if you know the author of a video, the search engine will find their old stuff because it has been around longer and has more views.
Note that many popular videos have a lot of dislikes, as some people like the controversy. Youtube's most popular "star" gets away with some serious rule infractions because of the $$$$ that adverts bring on his channel.
I personally ignore the whole like / dislike thing since I use Youtube for learning. It does however degrade the S/N for that purpose since it brings up the noise floor with fluff trolling for views / likes. Searching for real learning is much harder and you must watch more crap to figure out who is just there for the money.
Occasionaly, I would be very proud to collect 'dislikes', I may even quote them on my resume
.I participate in other forums and a couple have the 'Like' feature.
None of them have a 'Dislike' button and I've never seen a call for one.
The 'Like' button can eliminate a lot of 'empty' posts, which can be a good thing, though I guess many of us would rather get our adulation in sentence form!
I think of the 'Like' button as meaning: 'I agree' or 'This is useful to me; thanks'.
The 'Like' feature can also reduce misunderstanding and shorten arguments in forum discussions.
If I take the trouble to post some sort of explanation, it would be nice to know if people find it useful, without demanding they send me a 'note of thanks' in a reply in the thread. If my posts aren't useful to others, why bother taking the time to compose and type them?
I guess some people have a 'higher purpose' than communication here?
So I would vote for the 'Like' button as an option.
You obviously don't use the "right(eous)" kind of forum, e.g. Vegan Forum
The Parts Express forum has a "like" button, and for individual posts or for threads it makes some sense. But that's not how those "likes" are mostly used. At PE, contributors are ranked according to how many of those "likes" they get for their posts--every poster has a bar graph under their avatar that uses those "likes" to establish their "reputation" (that's how the bar graphs are defined in the member list). Pinning someone's reputation on their quantity of "likes" doesn't settle well with me, for the same reasons that others have given in this thread.
Most of the software help forums like Stackoverflow use more complex algorithms to assess contributor reliability or reputation based on scoring for their answers. If this forum intends to use contributor scoring, it shouldn't be based on a simple "number of likes". And I don't know how you would do scoring on answers in this forum, since the problems discussed usually aren't as well defined as they are on a software forum. Also, a large number of the posts here aren't really "problems looking for answers" but rather things like build threads, technology discussions, idea-swapping, etc., etc.
Most of the software help forums like Stackoverflow use more complex algorithms to assess contributor reliability or reputation based on scoring for their answers. If this forum intends to use contributor scoring, it shouldn't be based on a simple "number of likes". And I don't know how you would do scoring on answers in this forum, since the problems discussed usually aren't as well defined as they are on a software forum. Also, a large number of the posts here aren't really "problems looking for answers" but rather things like build threads, technology discussions, idea-swapping, etc., etc.
A thread 'like' does less harm than a post 'like', although I see no need for either.
Most people will optimise whatever it is that they believe the management are measuring, however useful or counterproductive this is. A few will do the opposite, and some of them will be smart enough to get away with it; others may find themselves being let go when sales suffer a temporary setback.
This forum is basically a public conversation. We don't score people in conversations. That would be silly.
If someone puts in the effort to write an article then maybe some sort of score could be helpful, like ebay feedback. Comments would be more helpful. Experience tells me that oft-quoted/linked articles are not necessarily reliable. A guru can write complete nonsense and his fans will still praise him for it and tell their friends to read it.
Most people will optimise whatever it is that they believe the management are measuring, however useful or counterproductive this is. A few will do the opposite, and some of them will be smart enough to get away with it; others may find themselves being let go when sales suffer a temporary setback.
This forum is basically a public conversation. We don't score people in conversations. That would be silly.
If someone puts in the effort to write an article then maybe some sort of score could be helpful, like ebay feedback. Comments would be more helpful. Experience tells me that oft-quoted/linked articles are not necessarily reliable. A guru can write complete nonsense and his fans will still praise him for it and tell their friends to read it.
Like so many of you voicing objections to a “like” button, I also initially found the idea repellent. However, after spending some time with it on a different forum, I can acknowledge a few benefits I didn’t anticipate:
Cuts down on duplicate posts (ie “I agree with xxxxx” or quotes followed with a “+1”)
It cultivates an atmosphere of camaraderie (politeness can be appreciated)
It help draws attention to signals often buried in the noise
Like Pano stated already, there is already a thread-rating tool and nobody’s complaining about that. Might be a good idea to disengage such a feature in the lounge though.
Cuts down on duplicate posts (ie “I agree with xxxxx” or quotes followed with a “+1”)
It cultivates an atmosphere of camaraderie (politeness can be appreciated)
It help draws attention to signals often buried in the noise
Like Pano stated already, there is already a thread-rating tool and nobody’s complaining about that. Might be a good idea to disengage such a feature in the lounge though.
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