Proac Tablette 2000 crossover?

[slav]

Hi
Some time ago I bought mentioned speakers , now I'm trying to change some components in crossover .I have searched the web and cannot find anything about inductor values , wonder if somebody has a crossover schematic or measured those inductors?
Another option would be to buy inductance meter , but I am not sure how accurate cheap L-meters are.
Here is schematic without inductance values.

Thanks

 

[slav]

Please help with Tweeter polarity

Hi
I got myself into trouble , haven't checked polarity of tweeter before and now I'm not sure if was inverted or not . How to find out?
Best Regards
Slav

 

[Pit Hinder]

Slav,
not inverted. And you got really lucky finding a pair - these little beauties really sing.

Pit

 

[slav]

Slav,
not inverted. And you got really lucky finding a pair - these little beauties really sing.

Pit

Thanks Pit
How do you know ?
Best Regards
Slav

 

[Inductor]

Hi
I got myself into trouble , haven't checked polarity of tweeter before and now I'm not sure if was inverted or not . How to find out?
Best Regards
Slav

Look here.

crossovers: the standard proac crossover is 2nd order in the bass, 3 order in the tweeter, with one attenuation resistor as the first component in the tweeter. No L-pads here.

They are in phase...
a little proac info. - ZeroGain Forum

 

[Inductor]

Hi
Another option would be to buy inductance meter , but I am not sure how accurate cheap L-meters are.

I have a RANGE RE6000, and it works very fine.

 

[Pit Hinder]

Slav, I was around when the first version of the Tablette came out (late 70s, early 80s)...the original drivers are no longer available, but the newer ones are as good as the old ones. The Scandinavians build quality.

 

[slav]

Slav, I was around when the first version of the Tablette came out (late 70s, early 80s)...the original drivers are no longer available, but the newer ones are as good as the old ones. The Scandinavians build quality.

I meant how do you know if tweeter is inverting or not ?
When polarization should be reversed and when shoulnd't , what is a deciding factor?

 

[Pit Hinder]

>what is a deciding factor? <

The drivers themselves, the crossover...when you have a mismatch they are at 180° phase shift at the crossover frequency and cancel each other out. Voices sound "thin", guitars have no "body"...not good.

 

[slav]

Sorry but I'm still not getting .
Correct me if I'm wrong , depend on number of caps and inductors used in signal path of the speaker signal is shifted out of phase ie. 2 caps in signal path of woofer shift signal 180 degrees out of phase , lets assume there is no L or C in signal path of the tweeter - do I need to invert phase , but which speaker (woofer)?
Example 2:
2 caps in woofer , 1 in tweeter - 90 degreedifference - what then?

 

[slav]

I found ProAc studio 100 crossover diagram, and tweeter reversed polarity .Crossover almost the same as Tablette 2000?

 

[slav]

I searched web and couldn't find any info about ESR of Alcap bipolar caps , wonder if anyone has datasheet , etc.?

 

[slav]

What to do when replacing non polar caps( high ESR) with film capacitors(low ESR) - should I include series resistor ?

 

[Pit Hinder]

When money is rare, first to buy is good caps where they are in line with the tweeter - those in parallel to the woofer are no problem, you can use cheap bipolars.

 

[slav]

Problem is I replaced Bipolar cap (in parallel with woofer) with PIO and something is not right , I guessed it might be difference in ESR value .

 

[Pit Hinder]

Value not the same in both channels perhaps? Someone with measuring tools might check them and save you lots of money.

 

[slav]

Capacitors are matched , I have a meter and checked values are :8.06 and 8.08 uf.

 

[slav]

I will try series resistor with PIO cap , what value would be the best :0R5?

 

[ms142]

Hi slav - I've just modified my tablette 2000 and I can share some experience. Yes, in the stock configuration the tweeter is inverted relative to the woofer (because of the biwiring option, you can try both ways to see what it sounds like). I replaced the NPE in parallel with the woofer with Axon caps, and I too noticed something odd (less bass, more mid) and I'm puzzled by it. It does make things sound a tad tighter though. Let me know if you have any success with a series resistor.

For tweeter part I've increased the series resistor from 2R2 to 5R0 because Proac tends to lean on the squeaky side of neutral on the top. I may have overdone it a little though so I might try a smaller value later. I've also changed the mylar Expotus caps (3.3 and 4.7) to Obbligato gold, with Vishay 1837 bypass. So far quite good.

 

[slav]

HI ms142 , I've been playing with Tablletes for long time , in tweeter I have tried following parts:
-Mundorf MCap+Mills resistors
-Russian K75-10 PIO caps + Mills
- Mundorf Supreme +Mills , now waiting for Duelund resistors
so far last most expensive config. was absolutely best , next Russian PIO.

In woofer I tried combination of 3u3in parallel wit 4u7 - didn't like at all ,
after that I bought some british made caps - bettter but still far from original Proac's sound , I also tried Mundorf MCap(8u) - still far from good , lately used AmpOhm PIO 8u - best result .
Today I soldered back AlCap from original x-over , I will listen for some time and try to decide which way to go .Hopefuly I find something about ESR, I observed exactly same thing after reeplacing woofer cap - less bass +exposed mid
Tweeter stays as is , I just try Duelund resistors.