Hi all
I have started agein the horn project, I have done some experients with faseplugs and adapter plates, however above 3 a 3.5 khz things get canceled, using a correction is in my eyes not right for the sound, so I start a nea approach like A K-tube and a compression driver from BMS, I think this wil go nice and efficienty is quite high, a high pass filter for correction to the end of HF lower that considerably and so then I can just listen to a direct radiation version speaker system.
here some measuremens after making a adaptor for the horn. Now I have a wood lathe this is quite easy.
regards
I have started agein the horn project, I have done some experients with faseplugs and adapter plates, however above 3 a 3.5 khz things get canceled, using a correction is in my eyes not right for the sound, so I start a nea approach like A K-tube and a compression driver from BMS, I think this wil go nice and efficienty is quite high, a high pass filter for correction to the end of HF lower that considerably and so then I can just listen to a direct radiation version speaker system.
here some measuremens after making a adaptor for the horn. Now I have a wood lathe this is quite easy.
regards
Attachments
Thanks for the update. I think this confirms my earlier belief that using a stiff cone driver with a more powerful motor and no phase plugs with a smooth throat is the answer as shown in Bookshelf horn thread. The SB25WBAC25-4 seems to work very well for this application.
I think a faseplug with a good stiff cone can be used fine, look at HF when it get to much compression and so big peaks.
But the visaton did very well to 5 Khz, so I am happy with it and start part two, the BMS compression driver K-tube injector
we just need to go on with invent new things right!
SB25WBAC25-4 ? even google did not find it, can you link me to it thanks.
regards
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Sorry SB65WB25AC-4 same as driver used in Bookshelf Horn thread.
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-2-fullrange/sb-acoustics-sb65wbac25-4-2.5-full-range/
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-2-fullrange/sb-acoustics-sb65wbac25-4-2.5-full-range/
The fact this do better is the upgoing respons in HF, it is for people who hearing is not as good there, nice idea to use that for our benefit.
It these not to hars?.
regards
It these not to hars?.
regards
Waiting for your Ktube tests.
I have tried a Selenium D220ti in small horn, hanged in mouth of the 220hz fc tractrix horn, but it is simply too efficient, i had to lower the signal -17dB to be on same volume as a normal dome tweeter.
Maybe with K tube, things will be better, the efficiency will be lower and the 220ti driver will sound better, considering that power applied will be greater.
I have tried a Selenium D220ti in small horn, hanged in mouth of the 220hz fc tractrix horn, but it is simply too efficient, i had to lower the signal -17dB to be on same volume as a normal dome tweeter.
Maybe with K tube, things will be better, the efficiency will be lower and the 220ti driver will sound better, considering that power applied will be greater.
Did you use also the correcttion for the cone speaker in the horn itselfs? these are then cut down 10 a 12 dB for correction.
I have do not, I have full efficienty to 3.5 Khz, with a faseplug.
in picture tractrix wideband in throat is damped 12 dB for the tweeter horn in it who is 92 dB watt. measurement is some wild because of room impact.
regards
Attachments
What are your throat dimensions, because when make compression higher extension also go better.
I have 4.5 cm square this is a little to big, a 4 inch wideband however can then be used, for me not such a problem when using a K-tube .
regards
That is even bigger, but maybe your horn itself is smaller, like X did after the calculation, I did not and mine is bigger.
Special attention I need to make horn because I do use him on a wall or corner, and maybe this do limit extention,
I go use a faseplug for fight beaming in the HF part.
regards
I calculated the horn with Hornresp. I don't like the highs from the mid speaker, so for me is not a problem that it doesn't go higher than 2600Hz. Recently i upgraded my tweeter to Seas 27TDC and i can cross them 2nd order at 2600Hz, so mating mid+high is pretty good at this moment.
I have the same idea, so as I read, use horns not for wideband, I do go try en test a K-tube who I put in the horn and two bass units on top.
I did not now hornresp did tractrix? a other promissing way is constant directional horn.
Do you have the hornresp data? maybe I can experiment with it to see how hornresp do tractrix.
regards
I don't have it here at work. Will look at PC from home and post it, if i saved it.
I wanted best loading, that is why i chose tractrix and not conical.
I wanted best loading, that is why i chose tractrix and not conical.
Mine is also tractrix but calculate it with help of volvotreter and X.
I did see hornresp do tractrix but only with one section and no loudspeaker wizzard. I did myself use akabak anbd X his design but keep it original and make it smaller.
Thanks for looking at it, that part of hornresp I am not familiair with.
regards
Hi,
I would like to XO the 10F/8 ScanSpeak a little higher than 500 Hz for a 1000 electrical XO.
About the 10F/8" and the 2" throat design from X, Have you an idea of how shorter the length of the tractrix or the mouth size could be if I need only 1000 Hz and higher range please ?
Should we calculate the horn with 1 octave acoustical XO below the 1 000 Hz needed ? (so a horn with an acoustical 500 Hz HP?)
Does all the tries to extend directivity of axis with a lower throat than 2" were a failure (I mean in the spirit to not use phase plug or lens) ?
Is there a need of a front compression chamber between the driver and th ethroat or just a smooth transition to the square throat
Thank you in advance if any Idea, my wish is to reach 100 dB/sensivity with this driver as previous xrq971 design. Basicly the idea is to winn a little in of axis directivity as I don't need the 10F/8 below 1000 Hz !
I would like to XO the 10F/8 ScanSpeak a little higher than 500 Hz for a 1000 electrical XO.
About the 10F/8" and the 2" throat design from X, Have you an idea of how shorter the length of the tractrix or the mouth size could be if I need only 1000 Hz and higher range please ?
Should we calculate the horn with 1 octave acoustical XO below the 1 000 Hz needed ? (so a horn with an acoustical 500 Hz HP?)
Does all the tries to extend directivity of axis with a lower throat than 2" were a failure (I mean in the spirit to not use phase plug or lens) ?
Is there a need of a front compression chamber between the driver and th ethroat or just a smooth transition to the square throat
Thank you in advance if any Idea, my wish is to reach 100 dB/sensivity with this driver as previous xrq971 design. Basicly the idea is to winn a little in of axis directivity as I don't need the 10F/8 below 1000 Hz !
This one is nice for a horn, real wideband and a qts of 0.35 very stiff cone of polymers.
This Alpair 10 is the latest model in a development line designed to extend the performance
of mid-sized Markaudio full-range emitters. Measured performance is extended. Vas
increases from 21 to 28 litres. Fo is now 36Hz, 4Hz lower than the old model. Total Q
increases to 0.33 making this new Alpair 10 usable in larger audio applications.
This driver uses an all-new Multi-form cone design and U cap with a new more efficient
profiles giving improved high range performance. Additional features include a new
advanced Nomex super-light rear suspension (spider) and a special aluminium rectangle
wire wound coil, both reduce the mass of the power-train. The Alpair 10ʻs frame has a new
mix of polymers for the frame, making it 10% stiffer than the old model. New connector sets
allow for remote soldering of cables, installation is easy. .
This Alpair 10 is the latest model in a development line designed to extend the performance
of mid-sized Markaudio full-range emitters. Measured performance is extended. Vas
increases from 21 to 28 litres. Fo is now 36Hz, 4Hz lower than the old model. Total Q
increases to 0.33 making this new Alpair 10 usable in larger audio applications.
This driver uses an all-new Multi-form cone design and U cap with a new more efficient
profiles giving improved high range performance. Additional features include a new
advanced Nomex super-light rear suspension (spider) and a special aluminium rectangle
wire wound coil, both reduce the mass of the power-train. The Alpair 10ʻs frame has a new
mix of polymers for the frame, making it 10% stiffer than the old model. New connector sets
allow for remote soldering of cables, installation is easy. .
Attachments
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Just design a horn with a cutoff 1 octave below 1000 hz. with the volvotreter program and then build it. horn will be smaller when so high, I do not now a bass unit will fit then.
I do not now if directivity will be better without a faseplug, it will do better with it.
regards
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