So suggest another measurement. Suggest a mechanism, suggest a DIY fix anyone with a few bucks can try. Don't join the rickrolling going on.
Always the same old BS from you.
BTW, how do you like it when I do that to you like you do to me? How does it feel? Make you want to cooperate? Didn't think so.
Besides, I don't have to defend the Electromagnetic Compatibility literature. If you want to deny it, then you are making the extraordinary claim.
Jeez, Bill. Seems like I've gone though it over and over again in this forum. Nobody has any idea at all?
You keep making a big deal out of things that have no direct effect on what you hear from your speakers. At least not in a well designed system.
EMC, RFI, etc., if they even are present and picked up on the power cord never make it past the power supply. They simply have no affect on the audio output regardless of the type of power cord you use.
Sorry, small != zero
Next will you claim that ground loops don't exist?
Besides, I already described one example in this thread of a way (not necessarily the only way) AC line ground noise can bypass the power supply. It doesn't have to go through the power supply to have an effect. You don't know anything about how that stuff can happen due to already well known physical reasons?
Next will you claim that ground loops don't exist?
Besides, I already described one example in this thread of a way (not necessarily the only way) AC line ground noise can bypass the power supply. It doesn't have to go through the power supply to have an effect. You don't know anything about how that stuff can happen due to already well known physical reasons?
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I can't believe that someone has not brought up this landmark article from 1980 that Walt Jung and Richard Marsh wrote. This is THE article on how different capacitors sound. There is another article in The Audio Amateur that Walt and John Curl wrote about capacitors with a test and measurements.
https://www.dadaelectronics.eu/uplo...ctronics-papers/Picking-Capacitors-W-Jung.pdf
No, you are still mixing up two entirely different things.
AC noise, normally manifested as a clearly identifiable 60 hertz hum, can certainly get though to the audio section in certain grounding situations. That's not normal, but it can happen. And when it does happen it is clearly heard.
But that's entirely different from claiming that the AC power cord can have any affect on the quality of the audio signal itself.
I do enjoy the fact that there is an attempt to measure what is happening. So, kudos to Amir. But he misses the real issue.
It is unfortunate that those on both sides of this fence do not understand what is technically going on.
Of course, ignorance stops nobody.
John
You mean this one?
the last time i saw where someone said "I did" means that you did what it is you said you did...and seeing as you didn't do it, but you said you did, its a lie..
I followed the link you quoted at it led to the post at: https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/power-conditioners-and-cords.391921/post-7231386
What I said was "Go back and listen to youtube video I did that compares two power cords."
Maybe it would have been more clear if I added two words to clarify what was said up to that point. To wit: Go back and listen to the same youtube video I did that compares two power cords.
So, before that there was this post: https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/power-conditioners-and-cords.391921/post-7223120
And before that: https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/power-conditioners-and-cords.391921/post-7223080
Don't see how it would make sense to have that conversation where I told Rick: "Neither one of the versions sounded right. Now we need details. And I would like a copy of the tracks so I can know what they are really supposed to sound like," if I recorded the crap video. What I did do was listen to it.
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So please explain what you think the real issue is and what you claim people don't understand about it.
A nice post on a different forum.
..dare I post this?…yeah why not. I’m a retired EE that didn’t listen to the podcast nor did I read all the predictable pro/anti responses. First let me say that this whole cable brouhaha isn’t life or death any more than the logic behind car purchase, etc. if someone wants to spend drawerfuls of cash on cables and has the means then WHOGAF..I mean literally why should anyone get their panties in a twist?…it’s their money right? As I said above I’m a retired EE having worked in power distribution for 40 years and am as skeptic as it comes re tweaks. Several years ago regarding the PC debate I thought what the heck I’ll see for myself. I borrowed a couple of “exotic” power cords from a local dealer and did the A/B thing. Much to my surprise there was a difference…who’d have guessed! Long story shorter I bought a compliment of used Lessloss power cords, 5 in total for about $300 each and have never looked back. Can I explain exactly why they sound better than the OEM cables with some sort of RLC deep dive? Nope not really and I don’t care to. This is not an attempt to sway anyone re the efficacy of upgrading PCs…to each his or her own as they say. Well anyway that’s my story and I’m sticking with it. Now back to enjoying my music..LOL..
..dare I post this?…yeah why not. I’m a retired EE that didn’t listen to the podcast nor did I read all the predictable pro/anti responses. First let me say that this whole cable brouhaha isn’t life or death any more than the logic behind car purchase, etc. if someone wants to spend drawerfuls of cash on cables and has the means then WHOGAF..I mean literally why should anyone get their panties in a twist?…it’s their money right? As I said above I’m a retired EE having worked in power distribution for 40 years and am as skeptic as it comes re tweaks. Several years ago regarding the PC debate I thought what the heck I’ll see for myself. I borrowed a couple of “exotic” power cords from a local dealer and did the A/B thing. Much to my surprise there was a difference…who’d have guessed! Long story shorter I bought a compliment of used Lessloss power cords, 5 in total for about $300 each and have never looked back. Can I explain exactly why they sound better than the OEM cables with some sort of RLC deep dive? Nope not really and I don’t care to. This is not an attempt to sway anyone re the efficacy of upgrading PCs…to each his or her own as they say. Well anyway that’s my story and I’m sticking with it. Now back to enjoying my music..LOL..
In the modern world, AC Line Noise includes a lot of RFI/EMI from many sources. Even a few decades ago a vacuum cleaner brush motor was like a spark gap noise generator connected to the AC line. RFI/EMI ingress is well described in the Electromagnetic Compatibility literature, such as Ott. Ingress does not have to happen by passage through rectifiers and filter caps. There are various 'sneak paths' including due to mode conversion in single-ended interconnects now with AC line ground noise currents flowing through the shields. If you don't know about any of this stuff, Ott is a good place to start. Its not necessarily everything, but still highly recommended.
EDIT: Another good book is still an active IEEE publication: "Grounds for Grounding" Only caveat is that discussion of split ground planes goes back to the days before DACs with 100Mhz clocks. For more modestly clocked Nyquist dacs it may very well still be valid on the split ground plane issue. On all other issues, I think its a keeper too.
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You continue to dance around the issue rather than addressing it directly. So I'll try again to get you to focus.
The question is not whether some AC component can sneak around the power supply of an amplifier and make its way to the output, thus adding some hum to the music. We all acknowledge that, while rare, it is a possibility. So please don't repeat again what is in your post quoted above. It accomplishes nothing.
The issue you continue to avoid is whether an AC line cord can affect the signal quality, other than extraneous hum, of the music. Claims are being made by you and others that essentially the frequency response, aka tonal aspects, of the amplifier can be affected by the AC line cord. Yet, there is no plausible explanation for this happen from an amplifier design perspective.
So if you can provide an explanation, please do. Short of that many of us here reject the idea that you are hearing anything different by simply changing the AC line cord of the amplifier.
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