Hello everybody,
I've a company creation project, to produce an high end plasma speaker, not talking of those" arcs" or "sparks" toys on youtube...
but something with good distortion and sound levels specs.
I own plasma speakers, and I have work for years on cold and hot plasmas.
I'm interested in what you would really like...
Any requirements, features, design ideas are welcome (Wich sound input you would like etc...)
Technicals specifications :
(a full range is a dream but not achievable due to excessive power consumption)
Low cutoff frequency :
Price :
Wich price would you accept to buy a pair ?
Thanks for your comments.
Pa
I've a company creation project, to produce an high end plasma speaker, not talking of those" arcs" or "sparks" toys on youtube...
but something with good distortion and sound levels specs.
I own plasma speakers, and I have work for years on cold and hot plasmas.
I'm interested in what you would really like...
Any requirements, features, design ideas are welcome (Wich sound input you would like etc...)
Technicals specifications :
(a full range is a dream but not achievable due to excessive power consumption)
Low cutoff frequency :
Price :
Wich price would you accept to buy a pair ?
Thanks for your comments.
Pa
Few weeks back I was at Capital Audiofest. There was huge speaker, german I believe, with plasma tweeter. Guy was bragging that it does not generate ozon. Supposedly germans run it so hot, even ozon falls appart. At least that's what he said. Speakers sounded great.
But so were many others without plasma tweeter.
Most of the oldfarts here does not hear past 12kHz, whats the point to have 50kHz output.
But so were many others without plasma tweeter.
Most of the oldfarts here does not hear past 12kHz, whats the point to have 50kHz output.
(...a full range is a dream but not achievable due to excessive power consumption)
A midrange-tweeter,
Power consumption increase stongly in lowering the cutoff frequency
So wich frequency will be right for you ?
Ozone is a problem with cold plasma speakers like Nelson Pass did.
It smells the photocopier, the thunder..
Ozone is destroyed by high température in the hot plasma cell.
The project is a hot plasma so not a problem.
True !
Thanks to the technology,
That's a good start for a speaker !
You are right,
You can go higher than 100Khz but that's not the point, (or not directly).
No membrane means no mass, no membrane deformation, no résonance, excellent transient reproduction.
No sound coloration or signature, natural sounding, that's the point.
Are you asking what we would pay retail or what we would pay as DIYers?
You haven't given much guidance on what frequency range is actually feasible. As a wish, being able to cover the midrange and up with a single source is appealing.
For a retail product comparison, the Martin Logan ESL 11A uses the electrostatic panel from 300 Hz and up, and retails for around US$6000 each.
Their ESL 9 is about $3800 each, and the electrostatic covers from 380 Hz and up.
You haven't given much guidance on what frequency range is actually feasible. As a wish, being able to cover the midrange and up with a single source is appealing.
For a retail product comparison, the Martin Logan ESL 11A uses the electrostatic panel from 300 Hz and up, and retails for around US$6000 each.
Their ESL 9 is about $3800 each, and the electrostatic covers from 380 Hz and up.
What exactly do you mean by a hot plasma?
https://www.plasma-universe.com/plasma-classification-types-of-plasma/
“A plasma is sometimes referred to as being “hot” if it is nearly fully ionized, or “cold” if only a small fraction, (for instance 1%) of the gas molecules are ionized, but other definitions of the terms “hot plasma” and “cold plasma” are common. Even in cold plasma the electron temperature is stll typically several thousand cetigrads.”
https://www.plasma-universe.com/plasma-classification-types-of-plasma/
“A plasma is sometimes referred to as being “hot” if it is nearly fully ionized, or “cold” if only a small fraction, (for instance 1%) of the gas molecules are ionized, but other definitions of the terms “hot plasma” and “cold plasma” are common. Even in cold plasma the electron temperature is stll typically several thousand cetigrads.”
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Sounds interesting but I guess as this is a commercial project we won’t get to hear about it. Otherwise I would have been interested to understand more about your approach, managing reliability issues from sputtering, tolerance to use in polluted atmospheres, stability of the plasma, etc.
- The easiest solution for managing reliability issues from sputtering Is making a cleaning and part replacement easy every for exemple 2000 hours of listening.
I have a design to test where there is no sputtering but is it the most important for you ? (Maybe?)
- using in polluted atmosphere is a problem on Corona DC discharges (N.Pass project) but it's a way for cleaning the atmosphere
- A plasma can be really stable, there is sometimes a startup phase of few seconds before.
Horn loading a plasma is obviously the most efficient..
Do you have any prefereence ?
Or something particular in mind ?
When looking at e.g. horn loaded plasma tweeters like e.g. Acapella, they are pretty narrow, but in general home theater systems cover 60 to 90 degrees.
Sound wise the old Magnat tweeter impressed me the most, but that also has to do with the inability to tune the Acapella.
I do want to point out that both these tweeters are very specific to integrate well physically. Hence the magnat on the top and the Acapella's integrated, with horn, in its own enclosure. Can you think of a way to offer a solution replacing a normal tweeter?
Seems that answer would make the direction clear.
Sound wise the old Magnat tweeter impressed me the most, but that also has to do with the inability to tune the Acapella.
I do want to point out that both these tweeters are very specific to integrate well physically. Hence the magnat on the top and the Acapella's integrated, with horn, in its own enclosure. Can you think of a way to offer a solution replacing a normal tweeter?
Seems that answer would make the direction clear.
Open flame is no option as it produces Ozon (Magnat had to stop producing because of this). If the heat can escape the Ozon will not fall apart. Therefor a cell of some kind would be best.
I would like to build a line array of small cells but would like to use only 1 oscillator for all of the units. In this case less heat per cell is beeing generated and therefor replacement of the electrodes is not required so often. Please think about usage as well and spare parts in the future (i have some vintage ionic speakers and it is hard to get spare parts for these now).
BTW in the older tweeters ceramics are used to react with the Ozon to neutralize it (cleaning of the cell is required after some time).
So make all user-serviceable parts easy to access in your design.
I would like to build a line array of small cells but would like to use only 1 oscillator for all of the units. In this case less heat per cell is beeing generated and therefor replacement of the electrodes is not required so often. Please think about usage as well and spare parts in the future (i have some vintage ionic speakers and it is hard to get spare parts for these now).
BTW in the older tweeters ceramics are used to react with the Ozon to neutralize it (cleaning of the cell is required after some time).
So make all user-serviceable parts easy to access in your design.
Hello Lampie,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts !
I agree, glad to see that some people understand that don't always produce ozone..
It is true that existing commercial products are not really user-serviceable !