Well, Istvan, I'm one of your folowers too. 🙂
And by my pov, your path looks so logical. Respect!
For Sonido's... other serious options for me are Fertin's Fullrange drivers. Field coils drivers, or not. LB8 or LB7 looks so fabulous.
Do you mind posting more details about your serial crossover? I would be very grateful! Thanks!
Kiril
And by my pov, your path looks so logical. Respect!
For Sonido's... other serious options for me are Fertin's Fullrange drivers. Field coils drivers, or not. LB8 or LB7 looks so fabulous.
Do you mind posting more details about your serial crossover? I would be very grateful! Thanks!
Kiril
Hi,
did some fine tuning in order to get the proportions right, and things are getting better and better 😀
One thing is clear: no matter how many mids and highs I "allow", this FR is never sharp or shouty. I'm really impressed.
Further: there is never a confusion or chaos, no matter how complex the music is.
In the xo I now use a toroidal inductor, but tomorrow I will try it with an iron core thingie - I suppose there will be an improvement in the bass range. Not that it's bad or so, but it behaves not so lively as I'm used to with iron core inductor. The bass itself is very detailed, and deep too - but the EA15A had/has a "fake" bass extension between 25-35 Hz, which is not here with the SB. But I think, this lack of the fake bass improves the bass quality.
And of course I will try a parallel xo too, even if I'm satisfied with the result until now.
It's so much fun 😀
did some fine tuning in order to get the proportions right, and things are getting better and better 😀
One thing is clear: no matter how many mids and highs I "allow", this FR is never sharp or shouty. I'm really impressed.
Further: there is never a confusion or chaos, no matter how complex the music is.
In the xo I now use a toroidal inductor, but tomorrow I will try it with an iron core thingie - I suppose there will be an improvement in the bass range. Not that it's bad or so, but it behaves not so lively as I'm used to with iron core inductor. The bass itself is very detailed, and deep too - but the EA15A had/has a "fake" bass extension between 25-35 Hz, which is not here with the SB. But I think, this lack of the fake bass improves the bass quality.
And of course I will try a parallel xo too, even if I'm satisfied with the result until now.
It's so much fun 😀
You might want to try copper ribbon air core inductor for best sound regarding bass and low distortion. Bit depends on how many mH that is. I have found iron plate cores to sound quite nice on a woofer despite what people may think of iron core inductors.
Yes, would be good I think, but I couldn't find any with 10 mH (here in Europe); Jantzen has/had it but it's not available (anymore?).
However, I've also found that iron (plate) core gives the best result in the bass range - and a (no matter how) cored one the worst result in the upper mids and highs.
However, I've also found that iron (plate) core gives the best result in the bass range - and a (no matter how) cored one the worst result in the upper mids and highs.
I know but we are talking about a ribbon (or foil) inductor, and it's completely different.
Normal air cores are readily available.
Thanks! The links are dead but I've found the homepage.
I have iron core inductors so it's not a problem, but they have air core foil inductors too, and this is very interesting, I will consider it.
but the price skyrocket ....https://www.mundorf.com/audio/en/shop/coils/air_coils/mcoil_vlcu/MCoil--VLCU15--Aircore-CopperFoil-Paper/?card=4415
there are low R too ,btw resistence ad some Qes not bad for ob...
Yes, the price... But the problem has now disappeared (I was actually almost sure from the beginning and Viet also hinted at it), the iron core inductor just sounds better (to me). It delivers more energy in the bass range, it is lively and doesn't seem slowed down. I have now tried the iron core in a parallel xo, now follows another trial with the iron core in the serial xo. Currently I'm leaning towards the parallel xo being more lively overall, which is more in line with my taste. But let's wait for further results.
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Nothing what I could hear - so no 😀
I know, it's not very scientific, but I diy for my ears/brain, so if they like it - it's done.
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I have iron core inductor janzen in bafflestep (2way) sound is good ,but non air ad thd in some test on web ...
The advantage of the iron plate core inductors is the short length of wire due to inherently higher inductances achieved with a core. The shorter wires means lower Dc resistance so you get max current relative to longer wires on air core. The bass sensitivity is typically more noticeable than the higher order distortions iron core may have. There is a non linear distortion effect with iron core that has to do with memory effects following a very large peak pulse of bass signal. It magnetizes the core a bit and saturates it so that if another peak comes through before that relaxes, you may get clipping following the first pulse. I have only seen this in a large EI core inductor that served as a Class A choke loaded inductor for one of my SE Class A amps. I have not heard it on a speaker crossover yet but imagine that it might exist.
Work continues...
After the q&d trials I started the more "sofisticated" way and measured the drivers without xo in the baffle - and the result was of course completely different compared to the factory diagrams... But I already knew that it comes that way, so no surprise. I started two simulations parallel, feeded the one with the factory data, the other with my measurements, changed the parts until everything looked good. If you go this way: don't be surprised if the sim shows the FR (f e.) needs inverted phase - no, it doesn't, it's just the difference between data and reality. Xo finished, measured okay, and sounded bad 😀 as expected. The 2145 required an inductor, so I tried it with the 1808 too - that's it, it requires a parallel inductor. Funny, but the graph in the sim only changes 1-2 dB, but the difference in the sound is huge.
I think the parallel xo will be finished soon 😀
After the q&d trials I started the more "sofisticated" way and measured the drivers without xo in the baffle - and the result was of course completely different compared to the factory diagrams... But I already knew that it comes that way, so no surprise. I started two simulations parallel, feeded the one with the factory data, the other with my measurements, changed the parts until everything looked good. If you go this way: don't be surprised if the sim shows the FR (f e.) needs inverted phase - no, it doesn't, it's just the difference between data and reality. Xo finished, measured okay, and sounded bad 😀 as expected. The 2145 required an inductor, so I tried it with the 1808 too - that's it, it requires a parallel inductor. Funny, but the graph in the sim only changes 1-2 dB, but the difference in the sound is huge.
I think the parallel xo will be finished soon 😀
Hi,
as I thought, the parallel xo is almost finished... but then...
I stumbled again in my office/workshop across the two SB 12OBs, that have been mounted in baffles for two years (it occurs at least twice a week...) so I thought, why not?
I quickly mounted them, connected them in parallel with the 15OB and now I'm evaluating them.
I don't get any deeper tones, of course, but the ones I do get are wonderfully detailed, energetic and provide a much more stable foundation.
Very interesting 😀
as I thought, the parallel xo is almost finished... but then...
I stumbled again in my office/workshop across the two SB 12OBs, that have been mounted in baffles for two years (it occurs at least twice a week...) so I thought, why not?
I quickly mounted them, connected them in parallel with the 15OB and now I'm evaluating them.
I don't get any deeper tones, of course, but the ones I do get are wonderfully detailed, energetic and provide a much more stable foundation.
Very interesting 😀
Hi,
there are many trials and errors to be done, I have now made the first trial and I think I can build on this basis. I built and measured a 1st order series xo. The xo consists of just 2 components, 4.7 mH for the two parallel woofers, 42 uF for the 1808. Sure, it's not perfect yet, but it sounds pretty good. Next I have to tame the FR a bit. Here is the current measurement:
there are many trials and errors to be done, I have now made the first trial and I think I can build on this basis. I built and measured a 1st order series xo. The xo consists of just 2 components, 4.7 mH for the two parallel woofers, 42 uF for the 1808. Sure, it's not perfect yet, but it sounds pretty good. Next I have to tame the FR a bit. Here is the current measurement: