I think the results look pretty normal and comply with the sims. Which would make me rethink running these
arrays without any filter.
I think the 'needle like' directivity we get at 3.5 meter really is not that useful...
View attachment 1077274
Unless all the people in the household are exactly the same length.
Even though, checking plus/minus 10 cm looks kind of ok-ish (within +/- 1 dB up to 10 K):
View attachment 1077275
These are the responses at 3.3m at various heights. In-room.
The results look quite independent from the listening heights, don't they?
I think I'll try them with a simple 3x3 series parallel connection...
"The Super-Conductor" is actually a really good music pun, too.Actually when I designed these speakers I was inspired by the 9-cell superconducting cavities I work with
View attachment 1077334
Later I discovered the existence of the Scaena!
Manuele
I don't think they track each other all that well, but then again... that's a pretty wide margin to check, I think about 20 cm above and below the center of the array would be the listening window that tracks best (according to the sim). Try to smooth these plots with the Psy smoothing and put them on top of each other to compare. If they deviate over a larger area than it could be quite audible. if they continue to meet each other in the middle while deviating a bit up and down, that's way less audible.
Basically the worst spot to measure an array like this. This is where there are the largest differences between the drivers, thus you'll see dips and peaks.
At several frequencies the drivers will be out of phase from each other.
But... stuffing the cabs can help cure the dips/peaks that come from within (internal reflections) and they can largely be avoided. Check the impedance
.
I agree @wesayso .
My array should be listened at least 4/5 times its length for better results. I measured the nearfield because @TNT asked and also for my curiosity
I am learning a lot on this DIY audio journey and this is priceless!
I'll check the impedance after the vacation, so in September... I'll enjoy them as is for now...
My array should be listened at least 4/5 times its length for better results. I measured the nearfield because @TNT asked and also for my curiosity
I am learning a lot on this DIY audio journey and this is priceless!
I'll check the impedance after the vacation, so in September... I'll enjoy them as is for now...
Basically the worst spot to measure an array like this. This is where there are the largest differences between the drivers, thus you'll see dips and peaks.
At several frequencies the drivers will be out of phase from each other.
But... stuffing the cabs can help cure the dips/peaks that come from within (internal reflections) and they can largely be avoided. Check the impedance
I'll try to re-measure in +/- 20 cm range around the array center and plot the results.
Et voila'
.I measured the vertical response at 4.25m (14f) at different heights, from 46" to 58" every inch (2.5cm).
For space problems I cannot measure below 46 "or above 58".
I have already measured the horizontal response for the whole listening position (more than 2m) and there are no significant variations, so I decided to measure the vertical response at one position only.
Quite tiring to do, but I think I got some important information.
The maximum gap is around 5 dB between the highest and lowest (12" of vertical response).
Manuele
Last night I spent a good hour listening to my new speakers at the listening position.
I was very impressed with the overall clarity, detail and power handling of this stuff ... I can't imagine how the 25 drivers with a serious amplification version might sound like!
I just experienced the thrill of listening to music at an almost unreasonable volume (97/100+ dB at the listening position, dBc weighted, more than 4.5m from the speaker) for an hour with no audible distortion or fatigue e this was one of my goals for this project...
In my humble opinion, My-Fi, a good speaker must be able to play at the volume you want effortlessly while remaining clear and transparent with a realistic image. This stuff makes every single instrument appear on the phantom stage, so my horizontal measurements didn't lie!
I can't wait to start the sound enhancement phase with DPS / correction as well as some tests to magnify the vertical response a bit (although, to be honest, it doesn't seem of the utmost importance at least in my room).
I have tried to stand and the perceived high frequency differences are not a problem for my inexperienced ears. It really is a subtle difference, but there is.
Manuele
I was very impressed with the overall clarity, detail and power handling of this stuff ... I can't imagine how the 25 drivers with a serious amplification version might sound like!
I just experienced the thrill of listening to music at an almost unreasonable volume (97/100+ dB at the listening position, dBc weighted, more than 4.5m from the speaker) for an hour with no audible distortion or fatigue
e this was one of my goals for this project...In my humble opinion, My-Fi, a good speaker must be able to play at the volume you want effortlessly while remaining clear and transparent with a realistic image. This stuff makes every single instrument appear on the phantom stage, so my horizontal measurements didn't lie!
I can't wait to start the sound enhancement phase with DPS / correction as well as some tests to magnify the vertical response a bit (although, to be honest, it doesn't seem of the utmost importance at least in my room).
I have tried to stand and the perceived high frequency differences are not a problem for my inexperienced ears. It really is a subtle difference, but there is.
Manuele
Back from vacation a little while ago!
Just a photo of the completed "9 Cells Pipe Array" in place.
At the moment I must say that both my wife and I are quite satisfied with both the aesthetic result (the one that interested my wife most) and acoustic.
Soon I'll take as many measures as possible to understand how and where I can intervene to improve the polar response.
Question: I would like to play a bit with DSP and I was wondering which is the most suitable solution for my case.
My current listening chain is quite simple: streaming of Tidal on iPhone via AirPlay2 on the Marantz NR1200 Network Integrated Amp. I have two subwoofers placed close to the "9 Cell Pipe Arrays".
The ideal solution would be to avoid adding unnecessary DA / AD conversions, so I would like to do everything in the digital domain.
I have read something about CamillaDPS and I have used (very little) EQAPO in the past by connecting the laptop to my integrated.
Other solutions? I would like to have the opportunity to manage 4 channels (2 main + 2 subwoofer).
Thanks in advance!
Manuele
Just a photo of the completed "9 Cells Pipe Array" in place.
At the moment I must say that both my wife and I are quite satisfied with both the aesthetic result (the one that interested my wife most
) and acoustic.Soon I'll take as many measures as possible to understand how and where I can intervene to improve the polar response.
Question: I would like to play a bit with DSP and I was wondering which is the most suitable solution for my case.
My current listening chain is quite simple: streaming of Tidal on iPhone via AirPlay2 on the Marantz NR1200 Network Integrated Amp. I have two subwoofers placed close to the "9 Cell Pipe Arrays".
The ideal solution would be to avoid adding unnecessary DA / AD conversions, so I would like to do everything in the digital domain.
I have read something about CamillaDPS and I have used (very little) EQAPO in the past by connecting the laptop to my integrated.
Other solutions? I would like to have the opportunity to manage 4 channels (2 main + 2 subwoofer).
Thanks in advance!
Manuele
For playing, I like the minidsp products. The 2x4HD is on their lower end of the budget, can take optical or usb in, then 4x analog out. If you like your DAC or want to play with DACs (like me) then its a bit harder. But that would let you optimize each line array, and add a sub or two if you want.
For my full range line array, the mindsp software looks like this:
There are upgraded units that can add Dirac on top of manual PEQ, Dirac was a big sound quality improvement I felt.
Eventually I will go the @wesayso route and do convolution based EQ in a HTPC. Minidsp was a great starting point, but I am ready to graduate. The good news is, there are a lot of free options for computer based DSP, that could compete or beat Dirac in sound quality (I feel).
If you are at a good place with MiniDSP and Dirac, just enjoy it! It's probably pretty close to what you need .
I've come to find out that HTPC is fun, but not without it's own draw-backs. Still working to let Win 10 play nice after years without trouble on Win 7 Pro.
A dedicated PC could be off the grid I guess and never in need of updates etc. That could be an answer that would make it closer to a closed box solution like MiniDSP.
.I've come to find out that HTPC is fun, but not without it's own draw-backs. Still working to let Win 10 play nice after years without trouble on Win 7 Pro.
A dedicated PC could be off the grid I guess and never in need of updates etc. That could be an answer that would make it closer to a closed box solution like MiniDSP.
In the last few months I made some changes to my source: now I stream Tidal via UPnP to an headless RPi 3B where I have installed MoOde Audio (and CamillaDSP accordingly).
The RPi 3B has a lot of computing power and runs cool and quiet without any problems ( I'm using a cool Aluminum case for passive cooling)
I'm using the HDMI output to take advantage of the Marantz internal DAC (at the moment...).
CamillaDSP allows me to use both IIR and FIR filters at the same time and I think this is a great solution!
I'm using IIR filters (low Q to avoid pre-ringing) in low frequency and then apply a FIR filter on the entire spectrum. Even using very few IIR filters I noticed a noticeable improvement in reducing room resonances and consequently clarity across the entire sound spectrum.
I'm still working on a way to make a FIR filter that doesn't give me audible problems (at the moment I used the inversion method with REW but it didn't give the desired results...).
Manuele.
The RPi 3B has a lot of computing power and runs cool and quiet without any problems ( I'm using a cool Aluminum case for passive cooling)
I'm using the HDMI output to take advantage of the Marantz internal DAC (at the moment...).
CamillaDSP allows me to use both IIR and FIR filters at the same time and I think this is a great solution!
I'm using IIR filters (low Q to avoid pre-ringing) in low frequency and then apply a FIR filter on the entire spectrum. Even using very few IIR filters I noticed a noticeable improvement in reducing room resonances and consequently clarity across the entire sound spectrum.
I'm still working on a way to make a FIR filter that doesn't give me audible problems (at the moment I used the inversion method with REW but it didn't give the desired results...).
Manuele.