I common SW procedure is UNIT-Testing then also automatic function testing... It will require a high effort but at the end, less known issue after any changes...
Testing is an art and should never bee done by the same developer... best by separated test team 😀
Wow. That shows too... KiCAD strikes me as a really mature product. At least in my experience the quirks/bugs are few and far between. That was the case even in the Rev. 5.99 nightly builds. I've used Protel, OrCAD, Altium, and various Cadence products for IC design in the past, many of them requiring kilo-buck licenses per seat per year and KiCAD performs just as well with fewer quirks/bugs. I'm sure there are things that the fancier tools support that KiCAD doesn't. Support for different BOM/build options would be nice, for example. But unless a client requires that I use a different tool (and is willing to pay for a license) I expect to be using KiCAD for all my boards going forward and will happily contribute to the project.
Tom
Tom
One snowy day this winter i’ll spend a day or so and give kicad a go, design a small pcb to start with. it looks to have features like cross probing, a Gerber viewer stuff that is more advanced features, seems to be mature enough.
That’s all my brain needs is another schematic editor to figure out, hopefully it’s better than the ltspice schematic editor 🙂
Schematic variants is a nice advance feature for BOM generation.
That’s all my brain needs is another schematic editor to figure out, hopefully it’s better than the ltspice schematic editor 🙂
Schematic variants is a nice advance feature for BOM generation.
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It's not too hard but it's software for a complex activity so accept that it's going to take some effort to learn. There are a few things that I found could be better in v5 and below:
All in all, for free software, it has come a long way, and frankly, I can't complain: there's no limitation on the size of the PCB like in some other software (e.g. free for so many points and x-by-y size, but pay to remove the limitations). It is supported by CERN and many others, it is scriptable with Python, etc... The 3D visualisation feature is great too.
It's a no-brainer to use this if you want to learn to make PCBs and create some great ones.
I am looking forward to installing the latest version and continuing to learn with it.
- it feels like a bunch of different specialised software rather than one integrated software. That's exactly what it is so it's not a full surprise, but you do feel like things are disconnected and you'd like more seamless integration
- there was no default way for rounding trace corners
- there are many menu buttons in some of the software. This could be simplified/limited to the most important
- space taken by the software + libraries is huge
- can't import an LTSpice schematic
All in all, for free software, it has come a long way, and frankly, I can't complain: there's no limitation on the size of the PCB like in some other software (e.g. free for so many points and x-by-y size, but pay to remove the limitations). It is supported by CERN and many others, it is scriptable with Python, etc... The 3D visualisation feature is great too.
It's a no-brainer to use this if you want to learn to make PCBs and create some great ones.
I am looking forward to installing the latest version and continuing to learn with it.
The software package is large (6.5 GB in my installation) but the libraries are pretty small. My custom libraries take up an entire 500 kB.
Storage is practically free these days. Even the 10 TB enterprise drives I use in my NAS were 'only' about $200 (CAD) each about a year ago. So complaining about storage seems a bit like nit-picking.
I don't feel like booting Windoze at the moment so I can't see how much space Altium takes up, but I bet it's sizeable.
Tom
Altium is 6GB for core program only. The libraries is on the cloud. So KiCad and Altium taken the same amount of data space. Can you list some examples about quirks/bugs on Altium? I use it for two years in my current job and it seems very smooth and productive, at least on relative new workstation laptop. The only problem is when editing some old projects (created in 2013 I think), the pcb files have some issues with design rules due to some software change, for example Air Gap Width previously controlled by Clearance rule is now controlled by Polygon Connect Style rule's newly introduced Air Gap Width. But Altium also issue a warning when I open that project, so it is fine.
I use KiCad for my personal project. Compare to Altium (at work) or Cadence Allegro/Orcad (which I could access when still at Uni), KiCad lacks some aspects like variant build options, ME/EE co-design, auto-generated CAM/documentation, BOM management, signal integrity tools and simulation with priority model (in case of Cadence SW). But for hobby use, KiCad is great.
$200 isn't exactly free. The size taken can be a problem with laptops with smaller HDDs or SSDs as default since Windows itself is bloatware. My case: HP laptop with Win default dual-boot with Linux, add coding environment and libs, GBs of data to do research on, documents and educational videos, and space starts cramping really fast these days.
However, we did snag a 10TB for $180, which I've partitioned for my wife and I, so it's less of a problem for me currently although it means working on the main PC server if I install it there and not the current laptop. It's fine.
I'll see how much I can move from the laptop to the TB store, and if it's enough, I should be able to install KiCAD v6 on the laptop itself.
Components are costly currently, but PCBs seem to be still quite cheap to make at a fab, so I might do more of that.
The fact that there are 2-3 different ways of opening a file that produce different results (even though they all open the file) for one. I haven't done enough work in Altium to comment further on usability.
Yep. You do get more once you pay $5k/seat/year.
No, but nobody says you have to have 10 TB either.
My case: MacBook Pro with 500 GB SSD (370+ GB free) and data on a NAS. I run Windoze in VMware for the few times I need to use it. Once I move to Apple's silicon I'll probably set up a pee-see with VMware vSphere for running Windoze virtual machines. Or Remote Desktop into the Windoze PC that runs my APx555.
Tom
True, true. What I really should have done is get a larger SSD with the laptop at the time I bought it, knowing that I would need large data for research. The plan was to upgrade it eventually and there's an M.2 slot free inside, so that would be an interesting option.
It's one of those HP Pavilion laptops with a Ryzen 5 and an NVIDIA GeForge GTX card.
But you're right, space does look like a non-issue, it's just you need to be aware of it prior to installing KiCAD, that's all. After all, I make the same case for DSD files which is my preferred format to listen to digital music, especially DSD256. This means several GBs per song...
Yep, great way of proceeding. Haven't tried it on Winblows lately as I'm more of a macHead and Unix/LinuxHead and myself. Super easy to set up on macOS, I will try it laptop remotely accessing the PC server and see what happens with KiCAD.
I had another look at Kicad 6.x. Well, meanwhile there are some valve models available. But what i miss is something generic: in LTSPICE it is possibleto use a generic symbol in the schematic editor and underpin that with a suitable model for spice. This makes it easy to import models of "third parties" like the ones disussed here in the forum. Is there any similar option in Kicad/ngspice?
And the library provided is pretty small - to me it just serves for the 1st steps of the learning curve.
Is there any documentation how to extend that? There are many more relevant power tubes than just the EL84 and EL34. And in the small signal collection even the ECC82 is missing!
Is there any documentation which spice models are beeing used and how to "switch" them, e.g. to start with some relatively simple models for "standard" tasks to more elaborate one or models for special cases (starved mode, grid currents...) Again, that is straightforward in LTSPICE, but upon 1st scans through the docs i did not find anything for kicad/ngspice - and something like this is important for the general usability of such a tool.
What i also found surprising: the grids are usually describe as "inputs" and the anode as an "output". Mhmm, actually all electrodes have both properties, and it is often important to model them (i.e., the grid currents). Common example: power stage in AB2 mod, checking the G2-current in power pentodes in ANY pentode or quasi pentode power stage.
And the library provided is pretty small - to me it just serves for the 1st steps of the learning curve.
Is there any documentation how to extend that? There are many more relevant power tubes than just the EL84 and EL34. And in the small signal collection even the ECC82 is missing!
Is there any documentation which spice models are beeing used and how to "switch" them, e.g. to start with some relatively simple models for "standard" tasks to more elaborate one or models for special cases (starved mode, grid currents...) Again, that is straightforward in LTSPICE, but upon 1st scans through the docs i did not find anything for kicad/ngspice - and something like this is important for the general usability of such a tool.
What i also found surprising: the grids are usually describe as "inputs" and the anode as an "output". Mhmm, actually all electrodes have both properties, and it is often important to model them (i.e., the grid currents). Common example: power stage in AB2 mod, checking the G2-current in power pentodes in ANY pentode or quasi pentode power stage.
The Symbol Editor is used to extend the symbol libraries. But any dual triode will have the same symbol, so you don't really need another one.
When you want to provide a specific SPICE model for a symbol (which will be most of the time for anything other than a passive R, L or C), edit the Symbol Properties and click the "Simulation Model..." button. You can then pick one of the built-in models (which will be limited if they exist at all for valves), or pick a file with your favourite LTSPICE model in it. (In 6.99 you can also type in a specific SPICE model, but I'm not sure if that's available in 6.0.9 or not.)
When you want to provide a specific SPICE model for a symbol (which will be most of the time for anything other than a passive R, L or C), edit the Symbol Properties and click the "Simulation Model..." button. You can then pick one of the built-in models (which will be limited if they exist at all for valves), or pick a file with your favourite LTSPICE model in it. (In 6.99 you can also type in a specific SPICE model, but I'm not sure if that's available in 6.0.9 or not.)
V6.0.11 is released, more fixes. The Windows build should be around tomorrow
https://www.kicad.org/blog/2023/01/KiCad-6.0.11-Release/
https://www.kicad.org/blog/2023/01/KiCad-6.0.11-Release/
I downloaded and installed V6.0.11 this morning, quick check everything looks OK. It seems to load a bit quicker.