No, it was this:
Introducing Aries Cerat | Stereophile.com
A bit silly looking, but doesn't suffer from the colorations that I hear on the Avantgarde Horns.
IMHO, here's why:
The Avantgarde horns sell for as much as a car, but their drivers are fairly pedestrian. The horns I'm currently building use $300 worth of BMS for their tweeters; Avantgarde uses a $22 compression driver in their $10,000 speaker. Literally one of the cheapest options available; for $10 or $20 more you can do so much better. But they obviously cut corners here.
In a nutshell, they're putting about $600 worth of parts in a box and charging $10,000 for it. Their engineering doesn't look too bad, but there's only so much you can do with a budget like that.
The Aries horn is clearly a "cost no object" exercise, with top of the line drivers across the board, and what appears to be well constructed LeCleach horns. The system also costs 30x as much as what Avantgarde wants.
Introducing Aries Cerat | Stereophile.com
A bit silly looking, but doesn't suffer from the colorations that I hear on the Avantgarde Horns.
IMHO, here's why:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
The Avantgarde horns sell for as much as a car, but their drivers are fairly pedestrian. The horns I'm currently building use $300 worth of BMS for their tweeters; Avantgarde uses a $22 compression driver in their $10,000 speaker. Literally one of the cheapest options available; for $10 or $20 more you can do so much better. But they obviously cut corners here.
In a nutshell, they're putting about $600 worth of parts in a box and charging $10,000 for it. Their engineering doesn't look too bad, but there's only so much you can do with a budget like that.
The Aries horn is clearly a "cost no object" exercise, with top of the line drivers across the board, and what appears to be well constructed LeCleach horns. The system also costs 30x as much as what Avantgarde wants.
Eek, Avantgarde may be using a piezo tweeter. In a $10,000 speaker. Yowza. The pic above, of the KSN-1142, is a better match to Avantgarde's drawing.
I didn't like at all the bass of their last you linked above (the white avantgarde): booooooooomy in relation to the upper registers !
I was wrong, they're not using a cheap Eminence or CTS compression driver.
They're using a B&C DE7, which is quite nice:
I could tell when I found a larger picture of the AvantGarde:
They're using a B&C DE7, which is quite nice:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I could tell when I found a larger picture of the AvantGarde:
I found it very directive as well (poor sweet spot) : don't undurstand this speaker had a price !
the loved sound of the bigger Avantgarde is maybe due to the Community driver with phenomelic driver and huge efficienty ?
the loved sound of the bigger Avantgarde is maybe due to the Community driver with phenomelic driver and huge efficienty ?
They probably use a 10x markup, instead of the more common 4x ;-)
I do not know their current line up very well, but Avantgarde mounted fairly decent Beyma drivers (ao) in their older models.
These Aries Cerat speakers are unusual:
The Aries Cerat Symphonia is a 3-way hornspeaker combining a Raal aluminum-foil ribbon tweeter loaded into a "zero-diffraction 360° continuous flare horn" made of solid wood. The equivalent midrange horn loads a 4" Titanium driver with 11kg motor whose output can be altered via a multi-tap transformer.
The midbass/bass horn is a 3m long rear horn with large mouth area and "true Tractrix flare formed by stacked sheets of Plywood without any internal sharp angles or geometric deviations from the flare".
The external crossover "consists of three constant group delay filters which in combination with physical time alignment create near-perfect time response and ±0.5dB amplitude linearity from 250Hz-20kHz".
Sensitivity is 101dB, claimed response (-3dB) is 32Hz to 100kHz, weight is 150kg/ea. and dimensions are 93 x 130 x 88cm WxHxD.
The Fostex full rangers appear to be vintage drivers. The woodwork is stunning, as can be seen here:
http://www.monoandstereo.com/2016/01/aries-cerat-symphonia-horn-speakers.html
I do not know their current line up very well, but Avantgarde mounted fairly decent Beyma drivers (ao) in their older models.
These Aries Cerat speakers are unusual:
The Aries Cerat Symphonia is a 3-way hornspeaker combining a Raal aluminum-foil ribbon tweeter loaded into a "zero-diffraction 360° continuous flare horn" made of solid wood. The equivalent midrange horn loads a 4" Titanium driver with 11kg motor whose output can be altered via a multi-tap transformer.
The midbass/bass horn is a 3m long rear horn with large mouth area and "true Tractrix flare formed by stacked sheets of Plywood without any internal sharp angles or geometric deviations from the flare".
The external crossover "consists of three constant group delay filters which in combination with physical time alignment create near-perfect time response and ±0.5dB amplitude linearity from 250Hz-20kHz".
Sensitivity is 101dB, claimed response (-3dB) is 32Hz to 100kHz, weight is 150kg/ea. and dimensions are 93 x 130 x 88cm WxHxD.
The Fostex full rangers appear to be vintage drivers. The woodwork is stunning, as can be seen here:
http://www.monoandstereo.com/2016/01/aries-cerat-symphonia-horn-speakers.html
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Had a listen to some of the youtube demos of that one. This is prone to several errors though but I tried it anyway.
From what I heard I would say that I liked it with orchestral music and jazz. But I dind't like the examples with organ.
The build qualitiy is very nice (although I don't like the design as such). But the advertising is not free from marketing BS. I very much doubt that they can achieve flat group-delay with this topology combined with a passive crossover. Funny is also how they point out how hybrid systems would be lacking compared to "real" full-range horn systems, while the system being presented would also fall under the hybrid category IMHO.
This speaker is very off-topic BTW: It is definitely not an M2 and definitely not for the poor. 😉
Regrads
Charles
From what I heard I would say that I liked it with orchestral music and jazz. But I dind't like the examples with organ.
The build qualitiy is very nice (although I don't like the design as such). But the advertising is not free from marketing BS. I very much doubt that they can achieve flat group-delay with this topology combined with a passive crossover. Funny is also how they point out how hybrid systems would be lacking compared to "real" full-range horn systems, while the system being presented would also fall under the hybrid category IMHO.
This speaker is very off-topic BTW: It is definitely not an M2 and definitely not for the poor. 😉
Regrads
Charles
misconceptions
Thanks Pat, this trope seems to come up regularly and needs to be weeded out.
Best, Kris
Thanks Pat, this trope seems to come up regularly and needs to be weeded out.
Best, Kris
Very nice ! And the design looks more "domestic" than the original M2.
Hope there is not too much diffraction from the recessed baffle.
Regards
Charles
Hope there is not too much diffraction from the recessed baffle.
Regards
Charles
Re music for rain, still rainning in France : hop (pub) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4coKFq_lArk
C'est pas du Keith Jarett, but c'est pas mal as well !🙂
C'est pas du Keith Jarett, but c'est pas mal as well !🙂
There is supposed be quite a lot of diffraction with this recessed baffle and the distance from the woofer surround to the baffle edges.
Because of the size of both woofer and baffle the 'diffraction domain' should be quite small and low in frequency.
... and easy bellow the horn to surround the bass driver with foam (gym carpet for instance) to fill the gap, putt some blue grill on the foam et voilà !
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The mid driver looks like a $12 TC9FD - not a bad choice despite the price.
Nice catch!
So a DIY'er could basically recreate the mids and highs of their $16,000 speaker with less than $100 worth of drivers.
Tempting. I made some LeCleach horns a couple of years ago and they sounded very nice.
So a DIY'er could basically recreate the mids and highs of their $16,000 speaker with less than $100 worth of drivers.
Tempting. I made some LeCleach horns a couple of years ago and they sounded very nice.
The souvenir I have in the mid-high was good aout this Avantgarde despite being very directive vertically !
Possible to do better certainly with a Scan Speak 10F (according the tastes) and maybe also a Beyma compression or even a better B&C !
But if the TC9, it's certainly better to go for the Synergy design Weltersys tested with this driver at the Apex (no high end unit, the Vifa is FR here !)
Possible to do better certainly with a Scan Speak 10F (according the tastes) and maybe also a Beyma compression or even a better B&C !
But if the TC9, it's certainly better to go for the Synergy design Weltersys tested with this driver at the Apex (no high end unit, the Vifa is FR here !)
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