I am also still interested, but intrigued as to why Pano's digital rapid prototyping didn't give the expected results. I also know that having a box with a big red 'vinylise' button on would most certainly work.
i like vinyl > rest, but it's not about sound, it's about content - content is king. I'd rather listen to stuff over my iphone too, if for nothing but convenience, but, the dynamics are, uhm, ugh! what's the american meme? oh yea - "Com'on Man!" Are you kidding me? And who listens to a cd player straight up these days? I'll take LPs (on Rega or Michell TTs, Denon carts etc), then Laptop playing rips through DAC, then, oh, FM Radio?! Seriously.
Stylus ‘scrubbing’ translates into FM differently in the vertical and lateral planes. In the vertical plane, it is mainly dependent on the vertical tracking angle. In the horizontal plane, it is very much dependent on the arm’s offset angle. Less offset angle = less scrubbing.
Ray K
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Douglas I think there is a big interest in an analog box. We've just gotten a bit distracted with hearing the effect with DPS to understand what I may or may not do.
I think the digital prototype is a good idea. Find out what works best, then build an analog box. Many of us do that with crossovers. A sort of rapid prototyping, if you like.
I think the digital prototype is a good idea. Find out what works best, then build an analog box. Many of us do that with crossovers. A sort of rapid prototyping, if you like.
You know.... now that you say that, I have the feeling that digital servers will soon make the CD just as nostalgic as the LP. Having physical media lined up on a shelf, taking it down, opening the box...watching the tray slide out...etc.
If you are a straight razor guy you will know exactly what I mean when I say that pretty soon the CD will be to the double edge what the LP is to the cut-throat razor.
Throw away the remote for your CD player. It makes it more enjoyable. I got rid of my digital server because I couldn't make it through a whole album without jumping to something else. I think that's alot of the appeal with records as well, throw one on and relax until you have to flip it over.
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Getting old
I have been running my music from servers for around 5 years now. What I have noticed is the lack of occasion in selecting, playing and listening to music. As you say, even selecting a CD for playing is more involving than selecting an icon from a screen. Now if Doug Self can find a way of reintroducing occasion into the process he will be on a winner.🙂
I agree about the server being too easy, too frivolous maybe. But I have NO nostalgia for the CD. None.
The LP, the 78, tape, even radio. But not the CD, there was never an emotional connection to the medium for me.
The LP, the 78, tape, even radio. But not the CD, there was never an emotional connection to the medium for me.
Agree completely. Playing a Cd is totally uninvolving. The whole procedure with an LP, finishing with lowering the stylus into the groove and running back to the best listening position while the background rumble starts, made an event of the whole business.
Perhaps there is an opportunity here for training courses on how to enjoy music and to make music-listening slightly less industrial than the technology encourages.
Or scrubbing/fm distortion can be almost entirely mitigated by no offset angle linear tracing. The difference is not only measurable but night and day audible. And not those dreadful servoed arms, of course. The first way to minimize a lot of these distortions is flat vinyl, and tracing it in the same manner and tangent of which it was cut. Before that happens there is no tool that can fix and error at the source without IMHO wreaking another problem into the equation.
Colin
Colin
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Cool! I didn't see this thread until now and even if it's not old by any means it has already 64 pages 😎
I find it interesting that still people argue this vinyl vs. CD/digital debate.
While I'm sure that digital is superior to vinyl on a technical level, I'll stick to it as - at least for me - there's more to it. I like the mechanical aspect of turntables, the looks of them being at work, the large vinyl format with the nice carton sleeves. I miss all of these things with the CD already and much more with digital streams.
As music is about fun and I do get excellent sound out of vinyl, why use something else?
It also has a great DIY aspect that's not possible with digital media. With digital streams everything substantial happens in the chips and one needs a lot of mathematical background to understand what and why they do what they do. Not much to do with digital in a DIY sense.
Last, I also dislike the short lived mentality of everything digital that's superseded in only a few years.
I find it interesting that still people argue this vinyl vs. CD/digital debate.
While I'm sure that digital is superior to vinyl on a technical level, I'll stick to it as - at least for me - there's more to it. I like the mechanical aspect of turntables, the looks of them being at work, the large vinyl format with the nice carton sleeves. I miss all of these things with the CD already and much more with digital streams.
As music is about fun and I do get excellent sound out of vinyl, why use something else?
It also has a great DIY aspect that's not possible with digital media. With digital streams everything substantial happens in the chips and one needs a lot of mathematical background to understand what and why they do what they do. Not much to do with digital in a DIY sense.
Last, I also dislike the short lived mentality of everything digital that's superseded in only a few years.
Thank You!, 🙂.
I stand on the outside of this thread wondering why the heck very few are looking at the obvious but rather over engineering this hypothesis.
Colin
No, the Hypothesis is in the first post. It is a specific hypothesis. Sadly many jump in without reading it. There are other hypotheses, these deserve their own threads. IMO.
Thinking back to the first post, I can see some truth in it, try listening to any music in a anechoic chamber with total background silence its horrible....
I've got everything from a player piano to an Edison cylinder and on up to a server.
The LP is the one that gets it all right. Just enough ceremony to relax the user and give one a sense of "history." Combined with sound quality that is as good as anything else on the planet, the payoff is unmatched. And unless you have a laser turntable or some linear contraption with a remote, you have to sit and listen.
Older technologies like 78 and Edison cylinders are amazing because they are like peering into a time-telescope and hearing someone sing to you from 100 years ago...especially cylinders... but you have to imagine how the music really sounded.
So I think that's why a lot of people like LP over almost anything else.
I disagree. It's not what we are used to, but it has a lot of advantages. I speak from direct experience. The main thing missing is some ambiance from beside and behind you. But that can be added.
Does out of phase low frequency noise add to the ambiance and the enjoyment? Maybe. But it's probably room dependent.
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