Help me not destroy everything and cut my fingers off!

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And the hip bone is connected to the thigh bone.

The one thing that those little trim routers are not careful with is where they place the on-off switch. All of these tools are high speed. After a few jumping tool moments, I wrote "on" on the switch side for power to make sure it was off before I plugged it in.

Newer models have the switch on the top rather than the rocker switch on the side.

If I am envisioning that Harbor tool gadget correctly, I think you could fashion a plexiglass base to attach to the sub base of the router. Then adding a couple of knobs would increase the control.
 
You want a router that can swing a bigger bit safely. Like a half-inch bevel or roundover. Trim routers are for... ta-da.. trim. Half inch is as big as I would ever spin in a hand held. I built a table so I could swing a 3/4 roundover. It may swing a one inch, but that is getting close to shaper domain.
 
You want a router that can swing a bigger bit safely. Like a half-inch bevel or roundover. Trim routers are for... ta-da.. trim. Half inch is as big as I would ever spin in a hand held. I built a table so I could swing a 3/4 roundover. It may swing a one inch, but that is getting close to shaper domain.



BINGO!

trim routers like the little Harbor, small Porter Cables, Makita, Bosch, etc are good for laminate / veneer trimming, but even securely mounted to a table, are woefully under rated for any type of profiling bit larger than an 1/8" roundover - even if they don't bog down immediately, or chatter and jump right off the workpiece, their lifespan will be foreshortened

my daily go-to router is the Porter Cable 890 - heavier duty motor than the 690 and a fairly decent adjustable height base - it even has the power switch located on the top of motor housing, so when you place it upside down on the bench it automatically shuts off - why'd that take so long to figure out?

for spinning a really big bit by hand, there's no substitute for the mass of something like the 7518
 
I used to do all of my router hole cutting on a sacrificial table top. Clamping, etc was always a jury rig up to and including screwing the work piece to the to the table. Well, I still use the table, but I now put a piece of foam rubber shelf liner under the work piece and as long the work piece is larger that ~8" square, I don't use any hold-downs at all! Neither the work or the cut-out move. Occasionally, I'll get a small tit where the cut ends, but not on larger circles. A lot simpler that trying to keep clamps clear of the circle jig.

Bob
 
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Joined 2009
Thanks for any advice you can send my way.
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Be carefull with cheap routers - I just threw one into the trash and I will never bother with cheap tools again. I ALWAYS seem to finish up buying twice: first with the chunk that gives a bad job / is dangerous and then with a proper tool.

( Electric planers are another piece of equipment that are very dangerous. A good one (e.g a de Walt) have a groove in the blade that locks in. Cheap ones have a flat blade with all its associated risk of the blade working out. And when they come out it is like a bullet, I have first hand seen the reuslts of one of the blades coming out, it is not a pretty thing. )

When you buy bits and before you put them into the router clean the shaft of the bits with a degreaser e.g. aceton or white spirits. Otherwise, no matter how much you tighten the part on the router to hold the bit, the bit will work its way out.

With a router: always first test on scrap and always measure, measure and measure again.

The book mentioned by GM is good.
 
Thanks for all the great advice. I appreciate it.

So a little trim router can't even be used for cutting 5.5" holes in 1/2" MDF boards?

You're actually scaring me a little.

Just for clarity, I intend to simply cut a 5.5" (140mm) diameter hole in the baffle board, with the baffle board not yet affixed to the box. Then chamfer the holes 45 degrees from the back, per Mark Audio recommendation. If a round-over would be easier, then I guess I could do that.

I was hoping to then glue and clamp the baffle board (with the holes now cut) to the pre-existing baffle on an old speaker box. That's what the 18" clamps are for, to hold the baffle board onto the speaker box while I'm gluing them together.

I have some small clamps to hold down the new baffle boards while I work on them.

The driver could then be front-mounted (but not flush-mounted) to the baffle.

To achieve a flush mounting, I was thinking of then cutting a separate sort of baffle "cover" out of 1/2" plywood, with a 6.5" (165mm) hole to go around the bezel. That's meant to build the baffle up to be flush with the driver bezel. I guess I could use something softer, like dense foam, and cut the hole with a razor or something.

I read about that layered baffle approach in an old David Weems book. I know it would be better to use 3/4" MDF and cut a 5.5" hole, then rabbet the outside of the hole out to 6.5" diameter, to get the driver bezel flush with the baffle. But that seems to me to take more skill, bigger tools, etc.

Is this all completely wrong-headed? Or can it be done?

My goal is to use what I have and get a pair of Alpair 10.2's in these 8.5 liter sealed boxes, without destroying anything or hurting myself. I'm not looking to make professional grade cabs. For that, I'm going to get a pair of those Parts Express curved back cabs and get somebody to help me cut the baffle holes. I don't trust myself with a couple hundred dollars worth of cabinets!

Thanks again.

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Of course it can, you just have to make multiple passes. Tedious, but sometimes you have to make do with what you have.

All my recesses have been done with double baffles, though normally, the flush baffle was the base-plate for a cloth or screen grill depending on the app.

GM
 
Cutting holes is a minor job; might take 1 - 3 hours setting up the jig, but 10 - 15 minutes to make mutable passes.

Didn't read all the posts but a few more tips:

* don't be nervous, shaking at the wrong time is what you are trying to eliminate!

* nail two 24" square board together with one nail in center; a quick easy way to make a turntable; so you don't have to swing the router (this is much safer).

* Drill a 3/4" hole at the inside of your line, this is the starting point; you'll "drop" the bit into this hole as you make the passes.
 
Some don't have the option of spending a couple hundred. And I'm ;looking in the mirror when saying so. The advice above about making a trammel is good. Maybe if the original poster (OP) could make a picture from the Harbor Freight website, we could get a view of what we are talking about.

Again, if the device comes with or can use a 1/8 in. colett, then a spin drill, which is a cutter not a borer, could be used.

Using a lightweight tool and familiarization with the parts will be experience for getting a larger tool. I was one of those (and still am) who will see if I can do the procedure with what I have before investing in more gear.
 
The router is probably the most versatile woodworking tool you can own.

Even more so than DIY audio the only way to truly learn about routers is to use a router. Unlike a circular saw you probably can't kill yourself with a router but you can inflict some nasty and painful wounds if you compromise safety principles. Because the machine sounds dangerous and looks scary you will likely have enough respect and caution to use it safely. Early in your learning you will probably have some experiences that dramatically illustrate the reasons for the safety rules. When these things happen early in the learning process they usually result in less-than-perfect cuts, or perhaps a ruined workpiece, but probably not personal injury. You're more likely to experience heart palpitations as you exclaim, "WOW! Did you see how fast that piece got chewed up because it wasn't adequately secured or correctly positioned by a guide! Good thing my fingers weren't holding it by the edge that passed through the bit.". It's after you think you know what you're doing and take shortcuts, or overestimate your ability, that the bandaids and antibiotic ointment will be needed.

I have coached 10-year olds through successful router projects - using jigs and fixtures that I carefully set up and verified. I believe I heard Bob Rosendahl once mention that he had 6 and 7 year olds using table-mounted routers to create products sold at school fundraisers. You wouldn't want it to get out that Canadian first-graders have more guts than you, would you?

In most cases you will spend more time doing the set-up, clamping, practice cuts, etc, than doing the actual work. The results are worth it - for accuracy, repeatability, and craftsmanship. Creating your driver cutouts is actually a fairly straightforward and safe basic router task. There are at least half a dozen ways to do the job and get good results. Read up and ask for advice. If you understand how the operation will be done, and think you can do it, then you probably CAN do it.

Anything that calls itself a "trim router" is almost certainly inadequate for speaker building work. An old adage says, "It's much easier to do small work on a big machine than big work on a small machine.". My first router, circa late 1970's, was a fairly inexpensive model from Sears. I did a lot of useful work, and learned a LOT, from that tool. It's probably the only power tool I have ever legitimately worn out (i.e., not compromised by accidents, abuse, inappropriate use, etc). When I saw that my second Sears router was headed down the same path I saved my allowance and got a Porter Cable 690, and the plunge base when it appeared a year or so later. 30 years later I still have that machine, though it's due for replacement. There are several very good candidates in the $150 - $250 range; see the thread called "Which Router?". I'm watching for special sales and used tools.

If you do more than two or three router projects you will spend more on router bits than the router itself. The expensive ones are a joy to use and give exquisite results, but once you get away from the bargain-basement bits pretty much any of them (Amana, Eagle, MLCS, Freud, Cascade, Woodcraft and Rockler house brands, etc, etc) are quite effective. (On the other hand, the bargain-basement bits have always disappointed me.)

My first Sears tool came bundled with a multi-function edge guide/circle cutter jig that I still have and still use. I have made other sub-bases for the Sears jig to attach to, and used parts from the Sears jig on other jigs. In fact, the majority of attachments, jigs, and add-ons sold for routers can be made (or functionally-equivalent items created) in your own shop. That includes router tables, too - I have several crafted from cast-off kitchen countertops. You need to understand how the thing does what it does, where the tolerances must be tight and where they don't matter. Of course you can get into a vicious cycle of "I want to build a speaker - but first I need to do an experiment with the drivers - which will require a somewhat unique cabinet - that I can easily make with the right router jig - which can be built at home - after I have the correct bit on hand - and figure out the best way to machine the key part . . . ". I recently spent two weeks creating the tooling I wanted for a one-afternoon project.

As with DIY audio there are communities of hobbyists and semi-professionals organized around routers and router applications. Just like here, they can get into endless (and mindless) debates but if that's not your thing you can simply move on to the next thread. One worth checking out is the "Router Forums" at http://www.routerforums.com/ .

Have fun, stay safe, and post pictures!

Dale
 
Router Forums stress safety above all. Dale may have come from there. And the discussion of teaching methods of work to kids who become the next generation of what the steampunk crowd called "makers" is significant.

Whenever I mention the concept of a community workshop sponsored by the city, the first reaction is "someone will cut their fingers off." Invariably a negative reaction. It doesn't have to be and shouldn't be that way. It is the outsider's view of craft seen through an insurance company's lens.

Here where I live there is a community gardens project going. It is a big one on a former golf course in the heart of the city right on the river which separates north from south in the city. Volunteers are plentiful. And on this site there is a waiver carefully written that all who come to volunteer know what they are doing. In most cases accidents never happen. But in craft you do take responsibility for your own actions.

This discussion is a good one. And it should build confidence for new members.
 
This discussion really is a good one. It may not be what I wanted to hear, but I feel like I'm seeing a lot of great advice.

By request, here's the trim router I have:
1/4" Trim Router Drill Master - Item#44914

I guess it's woefully inadequate.

I wasn't planning on building lots of cabinets. I was just going to cut the holes in the baffles for this project, and maybe for a pair of those curved-back cabs you can get from Parts Express, if I like the results of this experiment.

It might be that I need to re-think all of that.

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This discussion really is a good one. It may not be what I wanted to hear, but I feel like I'm seeing a lot of great advice.

By request, here's the trim router I have:
1/4" Trim Router Drill Master - Item#44914

I guess it's woefully inadequate.

I wasn't planning on building lots of cabinets. I was just going to cut the holes in the baffles for this project, and maybe for a pair of those curved-back cabs you can get from Parts Express, if I like the results of this experiment.

It might be that I need to re-think all of that.

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looks essentially like a rebranded Makita laminate trim "router" - as noted above, a decent enough tool for that purpose - but your assessment of its shortcomings, or better said, its anticipated lifespan for any function beyond that, is valid
 
You said that you had a jigsaw but the cut went badly. How so?

Taken in sum, to do the job of the cutout that jigsaw is the superior cutting tool and for handwork it is safer than using the trim router. Spin drills work, that's why there is a market for the Zip Tool found in many tool outlets. But they are used for things like free handing cutouts in drywall for electric outlets and such jobs where the cut will go in multiple directions in a pattern.

Look at it this way: the trim router is designed to cut through an 1/8th or 1/16 inch of plastic laminate. It can be used other ways and that's why I got the kit as an experiment.

Returning to that jig saw, there are now blades which give a very fine cut from Starret and I believe Bosch as well. And small imperfections will be covered by the speaker frame.

Amazon.com: Starrett BU2CDS-2-6 Dual Cut Jig Saw Blades, 12-Pack: Home Improvement

Starrett products can be hard to find outside of specialty places such as, maybe Woodcrafters. Read the description and it says the blades have dual mount for the two kinds of shank found on jig saws and dual cut for a smooth table saw-like cut finish. I first saw these in a featured product piece in one of the Handyman-type magazines.

Bosch makes a similar design but I'd have to look that up as well. What I'm getting at is you may want to save the trim router for another day and another job.
 
So chrisb, you meant to say that this trim router would get burned out by cutting more than a few speaker mounting holes in 1/2" MDF?

loninappleton, Years ago, I did quite a few cuts with a jigsaw. I used a nail and a string to draw the circle to be cut out, drill a pilot hole and drop in the jigsaw blade. Follow the line. It worked, but there were lots of meandering imperfections. Very difficult to stay right on that line without wandering off here and there. But like you said, it gets covered by the speaker frame.

I could then use the trim router with a roundover bit along the back of the cut, to give the driver "breathing room" (as per Mark Audio recommendations).

The problem is with a small circular hole. I felt like I was trying to bend the jigsaw blade into the line. It did not feel safe.

The hole I'd need to make for Alpair 7 would be 4-1/16" (103mm). Do you think with that Starrett blade you linked to that it would be possible to make a small hole like that with a jigsaw?

Thanks again.

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PS - My jigsaw is a Black & Decker "Basic Jig Saw" (single speed) that I've had for something like 20 years.
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There are likely better solutions than a piece of string. A sub-base would be more stable.


For those small holes, you are right: the radius is limited.

Hole saws come in sets at the Harbor in various sizes or you could get one
of the precise size. There are those of us who have used hole saws in a hand drill to make the cutout. I no longer would say anyone should do this without a drill press. In order to get things done, I have done such foolish things in the past. It will give you wrist pain at minimum. Hobbyists try all differnt things depending on the amount of tools or lack of tools they have.

So if the jigsaw cannot accommodate the radius a hole saw properly mounted should be considered.

Returning to the laminate router, someone on here might know where to get an 1/8 in to 1/4 collett to use a spin saw. Mine came with both.


These small speakers invariably run into such problems of what tool to make the cutout.

Just for discussion purposes, the link below shows the cover shot of a jig made by Bill Hylton for his Router Magic book.

It has a sliding piece which allows the attached device to make a hole something 2 1/2 inches circumferance to 7 in radius. I made one but it took a lot of time and acquired tools. It's still one of the best designs I've seen.

Amazon.com: Router Magic: Jigs, Fixtures, and Tricks to Unleash Your Router's Full Potential (9780762101856): Bill Hylton: Books

See the middle photo.
 
For those with a small drill press, these are really handy and fast:

http://www.amazon.com/General-Tools...d=1342578196&sr=8-1&keywords=General+hole+saw

The drill press is one of my favorite tools, mine is very old, 50s I would guess, it works fine, etc.

For cutting larger holes (or tougher wood) I use two passes, the first pass with a slightly smaller circle, then the final cut with the correct size (flipping board all along).

I did like the book link, some good ideas right on the cover.
 
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