Stuffing the Feastrex Freddy Box...
O.K. I've been listening for two days.
The drivers are wonderful.
Now its time to get some stuffing inside. The drivers in the Freddy are sweet but I feel it needs some fluffy stuff...I have no idea as to how much.
So, what has anybody done?
BTW: I removed the two subs and the lowthers so I might better guess at what is needed. I think my audio brain has forgotten how the Lowthers sounded. It took a few days.
The quanity and quality of the bass line is amazing.
I hear the felts of the piano hammers hitting the strings. Heavy and light breathing of the artists. Detail I've never heard is so very clear.
So far they have about 20 hours. Today at about 15 hours in there was a musical shift...things got confused and unclear so I dropped the vol and did so other stuff. Can back and re listened.... another **** but I really could'nt tell if it was good or bad...just different.
The box does need some stuffing but then I guess we all knew that.
So onward...
Photos in the AM...
O.K. I've been listening for two days.
The drivers are wonderful.
Now its time to get some stuffing inside. The drivers in the Freddy are sweet but I feel it needs some fluffy stuff...I have no idea as to how much.
So, what has anybody done?
BTW: I removed the two subs and the lowthers so I might better guess at what is needed. I think my audio brain has forgotten how the Lowthers sounded. It took a few days.
The quanity and quality of the bass line is amazing.
I hear the felts of the piano hammers hitting the strings. Heavy and light breathing of the artists. Detail I've never heard is so very clear.
So far they have about 20 hours. Today at about 15 hours in there was a musical shift...things got confused and unclear so I dropped the vol and did so other stuff. Can back and re listened.... another **** but I really could'nt tell if it was good or bad...just different.
The box does need some stuffing but then I guess we all knew that.
So onward...
Photos in the AM...
They're going to keep changing a LOT! For a LONG time. Mr. Teramoto was telling me that he recently had a chance to listen to some of his D5nf drivers that had been getting a lot of play for one full year, and he was amazed by how much they had improved after a year of playing.
Then there's something fundamentally wrong with the design. That, or they should be broken in/voiced for as long as it takes for them to stabilize before offering them to the public. To design an optimum cab alignment for such a driver is a crapshoot at best.
Like a fine wine, it shouldn't be 'served' before its time. 😉
GM
Like a fine wine, it shouldn't be 'served' before its time. 😉
GM
My D5nf has clocked more than 300 hrs... 😉 I am quite sure Teramoto is refering to the Tone and not so much the changes in the T/S parameters especially for those drivers for that have been used continuously for more than a year or so.... 🙂
I'm inclined to agree with GM, but in the meantime, to accelerate break in, there is this:
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/isotek/cd.html
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/isotek/cd.html
I find Massive Attack, The Prodigy, or some other bass & dynamic-heavy CD works fine for me. Cheaper, & you have music to listen to at the end of it. 🙂
Nice Work Phil!
Love your listening room.
I don't think we can draw any conclusions about whether a component is fundamentally flawed simply because of a statement that it changes with time. I don't know of any hi-fi component that doesn't go through a period of break-in. There's also the question of how much of that is subjective. One hears a new component and flips out because it is doing things one has never heard before, and then one becomes acclimated and begins to notice other elements - perhaps things that need improving (stuffing? bracing? driver height?). This is all part of the process, and is part and parcel as to why this process is never ending. I think we need to be careful about making assumptions based on little information.
The D5nf is one of the most remarkable drivers ever built. Period. It can be made to sound bad. Try putting it into an Abby voight pipe.
Joe
Love your listening room.
I don't think we can draw any conclusions about whether a component is fundamentally flawed simply because of a statement that it changes with time. I don't know of any hi-fi component that doesn't go through a period of break-in. There's also the question of how much of that is subjective. One hears a new component and flips out because it is doing things one has never heard before, and then one becomes acclimated and begins to notice other elements - perhaps things that need improving (stuffing? bracing? driver height?). This is all part of the process, and is part and parcel as to why this process is never ending. I think we need to be careful about making assumptions based on little information.
The D5nf is one of the most remarkable drivers ever built. Period. It can be made to sound bad. Try putting it into an Abby voight pipe.
Joe
GM said:Then there's something fundamentally wrong with the design. That, or they should be broken in/voiced for as long as it takes for them to stabilize before offering them to the public. To design an optimum cab alignment for such a driver is a crapshoot at best.
So Fostex drivers are flawed because they get better over similar time periods? (althou they do get most of the way after 300 or 400 hrs -- less than 3 weeks at my house, but 2/3 of a year for someone that only fires up their hifi a couple hrs a day....)
dave
Feastrex Flaw!
So far the biggest "Flaw" is the darn price...
but then, I am reminded that....
"You get the Driver you deserve"
and
"The best there is Might be good enough"
Wayne Shorter is totally mess'in up my living room.
So far the biggest "Flaw" is the darn price...
but then, I am reminded that....
"You get the Driver you deserve"
and
"The best there is Might be good enough"
Wayne Shorter is totally mess'in up my living room.
Phil,
Great listening space!
Just curious, have you tried these speakers toed in so the axes cross in front of the center listening position? Should give a less critical sweet spot, plus the center position has you off axis slightly to the drivers, should that be desirable (and I find it often is).
Great listening space!
Just curious, have you tried these speakers toed in so the axes cross in front of the center listening position? Should give a less critical sweet spot, plus the center position has you off axis slightly to the drivers, should that be desirable (and I find it often is).
BTW is correct, the phenomenon I mentioned above has to do more with the tone than with the T/S parameters. It is primarily (but not exclusively) because Mr. Teramoto has deliberately chosen to use a glue that is normally used in conjunction with a special compound to accelerate hardening, but Mr. Teramoto uses it WITHOUT that hardening accelerator. He does not like what happens to the sound when the glue becomes instantly rock-hard. Instead, he is willing to wait for it to harden very slowly but steadily during use, believing that approach to ultimately sound better. However, it would be a mistake to think that the T/S parameters of the driver continue to change so significantly over time that you would need to change the enclosure to reflect those changes. It is primarily the highs that are affected; however, as the highs continue to improve, our perception of the bass seems to change too.
-- Chris
-- Chris
Re: Nice Work Phil!
Aaaaarggghhhhh! Another one! Voigt please, gentlemen. Voigt. No 'h'. P.G.A.H. Voigt. Rant. Mutter. etc. 😀 😉
A properly designed ML TQWT could be interesting, it was something I was thinking about last night as it happens. We have a problem though. And the problem is that bulbuos great golden thing on the back (i.e. the magnet), which is going to choke the pipe & block most of the airflow / standing waves something chronic. Short of spacing it out massively from the pipe, or shifting to a folded pipe, I'm struggling to think of a workaround.
talawalla said:The D5nf is one of the most remarkable drivers ever built. Period. It can be made to sound bad. Try putting it into an Abby voight pipe.
Aaaaarggghhhhh! Another one! Voigt please, gentlemen. Voigt. No 'h'. P.G.A.H. Voigt. Rant. Mutter. etc. 😀 😉
A properly designed ML TQWT could be interesting, it was something I was thinking about last night as it happens. We have a problem though. And the problem is that bulbuos great golden thing on the back (i.e. the magnet), which is going to choke the pipe & block most of the airflow / standing waves something chronic. Short of spacing it out massively from the pipe, or shifting to a folded pipe, I'm struggling to think of a workaround.
Toe to toe or no?
Right now the drivers are toed out...
They are about 32 inches from the glass and about 5-6 feet apart.
I will toe them in as time marches on and see what shakes out.
Next week we will install our winter curtains to help insulate the glass and reduce night heat loss. We found some white cotton quilted moving and shipping blankets on line. They are thick and heavy. They will certainly help keep the back reflections from wandering abound to the front.
I'm building some stands that will push the center of the drivers up about 12".
Should be done on thursday evening.
Will post photos...
Still have not stuffed the box...any help???
Right now the drivers are toed out...
They are about 32 inches from the glass and about 5-6 feet apart.
I will toe them in as time marches on and see what shakes out.
Next week we will install our winter curtains to help insulate the glass and reduce night heat loss. We found some white cotton quilted moving and shipping blankets on line. They are thick and heavy. They will certainly help keep the back reflections from wandering abound to the front.
I'm building some stands that will push the center of the drivers up about 12".
Should be done on thursday evening.
Will post photos...
Still have not stuffed the box...any help???
Re: Stuffing the Feastrex Freddy Box...
Hi Phil,
Geat looking box you got there... 😎 Wrt stuffing you can experimenting with just using crumpled newspaper to break up standing waves in the box, like what Teramoto did... I am currently using Tozawa paper resonators and newspaper or my newest D5nf+PB9 box. The Tozawa paper resonators are nothing more than a paper bag. I guess you could get your hands on some of those brown paper bags ... blow them up and tape them .. then it becomes a paper resonator in the spk box... I was skeptical of these devices at first but the Tozawas really did help cure the boxiness in the cabinets. Try the newspaper first ... cheap and easy to do.. 🙂
Borrowing Chris's earlier photo...
The Tonzawa is the crushed white paper box slightly on top of the driver and below you can see some crumpled paper used by Teramoto.
Phil Townsend said:O.K. I've been listening for two days.
The drivers are wonderful.
Now its time to get some stuffing inside. The drivers in the Freddy are sweet but I feel it needs some fluffy stuff...I have no idea as to how much.
So, what has anybody done?
Hi Phil,
Geat looking box you got there... 😎 Wrt stuffing you can experimenting with just using crumpled newspaper to break up standing waves in the box, like what Teramoto did... I am currently using Tozawa paper resonators and newspaper or my newest D5nf+PB9 box. The Tozawa paper resonators are nothing more than a paper bag. I guess you could get your hands on some of those brown paper bags ... blow them up and tape them .. then it becomes a paper resonator in the spk box... I was skeptical of these devices at first but the Tozawas really did help cure the boxiness in the cabinets. Try the newspaper first ... cheap and easy to do.. 🙂
Borrowing Chris's earlier photo...
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
The Tonzawa is the crushed white paper box slightly on top of the driver and below you can see some crumpled paper used by Teramoto.
For what it costs, you might also experiment with bubble wrap, of all things. David Wykoff and other builders of the Hammer Super 12 found that nothing worked better for them:
http://www.diyparadise.com/hammer.html
http://www.diyparadise.com/hammer.html
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