Myren
I agree. I think also that metal halide is the way to go. What about some sort of " cooling tube" ,or upside down funnel if you would, with a fan at the mouth sucking air out from a precise area, or even flow chambers directing air where ,you, want it to go. Anyhow , I think these are the light sources we need to concentrate on, afterall thats what the industry uses.
THUNTER
I agree. I think also that metal halide is the way to go. What about some sort of " cooling tube" ,or upside down funnel if you would, with a fan at the mouth sucking air out from a precise area, or even flow chambers directing air where ,you, want it to go. Anyhow , I think these are the light sources we need to concentrate on, afterall thats what the industry uses.
THUNTER
The Xung,
Funny, but what you describe is pretty close to the mechanical anti-shake mechanisms built into videocameras. I believe it was pioneered by Canon. They use silicon fluid instead of water (less chemically active, probably, and very clear). Also, they don't circulate the fluid since it is not a cooling medium in this application, just a variable light bending pipe.
Funny, but what you describe is pretty close to the mechanical anti-shake mechanisms built into videocameras. I believe it was pioneered by Canon. They use silicon fluid instead of water (less chemically active, probably, and very clear). Also, they don't circulate the fluid since it is not a cooling medium in this application, just a variable light bending pipe.
The Xung said:
You guys are missing the potential of the water cooling. Fiat1, put the heat filter you mentioned in the water or on the first pane of glass.
This water tank would be before the light hits the lcd so, I don't think you have to worry about the optics that much. What sort of lense are people placing before the lcd that are that sensitive to the angle of light?
Algae? This is where a little antifreeze or alcohol would come into play. Just a little antifreeze would give the water a greenish-bluish tint which might or might not be useful. Practically anything can be a biocide so long as there's enough of it in the water like salts, bleach, mouthwash. The task is to find one that wouldn't cause too much of a color distortion and wouldn't alter the heat transfering properties of water that much. Thinking about it, I would try a little bleach first.
This water tank would be before the light hits the lcd so, I don't think you have to worry about the optics that much. What sort of lense are people placing before the lcd that are that sensitive to the angle of light?
Algae? This is where a little antifreeze or alcohol would come into play. Just a little antifreeze would give the water a greenish-bluish tint which might or might not be useful. Practically anything can be a biocide so long as there's enough of it in the water like salts, bleach, mouthwash. The task is to find one that wouldn't cause too much of a color distortion and wouldn't alter the heat transfering properties of water that much. Thinking about it, I would try a little bleach first.
anyone know if short-arc hid bulbs take different starting gear than their non short arc siblings?
optics java interactives
http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/index.html has some very interesting info and interactive tutorials. It's mostly microscope info, but lots of lens/light/refraction info.
http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/index.html has some very interesting info and interactive tutorials. It's mostly microscope info, but lots of lens/light/refraction info.
thoughts on water cooling
A few people have mentioned cooling reflectors: If the reflector is decent quality, it should only heat up via conducted heat, not radiated. Unless you are talking about a fancy material that does not reflect IR, all the incident heat is reflected as well as the visible light. Contact cooling is probably better applied to the bulb and mountings of the socket.
I read somewhere that water was a good absorber of IR, so I did do a quick and dirty experiment with a quite thick walled rectangular vase with about 70mm of water between the flat walls. I put this in front of my slide projector, with the projector's IR filter removed. When this is removed you can't hold your hand in front of the thing for more than a second or so. With the vase and water in front of it, it was noticeably better heatwise (using the hand test), but still NOWHERE near as good as with the tiny bit of coated glass that forms the IR filter in place. With the water you could hold your hand there about 15 seconds or so before it got really uncomfortable. With the proper IR filter glass, you can leave your hand there indefinitely. btw, Edmund Scientific and places like that sell the IR blocking filters at huge expense for small sizes.
I did think of trying a sample of the glass they put in residential houses to block incoming heat - low emissivity glass (low E they abrev.). Apparently that stuff blocks 50% to 70% of heat, and can't be that expensive if they do whole houses with it. I haven't tried this or found a place that has the stuff on the shelf (ie. willing to sell a small bit for cash)
A few people have mentioned cooling reflectors: If the reflector is decent quality, it should only heat up via conducted heat, not radiated. Unless you are talking about a fancy material that does not reflect IR, all the incident heat is reflected as well as the visible light. Contact cooling is probably better applied to the bulb and mountings of the socket.
I read somewhere that water was a good absorber of IR, so I did do a quick and dirty experiment with a quite thick walled rectangular vase with about 70mm of water between the flat walls. I put this in front of my slide projector, with the projector's IR filter removed. When this is removed you can't hold your hand in front of the thing for more than a second or so. With the vase and water in front of it, it was noticeably better heatwise (using the hand test), but still NOWHERE near as good as with the tiny bit of coated glass that forms the IR filter in place. With the water you could hold your hand there about 15 seconds or so before it got really uncomfortable. With the proper IR filter glass, you can leave your hand there indefinitely. btw, Edmund Scientific and places like that sell the IR blocking filters at huge expense for small sizes.
I did think of trying a sample of the glass they put in residential houses to block incoming heat - low emissivity glass (low E they abrev.). Apparently that stuff blocks 50% to 70% of heat, and can't be that expensive if they do whole houses with it. I haven't tried this or found a place that has the stuff on the shelf (ie. willing to sell a small bit for cash)
This is a crazy idea but do the computer monitor anti-glare filters also have IR filter ability?
Descisions descisions.
Did some more LCD research. I'm leaning towards KDS because of two things. 1. 11ms response time! The best I saw from VS was 25, but most were 35-40! The lack of motion-blurring at high framerates is one of the things I consider really important. 2. The KDS color control allows you to adjust the R, G, and B biases indepently. Which is good.
Still need an OHP though. Can't find any 'roung these parts. 😡
Did some more LCD research. I'm leaning towards KDS because of two things. 1. 11ms response time! The best I saw from VS was 25, but most were 35-40! The lack of motion-blurring at high framerates is one of the things I consider really important. 2. The KDS color control allows you to adjust the R, G, and B biases indepently. Which is good.
Still need an OHP though. Can't find any 'roung these parts. 😡
HID lights
What about the HID replacement headlight globes you can get for cars? I saw a site with 100W white HID globes - I assume you still need igniters and ballasts etc. None of the sites I have looked at have specs like lumens or anything. They did have colour temp though, I think it was something like 5k to 6k (perfect). Now, if they get cheap enough...
What about the HID replacement headlight globes you can get for cars? I saw a site with 100W white HID globes - I assume you still need igniters and ballasts etc. None of the sites I have looked at have specs like lumens or anything. They did have colour temp though, I think it was something like 5k to 6k (perfect). Now, if they get cheap enough...
LCD and controller for sale.
I'm getting out of the DIY projector making business. I have a 8.5" panel and controller card for sale.
The panel is 16+ million color capable. The controller has VGA, composite, S-Video input and many video adjustments. Manual included. LCD has been removed from the casing. I still have the casing w/ fan. Selling both for $80, or best offer.
Vince
I'm getting out of the DIY projector making business. I have a 8.5" panel and controller card for sale.
The panel is 16+ million color capable. The controller has VGA, composite, S-Video input and many video adjustments. Manual included. LCD has been removed from the casing. I still have the casing w/ fan. Selling both for $80, or best offer.
Vince
Why?
Vince-
Sorry to hear that you're no longer pursuing the project. Hopefully LCD projectors will come down in price so that all of our home theaters can make use of one.
What is the resolution/response time of your lcd panel?
Vince-
Sorry to hear that you're no longer pursuing the project. Hopefully LCD projectors will come down in price so that all of our home theaters can make use of one.
What is the resolution/response time of your lcd panel?
Vince,
Sorry to hear about that too.
Myren,
Now we need pictures of yours working more then ever, this kind of news puts doubt in to minds. Any Idel as to when you'll get some?
Sorry to hear about that too.
Myren,
Now we need pictures of yours working more then ever, this kind of news puts doubt in to minds. Any Idel as to when you'll get some?
Hey. I just joined this discussion and I am anxious to start working on a projector. Since this discussion has been here for quite some time it seems impossible to figure out what u guys done up until now. I would appreciate it if someone will write a summery that will conclude everything that u guys succeeded of doing up until now and how you've done it. PLZ help.
And thank you in advance.
And thank you in advance.
Axeman,
Projector prices can go as low as the manufacturers want, however if the prices of those 1000 hours lamps remain around $300, these projectors will never make it into the mainstream hometheater.
Vince,
Now that I have converted my living room into a light research lab you are getting out? Pleaseeeeeeee don't go.🙂
Projector prices can go as low as the manufacturers want, however if the prices of those 1000 hours lamps remain around $300, these projectors will never make it into the mainstream hometheater.
Vince,
Now that I have converted my living room into a light research lab you are getting out? Pleaseeeeeeee don't go.🙂
I'm really busy these days. I got a new position at my current job. I have a month to learn it. I'm working 2 jobs and studying for exams. Another reason is I hate making these bulky boxes. Blah, Blah, Blah, ect. It's not something I'm going to get right over night and I have to focus on other crap. I spent 6 hours the other day and am still disappointed w/ my progress.
I'd like also to wait for the resolution on available LCDs to get better and smaller. Maybe better LEDs too or other light source.
You guys are doing great.
I'll be watching.
Good Luck
Vince
I'd like also to wait for the resolution on available LCDs to get better and smaller. Maybe better LEDs too or other light source.
You guys are doing great.
I'll be watching.
Good Luck
Vince
Looking ahead
The LOA rocks as a source for opaque projection; I tried a single LOA and was overwhelmed with the results. I believe once the reflective LCDs make it into consumer equipment, like the playstation devices, we can rip them out and make excellent projectors that won't burn down our homes.
The folks running after the LCD cooking lamps, are you designing safety features like no FAN no LIGHT?
The LOA rocks as a source for opaque projection; I tried a single LOA and was overwhelmed with the results. I believe once the reflective LCDs make it into consumer equipment, like the playstation devices, we can rip them out and make excellent projectors that won't burn down our homes.
The folks running after the LCD cooking lamps, are you designing safety features like no FAN no LIGHT?
vdi_nenna, you are not leaving, you are just selling your stuffs for some cash, right? Anyway thanks for starting the thread, it's a HUGH thread now.
Now, it's all between Myren and Zark as they are the only two has claim to have successful prototypes.
Now, it's all between Myren and Zark as they are the only two has claim to have successful prototypes.
You sound bit pissed of Vince. But I read you. Sorry you've had bad luck with your project. Don't sell the lcd though, just put in the closet and maybe dig it up few weeks/months later.? Could you be bothered to tell what was wrong with your thing?
I anyway, as many others probably are thankful for you for starting the project. You are the father of this project. You are my father! Father don't go!
Anyway, good luck with the new title at work and hopefully you'll get your projector running someday.
Anyway as for me nothing has happened this week.
I'm waiting for the bulb for the ohp to arrive but that has nothing much to do with diy.
I have been trying to find powersource for the 38v bulb I mentioned earlier but it seems bit hard as I don't understand anything about them. I might post a question about them when I understand enough to even ask something. 🙂
As for safety, my thing is a hazard-zone. 3x240v coolers (which I think such voltage isn't recommended for diy-use) with some very bulky cable connections lying next to metal holder thing of the bulb. Add some watercooling and disaster is ready. I'm not an diyer, I could never build an ampliier or even a device which says *beep* when you press the button. Speakers I have made but they went to trashbox. So there will be no "light only when fans running" nor will be there coolers-running for few minutes after turning off the light and then coolers shut down automaticly when it's cooled enough as most ohp:s have. There will be no watercooling in my setup either. 🙂
I am amazed of the progress I've made with the projector but it's all thanks to you people and my father Vince 🙂
Sorry for the long msg with such small amount of useful data, but hey, what could few more lines in over 50 pages long thread hurt? 🙂
I anyway, as many others probably are thankful for you for starting the project. You are the father of this project. You are my father! Father don't go!
Anyway, good luck with the new title at work and hopefully you'll get your projector running someday.
Anyway as for me nothing has happened this week.
I'm waiting for the bulb for the ohp to arrive but that has nothing much to do with diy.
I have been trying to find powersource for the 38v bulb I mentioned earlier but it seems bit hard as I don't understand anything about them. I might post a question about them when I understand enough to even ask something. 🙂
As for safety, my thing is a hazard-zone. 3x240v coolers (which I think such voltage isn't recommended for diy-use) with some very bulky cable connections lying next to metal holder thing of the bulb. Add some watercooling and disaster is ready. I'm not an diyer, I could never build an ampliier or even a device which says *beep* when you press the button. Speakers I have made but they went to trashbox. So there will be no "light only when fans running" nor will be there coolers-running for few minutes after turning off the light and then coolers shut down automaticly when it's cooled enough as most ohp:s have. There will be no watercooling in my setup either. 🙂
I am amazed of the progress I've made with the projector but it's all thanks to you people and my father Vince 🙂
Sorry for the long msg with such small amount of useful data, but hey, what could few more lines in over 50 pages long thread hurt? 🙂
Cooling Issues
A lot of folks have concerns about cooling and I thought I'd take a minute to comment. I also see that some others have started to mention concerns about safety, so here goes.
YOU GUYS ARE GONNA BURN YOUR HOUSES DOWN IF YOU'RE NOT REAL CAREFUL!!!
Those 400 watt lamps get HOT (no duh!!), so you better be dam sure you are adequately taking care of the heat problem. I notice a lot of folks are prototyping with CARDBOARD BOXES or thin laminates (plywood, etc) because they are easy to work with. I don't want to get preachy, it's just that I'm worried that some of you haven't set yourselves or property on fire as much as I have, so I just want you to be aware of the DANGER.
About fifteen years ago while I was working electronics retail, a customer dropped a few peanuts by the front door and within a few minutes we noticed a trail of ants had found there way to the nuts and were eating on them. I thought it would be a great 'time lapse' project for one of the camcorders we sold, so I set it up and focused it on the ants/peanuts. All day long those ants ate their butts off. When it got dark outside, I decided to supplement the lighting to help with the videography. I used a high wattage 120 volt camera light. I set it up about three feet from the ants/nuts. It quickly got the area so hot the ants went into retreat, so I thought I'd 'shield' the ant/nuts a bit by placing a cassette tape about a foot and a half in front of the camera light. I went on about my business and about fourty five minutes later went back to check on the ants. They had returned to the nut, and working in the shade of the cassette tape, they were doing fine. I went to adjust the position of the cassette tape slightly and SUPRISE, the cassette housing was nearly FLUID it was so hot. And it was a good foot and a half away from the light.
Just my two cents worth. I'm hoping you guys get this stuff figured out. Unfortunately, I'm afraid I'll just have to pony up the cash for a commercial unit because my wife isn't going to allow me to disrupt the sanctity of her living room environment with anything resembling the contraptions you guys have come up with.
Enjoy.
A lot of folks have concerns about cooling and I thought I'd take a minute to comment. I also see that some others have started to mention concerns about safety, so here goes.
YOU GUYS ARE GONNA BURN YOUR HOUSES DOWN IF YOU'RE NOT REAL CAREFUL!!!
Those 400 watt lamps get HOT (no duh!!), so you better be dam sure you are adequately taking care of the heat problem. I notice a lot of folks are prototyping with CARDBOARD BOXES or thin laminates (plywood, etc) because they are easy to work with. I don't want to get preachy, it's just that I'm worried that some of you haven't set yourselves or property on fire as much as I have, so I just want you to be aware of the DANGER.
About fifteen years ago while I was working electronics retail, a customer dropped a few peanuts by the front door and within a few minutes we noticed a trail of ants had found there way to the nuts and were eating on them. I thought it would be a great 'time lapse' project for one of the camcorders we sold, so I set it up and focused it on the ants/peanuts. All day long those ants ate their butts off. When it got dark outside, I decided to supplement the lighting to help with the videography. I used a high wattage 120 volt camera light. I set it up about three feet from the ants/nuts. It quickly got the area so hot the ants went into retreat, so I thought I'd 'shield' the ant/nuts a bit by placing a cassette tape about a foot and a half in front of the camera light. I went on about my business and about fourty five minutes later went back to check on the ants. They had returned to the nut, and working in the shade of the cassette tape, they were doing fine. I went to adjust the position of the cassette tape slightly and SUPRISE, the cassette housing was nearly FLUID it was so hot. And it was a good foot and a half away from the light.
Just my two cents worth. I'm hoping you guys get this stuff figured out. Unfortunately, I'm afraid I'll just have to pony up the cash for a commercial unit because my wife isn't going to allow me to disrupt the sanctity of her living room environment with anything resembling the contraptions you guys have come up with.
Enjoy.
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