The tweeters can be replaced
Originals should be fairly easy to find, i have at least a dozen working, and even more that are not.
dave
Does the original Philips tweeter sound better than the VIFA?
Originals should be fairly easy to find, i have at least a dozen working, and even more that are not.
dave
I should have known. I already bought and replaced 4 VIFA tweeter. Now I have 2 pairs, 1 pair with the original Philips tweeter and 1 pair with the VIFA tweeter.
My Philips tweeters were abused with 200W of high-current amp, with lots of large signals from microphone feedbacks etc... The are definitely dead, but I could not find any evidence of physical damages, like torn cones, or short/open coil. The tiny coils each having about 1 dozen loops of fine copper wire are still intact. The tweeters are not open or short, but have a small resistance like about 0.115 ohm.
The original Philips tweeter may be brighter and cleaner. It's hard to judge the differences without equipment to switch between speakers.
I would recommend anyone attempting to replace the tweeters to try to find the original Philips tweeters first.
My Philips tweeters were abused with 200W of high-current amp, with lots of large signals from microphone feedbacks etc... The are definitely dead, but I could not find any evidence of physical damages, like torn cones, or short/open coil. The tiny coils each having about 1 dozen loops of fine copper wire are still intact. The tweeters are not open or short, but have a small resistance like about 0.115 ohm.
The original Philips tweeter may be brighter and cleaner. It's hard to judge the differences without equipment to switch between speakers.
I would recommend anyone attempting to replace the tweeters to try to find the original Philips tweeters first.
I don't know. At least it is the driver the XO is designed for. And cheaper.
dave
How much each for 4x?
I don't know. At least it is the driver the XO is designed for. And cheaper.
dave
Just bought a pair of DCM Time Windows that I would like to refurb. My guess is they are some variation of the 1A, but there is no model number on the plate with the serial number. I've taken one apart so here's some info.
Each speaker has two Vifa D19TD-07 8 ohm tweets and two non-descript made in Taiwan 6.5" mids with rubber surrounds and cones that have a faux carbon fiber appearance. They aren't the paper cones like the ones that came in my TF-500s. The crossovers on the baseplate have two cheap 47 uF electrolytic caps.
1) I am definitely going to replace the tweeters as two of them are blown. There are currently 2 drop in replacements that I'm aware of. One is the Vifa D19TD-05 3/4" Poly Dome from Parts Express. The other is a Seas Prestige 19TFF1 (H0737) 3/4" Textile Dome from Madisound. Both use the same plastic plate, are 8 ohms and are rated at 89db.
Question? Out of those two tweeters and knowing that tone is subjective, which should theoretically sound better? Should I assume textile generally beats poly? The difference in price isn't a concern. Both are affordable.
2) I plan to replace the two 47 uF electrolytic caps in each crossover. They are valued at either 50V or 100V.
Question? Could some of you please suggest some 47 uF caps that would be at least as good (and preferably better) than the stock caps. Should I go with metalized polypropylene, film and foil? I don't know enough about caps to know what I should choose.
Any advice is welcome. I know Time Windows and Time Frames aren't the greatest, but I like them. They are what they are.
Thank you very much!
Each speaker has two Vifa D19TD-07 8 ohm tweets and two non-descript made in Taiwan 6.5" mids with rubber surrounds and cones that have a faux carbon fiber appearance. They aren't the paper cones like the ones that came in my TF-500s. The crossovers on the baseplate have two cheap 47 uF electrolytic caps.
1) I am definitely going to replace the tweeters as two of them are blown. There are currently 2 drop in replacements that I'm aware of. One is the Vifa D19TD-05 3/4" Poly Dome from Parts Express. The other is a Seas Prestige 19TFF1 (H0737) 3/4" Textile Dome from Madisound. Both use the same plastic plate, are 8 ohms and are rated at 89db.
Question? Out of those two tweeters and knowing that tone is subjective, which should theoretically sound better? Should I assume textile generally beats poly? The difference in price isn't a concern. Both are affordable.
2) I plan to replace the two 47 uF electrolytic caps in each crossover. They are valued at either 50V or 100V.
Question? Could some of you please suggest some 47 uF caps that would be at least as good (and preferably better) than the stock caps. Should I go with metalized polypropylene, film and foil? I don't know enough about caps to know what I should choose.
Any advice is welcome. I know Time Windows and Time Frames aren't the greatest, but I like them. They are what they are.
Thank you very much!
For better or worse I've gone ahead and purchased 4 Solen 47 uF caps, so if we could discuss tweeters that would be great.
Any thoughts on the Vifa D19TD-05 3/4" Poly Domes vs. the Seas Prestige 19TFF1 (H0737) 3/4" Textile Dome? Both use the same plastic plate, are 8 ohms and 89db and are an exact drop in replacement (no mods to the cabinet) for the stock Vifa tweets that came in the Time Windows. Both options are within my budget, unlike the Clarity Cap ESA 47 uF capacitors. 😀
Other suggestions are welcome, however, I would prefer the tweeter dome remain somewhat recessed due to the design of the Time Windows. I'm concerned that a protruding dome would get mashed in or touch the grille cloth or metal protective screen when I reassemble them.
Thanks again.
Any thoughts on the Vifa D19TD-05 3/4" Poly Domes vs. the Seas Prestige 19TFF1 (H0737) 3/4" Textile Dome? Both use the same plastic plate, are 8 ohms and 89db and are an exact drop in replacement (no mods to the cabinet) for the stock Vifa tweets that came in the Time Windows. Both options are within my budget, unlike the Clarity Cap ESA 47 uF capacitors. 😀
Other suggestions are welcome, however, I would prefer the tweeter dome remain somewhat recessed due to the design of the Time Windows. I'm concerned that a protruding dome would get mashed in or touch the grille cloth or metal protective screen when I reassemble them.
Thanks again.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Today I sanded the old finish off the top caps of the Time Windows and gave them their first coat of Tru Oil. I think they're going to come out pretty spiffy with a few more coats.
So ... how about them tweeters? Any ideas? 😱
So ... how about them tweeters? Any ideas? 😱
Yeasterday i picked up a pair of TW 1a...one tweeter makes funny noises, interesting thing is, only by one song of Melody Gardot!!! Otherwise speakers are flawless. Bought them with the idea of using them as surround speakers in my Home Theater. Front and center speakers are Dahlquist Dq10. All in all DCMs are very nice and fit good with dq10. Great soundstage, no listening fatigue at all. I guess i´ll end up with great set of surround speakers 🙂
Now i plan to refresh them...my dq10 were rebuild by local tech, using SCR caps, silver wiring, alpha core coils, span speak 2010 tweeters. Spectacular improvement i must say. I guess same upgrade will be done with my DCMs. Will post results.
Marry Xmas to all 🙂
Now i plan to refresh them...my dq10 were rebuild by local tech, using SCR caps, silver wiring, alpha core coils, span speak 2010 tweeters. Spectacular improvement i must say. I guess same upgrade will be done with my DCMs. Will post results.
Marry Xmas to all 🙂
Today I sanded the old finish off the top caps of the Time Windows and gave them their first coat of Tru Oil. I think they're going to come out pretty spiffy with a few more coats.
So ... how about them tweeters? Any ideas? 😱
Did you ever decide on a tweet? If so which one and how did it sound?
I was thinking about replacing the electrolytic caps in my Time Window 1A's. In my crossover there are two 47uf 50v's, one 100uf 100v, and a 3.0uf 100v. My question is, can I replace the two 47uf with 100v iterations without changing the sonics? Partsexpress doesn't sell a non-polarized 47uf 50v cap, and I would like to order from one company and save on shipping.
I wouldn't worry at all about replaceing with a higher voltage cap. What you do need to keep in mind that the lower ESR of the poly cap may affect the XO performance. Keep that in mind after you have replaced them.
dave
dave
Thanks for the quick reply Dave. It's been a while since I have done any work like this, I didn't think voltages mattered, as long as the value was higher than original, and now that you mention the ESR, it's coming back to me. Obviously there is no way to match the ESR values since I don't know what they originally were, and I think I remember those values changing considerably from caps made 30+ years ago anyway? The other thing I am somewhat torn over is the difference between run of the mill non-polarized capacitors($1.50) vs all of these exotic audio grade jobbies($$$$). I have read the debates on different threads, so I am familiar with the opinions. The original crossovers don't have what look like anything but run of the mill, and I know these 1a's were pretty highly regarded? My only experience is one time I replaced the caps in 20 + yr old polk floorstanders, I went with expensive Clarity caps, Z's or something or the other. I did them one at a time and even tried the burn in time. I really couldn't hear a difference when it was all said and done between the new and the old. I have really good hearing, so maybe it was a system limitation? The debate rages! Anywho, that brings me to now, and these DCM TW 1A's.
Oh yeah, I like your avatar as well, if that's what you call it, I thought it was a big toroidal until I looked closer!
Oh yeah, I like your avatar as well, if that's what you call it, I thought it was a big toroidal until I looked closer!
Thanks a bunch for the photos
I just bought my first pair of TWs, and was thinking about recapping. I found the photos and schematic for the TW 1A speakers online , and they are indeed a step up from this original design. Cleaner plus more sophisticated. If anyone can tell me what is up with the square chunk of aluminum tubing inside one of the TW1A coils, I would appreciate it. Im guessing it increases the inductance and saves wire, but being non ferrous, has zero hysteresis like Fe would have ? Close ?Never seen that trick. So, do the 1As sound any better than the 1s ? Opinion anyone ? In the originals....Large air coils are good, like Polks...but several very old electrolytics. Upgrade ? Seems logical .
I do that for all my acquisitions. Buttt..... Im wondering if I really want to destroy these beasts in order to open them. Saber saw looks like the only way in. Also, does anyone have a schematic for this original crossover ? Thanks in advance.
I just bought my first pair of TWs, and was thinking about recapping. I found the photos and schematic for the TW 1A speakers online , and they are indeed a step up from this original design. Cleaner plus more sophisticated. If anyone can tell me what is up with the square chunk of aluminum tubing inside one of the TW1A coils, I would appreciate it. Im guessing it increases the inductance and saves wire, but being non ferrous, has zero hysteresis like Fe would have ? Close ?Never seen that trick. So, do the 1As sound any better than the 1s ? Opinion anyone ? In the originals....Large air coils are good, like Polks...but several very old electrolytics. Upgrade ? Seems logical .
I do that for all my acquisitions. Buttt..... Im wondering if I really want to destroy these beasts in order to open them. Saber saw looks like the only way in. Also, does anyone have a schematic for this original crossover ? Thanks in advance.
dear AMT...thanks for the schematic.
I have been looking high and low for one. The TW 1 and 1A have the same cabinets,different drivers, and very, VERY different crossovers.I have seen photos of each. In the TW1, the coils are huge diameter (6 inch ) air core, no plastic formers used. Homemade with a piece of drain pipe, then slipped off, hot glued down....looks like. Polk uses the same concept on their M 10s, so all good. I do not pretend to understand the tweeter time delay, but wiring them out of phase with the woof gives a 180 delay, so I'm a'guessin the cap, coil, resistors give it yet another 180 to bring it right back in sync. The woofer has a 6db roll off, and the tweet has a fancy 12db/oct...via what I call C2. I call the woof coil C1. ( A guess...maybe 18 or 24...what does that 53 cap do ? ) to protect the tweeters. The 10uf cap is a HUGE value for a tweet, to get it to cross over down at 2,000Hz. If it is electrolytic, and in the signal path ( yes and yes), it has to go.Parts Express brand PPE filmcaps are superb. As for the 53 uf electro, which is a tweeter shunt, I would replace it with a new electrolytic. (But Hells Bells...the Labor to get into this damn thing...spend the $20 and get a PPE cap. Why not. ) If it dries out and becomes non conductive, more low freqs will go to the tweeters... two Phillips AD01624 T8, in parallel, thus 4 ohms. Poof. Might as well put a new PE 3uf PPE in there, I have read they "are better " than Mylar. These tweets are really padded down...looks like about 3 ohms in series with the tweets...no wonder they "roll off the high highs". Someone suggested unpadding the tweets by 1 ohm. Well, more current...just sayin. Hope this helps, 3 years late. I just got a pair, and I am learning the Mysteries of the Deep. Seems to me the only way into these babies..... is a full circumscision with a saber saw 1/2 way around the backside tube base, maybe 4 inches up, taking out a curved piece of cardboard maybe 6 inches high and maybe 12-14 inches on an arc...and hoping to miss any wires or crossover items... prying the crossover board up and out...or reaching in to solder new caps...then building a lip inside .. using thin 1x 1 pieces of wood paneling glued and clamped in place..... then replacing the tube cut out.... Has ANYONE EVER opened up and then recapped an original TW 1 ?
I have been looking high and low for one. The TW 1 and 1A have the same cabinets,different drivers, and very, VERY different crossovers.I have seen photos of each. In the TW1, the coils are huge diameter (6 inch ) air core, no plastic formers used. Homemade with a piece of drain pipe, then slipped off, hot glued down....looks like. Polk uses the same concept on their M 10s, so all good. I do not pretend to understand the tweeter time delay, but wiring them out of phase with the woof gives a 180 delay, so I'm a'guessin the cap, coil, resistors give it yet another 180 to bring it right back in sync. The woofer has a 6db roll off, and the tweet has a fancy 12db/oct...via what I call C2. I call the woof coil C1. ( A guess...maybe 18 or 24...what does that 53 cap do ? ) to protect the tweeters. The 10uf cap is a HUGE value for a tweet, to get it to cross over down at 2,000Hz. If it is electrolytic, and in the signal path ( yes and yes), it has to go.Parts Express brand PPE filmcaps are superb. As for the 53 uf electro, which is a tweeter shunt, I would replace it with a new electrolytic. (But Hells Bells...the Labor to get into this damn thing...spend the $20 and get a PPE cap. Why not. ) If it dries out and becomes non conductive, more low freqs will go to the tweeters... two Phillips AD01624 T8, in parallel, thus 4 ohms. Poof. Might as well put a new PE 3uf PPE in there, I have read they "are better " than Mylar. These tweets are really padded down...looks like about 3 ohms in series with the tweets...no wonder they "roll off the high highs". Someone suggested unpadding the tweets by 1 ohm. Well, more current...just sayin. Hope this helps, 3 years late. I just got a pair, and I am learning the Mysteries of the Deep. Seems to me the only way into these babies..... is a full circumscision with a saber saw 1/2 way around the backside tube base, maybe 4 inches up, taking out a curved piece of cardboard maybe 6 inches high and maybe 12-14 inches on an arc...and hoping to miss any wires or crossover items... prying the crossover board up and out...or reaching in to solder new caps...then building a lip inside .. using thin 1x 1 pieces of wood paneling glued and clamped in place..... then replacing the tube cut out.... Has ANYONE EVER opened up and then recapped an original TW 1 ?
The easiest way to remove the top cap, without destroying the XO or damaging the cardboard is to use a Fein Multitool or similar. You will need several blades since you will be slicing though nail, particle board and adhesive. Carefully go around the perimeter between the cap and tube. Its slow but will allow the cardboard edges to remain smooth and intact. I replaced my caps with Oak ply with Oak edging and used a threaded rod, like the 1A to hold the cap down from the bottom cap. I used another piece of 1/2 ply, cut to fit the inside of the tube to keep the cap in place and sandwiched a tee nut in between for the rod attachment. BTW, I mounted my XO on the back so as to avoid conflict with the rod. The biggest PITA was removing the chipboard XO from the cap. They didnt spare the Liquid Nails on that attachment.
amt
amt
Attachments
Time Windows (original model, not 1A).mod
Wow...that is a lot of work.Just curious........ what ya did to the crossover once you got access? I assume you have a schematic handy. My plan is to replace the 10 uf and 3 uf tweeter caps with PPE caps, and to bypass the 3 uf cap with a 0.1 uf cap. Gonna use a 3.3uf to get a wee bit more HFcurrent. I will then put in two 6.0 ohm Mills 12 W resistors to replace the 5,1.2, and 6.8 ohm resistors in series with the tweeter. This will drop Rt from 3.3 to 3.0, again giving a bit more Bright to the sound....unpadding the tweet bascially.Not sure what to do with the 53 uf tweeter bypass cap...So I could cheap out and use an electro, or pay maybe 13$ for film. Ideas ? Thanks for the feedback.You and I must be the only 2 people on the Internet who have actually done this mod.😱
Wow...that is a lot of work.Just curious........ what ya did to the crossover once you got access? I assume you have a schematic handy. My plan is to replace the 10 uf and 3 uf tweeter caps with PPE caps, and to bypass the 3 uf cap with a 0.1 uf cap. Gonna use a 3.3uf to get a wee bit more HFcurrent. I will then put in two 6.0 ohm Mills 12 W resistors to replace the 5,1.2, and 6.8 ohm resistors in series with the tweeter. This will drop Rt from 3.3 to 3.0, again giving a bit more Bright to the sound....unpadding the tweet bascially.Not sure what to do with the 53 uf tweeter bypass cap...So I could cheap out and use an electro, or pay maybe 13$ for film. Ideas ? Thanks for the feedback.You and I must be the only 2 people on the Internet who have actually done this mod.😱
I simply replaced the caps, rewired and make new top and bottom caps and added cloth speaker grill material. As to the schematic, I drew one up using the physical layout and then derived the schematic from that. (post 61). This is less complex than the A1 that is shown on posts 45/53.
No sure if the Phillips need less padding or really just more frequency response. Too many projects dictated a quick restoration and zero tweaking.
amt
No sure if the Phillips need less padding or really just more frequency response. Too many projects dictated a quick restoration and zero tweaking.
amt
Thanks for the info on how to remove the caps. I have 2 pairs of the model 1, one very old (the one with the octagonal drivers) and the other one a little newer. Both pairs work good, as they should. Both have all the original drivers. I'm planning to do some upgrade to the crossovers replacing the capacitors. There is a video on YouTube with Steve Eberbach, the designer and ex-owner of DCM. In the video, he mentions that the capacitors go bad with time and that is a good idea to replace them. He also mentions, that back in the 70's, capacitors were bad (in general). I’m not upgrading the drivers. Can you be more specific about how to remove the caps? I know there is a rod holding both caps in place. I guess, my real question is, that for what I understand, there are two caps, one on top of the other? There are pictures on the web showing a model 1 without outer or visible cap. They appear to be glued.
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