I suppose that Chris has me on the ignore button.
No ignore from this guy - just not as much time on my hands right now as I'd like, and as my current sig line notes ..... which is why PM is currently deactivated.
There's always the risk of either breaking forum rules by overuse of (edited) quote function - even when to highlight a specific context - or posting a non sequitur.
Back to the OP's query, I was simply trying to suggest there are several approaches that could yield results "perfectly acceptable" for many folks.
I suppose that Chris has me on the ignore button.
Agreed, I thought I was having trouble understanding andy2 (not anymore)Now I have no idea what you are talking about.
Andy2 seems bent on a "don't even bother" path and Chris is taking a break (sorry Chris).
I really don't see any reason this couldn't work well with the right choice of woofer and some crossover tweaking. The nice thing about an active crossover is that it can be fast and easy to tweak, raising the chances of getting just want you want without too much hair pulling. If a passive approach is desired, I've offered a well thought out starting point.
I really don't see any reason this couldn't work well with the right choice of woofer and some crossover tweaking. The nice thing about an active crossover is that it can be fast and easy to tweak, raising the chances of getting just want you want without too much hair pulling. If a passive approach is desired, I've offered a well thought out starting point.
Well the problem with active is you need a whole lot of dsp, dedicated amp ... which turns out to be more complicated than what may sound good in theory. Not to mention once you go active, you can't try out your favorite tube amp, or DAC, or CD player and of course vinyl is pretty much good bye. Kind of like selling your soul to the devil. Once done, there is not much that can be done.
And if you decide to go passive in this case, I don't see how you can get away with just "a high pass at 200hz". A rework of the entire xover is needed.
No, just confused - Andy seems to be missing a point, or I am - somewhere.
I am also a big fan of passive crossover for the reasons that Andy listed, and some others - but I do know that most people get the results they need with active much quicker. I often use active for tweaking then build a passive version.
As for "Just a high pass at 200hz" I'm not sure what Andy is referring to, nor why a rework of the entire crossover is needed.
I am also a big fan of passive crossover for the reasons that Andy listed, and some others - but I do know that most people get the results they need with active much quicker. I often use active for tweaking then build a passive version.
As for "Just a high pass at 200hz" I'm not sure what Andy is referring to, nor why a rework of the entire crossover is needed.
Nothing wrong with that, but you were saying "permanent" active.
I supposed you could put lip stick on a pig but not something I would want, but as the saying goes, your speakers your money your choice.
Nor do I see any data to support the assertion that "going active" invokes all of his list of detriments - yes, a fully active system requires some type of line level crossover, one channel of amp for each pass-band per channel, and more cabling, etc - but the rest of his objections I don't get.
There's more than one approach with active systems, and I've experimented with a couple of them recently, none of which have limited the system's capabilities.
Alternate facts as play, perhaps?
Michael, I don't think it's you missing the point.
There's more than one approach with active systems, and I've experimented with a couple of them recently, none of which have limited the system's capabilities.
Alternate facts as play, perhaps?
Michael, I don't think it's you missing the point.
How would I play vinyl? I know you're going to say "put the vinyl through the ADC of the DSP" but then that sort of defeats the purpose the vinyl doesn't it?
How about tube amp? Do I need one tube amp per channel? I guess you could but you might have to have some pretty strong AC in your living room.
How about my 10K dCS cd player? Do you want to butcher its analog signal through your dsp?
How about if you want to let your friends borrow your dsp speakers? Are you planning to ship your entire living room to his house?
DSP is a dead end solution. It's good for professional studio but can messy for home audio. Of course if you want to do it as a hobby but that is irrelevant to my point.
Andy, I think the point you've missed is that active XOs as might be relevant to this application- whether DSP or old school analog - reside between system sources and the pre-amp, so none of those components' functionality or qualities should be impacted.
If you're operating a home theatre surround sound receiver, you're using DSP on daily basis.
While as per his declaration this approach is clearly not what YKYK has in mind, and therefore rendering these communal bloviations as OT entertainment, if a " DSP speaker" is fully self contained - such as can be achieved with the like of miniDSP, Hypex or other brands of plate amps available the the DIYer or OEM, or commercial products such as Meridians, then aside from their bulk and fancy finishes, how could they not be as easy to loan / transport as a conventional passive design?
scott- another very sly TLA - nice work
If you're operating a home theatre surround sound receiver, you're using DSP on daily basis.
While as per his declaration this approach is clearly not what YKYK has in mind, and therefore rendering these communal bloviations as OT entertainment, if a " DSP speaker" is fully self contained - such as can be achieved with the like of miniDSP, Hypex or other brands of plate amps available the the DIYer or OEM, or commercial products such as Meridians, then aside from their bulk and fancy finishes, how could they not be as easy to loan / transport as a conventional passive design?
scott- another very sly TLA - nice work
Last edited:
Plug the phono preamp into the line level preamp which drives the XO (in my case usually a PLLXO) then off to the power amps. These days many a diyer has more than one amp (i currently have 4 in my living room and more downstairs) so biamping means just adding the PLLXO (the RCAs on mine cost more than the XO itself) and away you go. Getting good integration means careful choise of top & bottom but i have yet to have an issue.
dave
And of course for those using computers as front end of audio systems, there are now vinyl spinners with built-in phono stages and USB outputs - they may be either the worst sounding pieces of garbage out there, or not.
The type of PLLXO Dave speaks about above is among the several approaches I've taken with recent multi-way speakers. They certainly offer huge cost savings over active XO systems, but not without some caveats.
TLS.org | Passive Line-Level Crossover
As with anything in an audio system, implementation of designs suitable to the specific application is key.
The type of PLLXO Dave speaks about above is among the several approaches I've taken with recent multi-way speakers. They certainly offer huge cost savings over active XO systems, but not without some caveats.
TLS.org | Passive Line-Level Crossover
As with anything in an audio system, implementation of designs suitable to the specific application is key.
I still don't see how with DSP, you can do without having to convert the vinyl output into digital. I still don't see the point of using vinyl if you going to convert it to digital. Basically you turn your vinyl into a cd player. I am not familiar with PLLXO but it seems to be some type of line level xover so it's not DSP that I was talking about. All of a sudden you introduced something that I had nothing to do with.
Last edited:
I suppose you can use plate amp, and inexpensive miniDSP or Hypex, but I wouldn't call that high fidelity. Driving a Harbeth with digital amp is to me audio plasphemy.
You can’t, but i have no DSP or ADC in my system (my DAC does have ADC but it is only used for measuring microphone).
dave
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.