Sorry, I can't but help notice you are now making judgements with hunches, guesses and opinions and comparing passive audio equipment while admitting you have only had a short time with an (LDR). I assume you mean LDR attenuator or pre amp, as they are commonly called.
Which LDR (attenuator) did you audition and what were it's specifications?
Can you elaborate please?
Where is this data that you have demanded from others that backs up your claims?
How can you compare Vincent's Arduino based LDR with Chris' design? The only common factor is that his uses LDR's and also has multiple inputs.
So why does George, with his extensive experience with LDR attenuators recommend a single input ? Maybe you should do more research.
While you are at it, you might like to research how Chris has managed employ 3 independent switched inputs without compromising the LDR unique potential.
BTW. I checked your forum profile in which says you are from Proxima Centauri b. These are your written words NOT mine.
I also did a Google search for 'spaceistheplace' as you suggested and it seems that you are perhaps a follower of "Sun Ra the space age prophet lands his spaceship in Oakland, having been presumed lost in space for a few years."
I do get get your little joke, but if you do have academic credentials you should be proud to display them.
What were its specifications? LDR's have no real specification in my mind. What goes in is what comes out unless your wanting to know the impedance at zero volume and at maximum volume.
I guess I'm a purest. None of my gear has tone controls or multiple inputs its strictly you get what you brung or whats coming from the source. I listen only to CD. When I want to switch to another input I simply unplug the one I am currently using. I guess I feel the same about a remote control in my audio setup. My TV system is different it uses a simple SS receiver that employs a remote, has multiple inputs, and EQ.
I guess I'm a purest. None of my gear has tone controls or multiple inputs its strictly you get what you brung or whats coming from the source. I listen only to CD. When I want to switch to another input I simply unplug the one I am currently using. I guess I feel the same about a remote control in my audio setup. My TV system is different it uses a simple SS receiver that employs a remote, has multiple inputs, and EQ.
The Lightspeed Attenuator it's main criteria was to get rid of today's volume controls with the light contact between the wiper arm and the resistive track.
This is also the reason for only one input to get rid of the source selector switch which is another wiper with a light contact.
There was a way posted many moons ago to make a con-tactless source selector, using again LDR's and relays, but it was too much cost and trouble.
Cheers George
Attachments
I haven't sighted performance figures for any LDR attenuator except on the LightSpeed website which states: Frequency response: 0hz – to almost Infinity. (Lightspeed) (interconnects are the determining factor here)
I don't really need specs because I have already decided the LDR sound sound exceeds what what I was expecting, through listening.
It would seem to me that the less components between the source and speakers the better. That's one of the reasons for my choice.
There is a direct link to the LightSpeed product page at the bottom of George's posts so you can check there for more data.
Indeed, there is little doubt the importance of wire towards a good sounding system has skyrocketed over the last 10 years. And while speaker and interconnect wires have been considered vital for a much longer period of time, the last 10 years have expanded this importance to all forms of digital transmission as well, even when not directly involved in the signal chain.
No argument here. But to suggest the raised interest in wire is the result of the efforts of a few diyers...i don't know, perhaps you are giving this forum too much credit.
Don't link me with raised interest in wire. Wire only matters to the following extent:
1 for analogue, avoid unusually high or low inductance or capacitance
2 for analogue, use shielded coax for unbalanced, twisted pair for balanced
3 for digital, just use the right characteristic impedance
4 avoid really expensive, really cheap, and DIY cables
Anyway, off topic for this thread.
I won't display my academic credentials with pride, as suggested above, for two reasons:
1. I was brought up to believe that pride is a sin
2. truth is the same whoever says it, and what we are discussing in this thread is not particularly advanced engineering
1 for analogue, avoid unusually high or low inductance or capacitance
2 for analogue, use shielded coax for unbalanced, twisted pair for balanced
3 for digital, just use the right characteristic impedance
4 avoid really expensive, really cheap, and DIY cables
Anyway, off topic for this thread.
I won't display my academic credentials with pride, as suggested above, for two reasons:
1. I was brought up to believe that pride is a sin
2. truth is the same whoever says it, and what we are discussing in this thread is not particularly advanced engineering
AS I mentioned in post #402 my gear is lacking controls. My linestage has only a right and left level control. My reasoning beyond what I've already mentioned is many years repairing audio gear, running service calls on commercial, industrial, and of course home equipment. If you ask what I always had trouble with it would be volume controls rotary and slide version, relays, rotary switches. I can probably tell you how many years you can expect a specific brand or model to run before trouble rears its ugly head.
Not even military sealed controls are exempt from problems.
Exotic wiring speaker cables and interconnect cables.
I've tried a number of them when I was younger and it was a fad. As I mentioned before in a post having identical speakers, source gear, and amplifiers I could conduct very good A/B tests. I went to the extent of rewiring an ebay find a pair of tube mono block amplifiers. I have one set strictly as they came from the factory and the other set I used silver wire, silver solder, the best sockets,tubes, speaker wiring, and interconnects. The result while true showed there was no sonic differences between the two sets.
There was a question brought up a few days ago asking "What have you ever built" or something along that line. I'm not going to go into detail here but I designed and manufactured some theater low frequency processing gear along with finished subwoofers to the buyers particular needs. To this day they are still in operation and that was close to 25 years ago. So, maybe I'm qualified and I'm sure to others I'll never be qualified.
In summary... In over 25 years and almost 1 million miles traveling around the country making my former boss's bank account fatter I became a believer of the KISS principal. Keep it simple. A way to my heart is no added controls no frills just as simple as possible. I've had a lot of high dollar gear and until 2000 I played only with SS amplifiers and gear and after 2000 I migrated to tube equipment.
Education.... I don't pretend to have a degree as I have none. I do have however thousands of hours worth of experience in repair and design and it still doesn't make me an expert. I've worked with a number of people with degrees that couldn't come close to me because of this worthless experience. A piece of paper on the wall is great but so is experience and the drive to figure out a problem.
Truth...
In my time doing my job I can look back with a clear conscience knowing that I told the truth to the people I delt with. I simply ask the same from others that manufacture equipment.
Not even military sealed controls are exempt from problems.
Exotic wiring speaker cables and interconnect cables.
I've tried a number of them when I was younger and it was a fad. As I mentioned before in a post having identical speakers, source gear, and amplifiers I could conduct very good A/B tests. I went to the extent of rewiring an ebay find a pair of tube mono block amplifiers. I have one set strictly as they came from the factory and the other set I used silver wire, silver solder, the best sockets,tubes, speaker wiring, and interconnects. The result while true showed there was no sonic differences between the two sets.
There was a question brought up a few days ago asking "What have you ever built" or something along that line. I'm not going to go into detail here but I designed and manufactured some theater low frequency processing gear along with finished subwoofers to the buyers particular needs. To this day they are still in operation and that was close to 25 years ago. So, maybe I'm qualified and I'm sure to others I'll never be qualified.
In summary... In over 25 years and almost 1 million miles traveling around the country making my former boss's bank account fatter I became a believer of the KISS principal. Keep it simple. A way to my heart is no added controls no frills just as simple as possible. I've had a lot of high dollar gear and until 2000 I played only with SS amplifiers and gear and after 2000 I migrated to tube equipment.
Education.... I don't pretend to have a degree as I have none. I do have however thousands of hours worth of experience in repair and design and it still doesn't make me an expert. I've worked with a number of people with degrees that couldn't come close to me because of this worthless experience. A piece of paper on the wall is great but so is experience and the drive to figure out a problem.
Truth...
In my time doing my job I can look back with a clear conscience knowing that I told the truth to the people I delt with. I simply ask the same from others that manufacture equipment.
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I'm afraid the wire thing happened long before this forum. Measurements of amplifiers oscillating or substantial frequency response deviations caused by extreme cables meant as little then as they do now. I don't remember when the quantum poetry started.
How can the importance of wire have changed? It still conducts, still has resistance, capacitance, and inductance, none of those things have changed in the last 10 years.
Okay, I have read the whole thread and read your contributions to it. Looks like you made the zdr version earlier this year. You were the only one to post negatively about it, and it seems you didn't really get any resolution to your questions.
And because you didn't like this one you have concluded that all LDR units are the same and good. No matter what that's the impression I have gotten from your postings here.
Maybe you should try another LDR unit if you are really that interested.
And as mentioned in a recent post, there are no switch contacts or light wiper tracking with LDR's. But of course there are also compromises too.
You’re correct.
My earlier post contained a typo apparently. Or what I said was taken out of context.
I post from a tablet often and autocorrect gets the best of me regularly.
I meant to suggest reduction in interest in “audiophile” cable over the last decade or so. As well as some other snake oil enterprises. Certainly hasn’t vanished of course.
I think this is due in part to folks such as yourself.
It was a compliment.
Anyhow has chris sent a unit to xrk?
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Ok, perhaps it was a mild attempt of irony on my part
How else to confront the audacious suggestion that over the last 10 years audiophiles have miraculously lost their hearing cause of a few gospel singers?
I did not realize you were a cable believer as well.
I think you would be rather surprised to know how many eyes these few “gospel singers” have upon their words.
One person with a large enough internet presence can change the tune of juggernaut multinational corporations. This is not uncommon in 2018. The trend is increasing, not decreasing and is doing so in every imaginable field.
If you look at any one of those mentioned, peruse their post count and then review web analytics for unique page views. Add that all together and you have hundreds of thousands at minimum of people reading the thoughts of a prolific poster such as SY or DF. Likely many millions but without a way to crunch the numbers on the backend it will remain a guesstimate and so I err on the side of caution. That being said I’m not shooting from the hip.
Combined with their scientific background / technical acumen their influence rating from an internet researchers perspective would be weighted substantially higher.
I think any one of those people could singlehandedly create easily quantifiable change in an audio related industry.
For example, review nwavguy. Take a look at his website’s metrics.
Charting monthly forum topics here regarding cables now and then over a 6 month spread should confirm this trend.
Anyhow, the mechanism of action is not a phenomenon.
This isn’t really debatable... it’s an accepted fact across academia and industry.
That being said....
In the absence of a governmental arm or other entity without financial stake or “skin in the game” to protect various consumer and marketing claims the only protection is that of the retired expert / lone advocate running on moral fuel.
Additionally, complexity in jurisdiction / enforcement has multiplied in the last 50 years due to globalization and so the expectation that in the near future such an organization will be protecting consumers especially in this niche is hopeful at best.
I think you would be rather surprised to know how many eyes these few “gospel singers” have upon their words.
One person with a large enough internet presence can change the tune of juggernaut multinational corporations. This is not uncommon in 2018. The trend is increasing, not decreasing and is doing so in every imaginable field.
If you look at any one of those mentioned, peruse their post count and then review web analytics for unique page views. Add that all together and you have hundreds of thousands at minimum of people reading the thoughts of a prolific poster such as SY or DF. Likely many millions but without a way to crunch the numbers on the backend it will remain a guesstimate and so I err on the side of caution. That being said I’m not shooting from the hip.
Combined with their scientific background / technical acumen their influence rating from an internet researchers perspective would be weighted substantially higher.
I think any one of those people could singlehandedly create easily quantifiable change in an audio related industry.
For example, review nwavguy. Take a look at his website’s metrics.
Charting monthly forum topics here regarding cables now and then over a 6 month spread should confirm this trend.
Anyhow, the mechanism of action is not a phenomenon.
This isn’t really debatable... it’s an accepted fact across academia and industry.
That being said....
In the absence of a governmental arm or other entity without financial stake or “skin in the game” to protect various consumer and marketing claims the only protection is that of the retired expert / lone advocate running on moral fuel.
Additionally, complexity in jurisdiction / enforcement has multiplied in the last 50 years due to globalization and so the expectation that in the near future such an organization will be protecting consumers especially in this niche is hopeful at best.
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Your whole post sounds like a priest or a politico berating those who don't follow the religious doctrine/political party line.
The two 'leaders' you quote manifest total arrogance. One can easily imagine had they real power what the fate of the heretics would be.
When those like you who use the hackneyed phrase - cable believers, you don't even realise that you expose your own 'character armoured belief system'. It is you who 'believe' and it is the others who don't believe (because they are not character armoured) that can admit the possibility of change in perception.
Now obviously this is far too deep for you to understand - thought is not reality, only reality is real. If you are thinking, you are projecting, you are literally creating a buffer between you and the real world.
Also those like you always come out with the b/s about expensive cables/ connectors and that the heretics are conning themselves.
It was because i wasn't satisfied with commercial offerings and because I wasn't stupid enough to pay serious money for cables or connectors that I embarked on a journey with - shock/horror an open mind. 4 years later after many experiments i realised totally what a complete rip-off almost all commercial cables were, that the 'normal' construction was adopted only on production cost and that virtually all cables completely disregarded scientific data developed a long time ago.
DF96 who as far as I know has never been lauded by the scientific community anywhere derided a man who has - Oliver Heaviside, who even has one of earth's atmospheres named after him - the word jealousy comes to mind along with his over arching ego/narcissistic personality.
The consumer does need protecting from the likes of you and your dictatorial mentality.
I can well remember visiting a trading estate (when we still had them) and a Uni student telling a working man what he should think and what he should do - I looked at him and said "your not going to stand for that, are you?" - "no" he said and with an excellent uppercut he decked the arrogant student and all those nearby cheered. When the prat came round I said "have you learned anything" - I heard later that he had morphed into something else and joined the Nasty party.
If you had written a post elaborating on the history, 1960s' onwards of consumer indoctrination via TV advertising or in the case of audio via the glossy mags it would have had some value but as it is you come across as an apparatchik spouting the boring party line.
The two 'leaders' you quote manifest total arrogance. One can easily imagine had they real power what the fate of the heretics would be.
When those like you who use the hackneyed phrase - cable believers, you don't even realise that you expose your own 'character armoured belief system'. It is you who 'believe' and it is the others who don't believe (because they are not character armoured) that can admit the possibility of change in perception.
Now obviously this is far too deep for you to understand - thought is not reality, only reality is real. If you are thinking, you are projecting, you are literally creating a buffer between you and the real world.
Also those like you always come out with the b/s about expensive cables/ connectors and that the heretics are conning themselves.
It was because i wasn't satisfied with commercial offerings and because I wasn't stupid enough to pay serious money for cables or connectors that I embarked on a journey with - shock/horror an open mind. 4 years later after many experiments i realised totally what a complete rip-off almost all commercial cables were, that the 'normal' construction was adopted only on production cost and that virtually all cables completely disregarded scientific data developed a long time ago.
DF96 who as far as I know has never been lauded by the scientific community anywhere derided a man who has - Oliver Heaviside, who even has one of earth's atmospheres named after him - the word jealousy comes to mind along with his over arching ego/narcissistic personality.
The consumer does need protecting from the likes of you and your dictatorial mentality.
I can well remember visiting a trading estate (when we still had them) and a Uni student telling a working man what he should think and what he should do - I looked at him and said "your not going to stand for that, are you?" - "no" he said and with an excellent uppercut he decked the arrogant student and all those nearby cheered. When the prat came round I said "have you learned anything" - I heard later that he had morphed into something else and joined the Nasty party.
If you had written a post elaborating on the history, 1960s' onwards of consumer indoctrination via TV advertising or in the case of audio via the glossy mags it would have had some value but as it is you come across as an apparatchik spouting the boring party line.
I don't regard myself as any sort of leader. I merely state the truth as I understand it, which happens to be what is generally accepted by those with sufficient education in science and engineering. I believe in freedom of speech (unlike some on here) so I believe people with different views are free to propagate their nonsense and I am free to correct them. Some will come back with a coherent counter-argument; others will merely spout insults and vague threats.Black Stuart said:
More remote psychology - you do realise how silly that looks? I have no idea what you mean by me "deriding" OH; on the contrary I have a high regard for him and used one of his mathematical techniques in my PhD thesis. Perhaps you could clarify your remark? I do seem to recall someone (possibly you?) saying that OH disagreed with me in some point but then refused to elaborate. By the way, he had an ionised layer named after him - not an "atmosphere".
Certain types of people always seem to be not far from violence and veiled threats of violence. Sadly, they often project these ideas onto others who have no thoughts of violence at all. Perhaps you live in a rough neighbourhood?
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If the LDR creates a pleasing distortion, can we not use it specifically for this purpose. In other words, we wire up a non-LDR volume control (designed for low distortion etc.) and then we put in series (or shunt) an LDR device. This device can have a constant input to the LED side of it. It could also be switcheable 'in' 'out' or used as a soft-mute etc. The circuit would be way simpler than an LDR volume control.
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