The mentioned "DAC END" is a NOS DAC, the designer had no digital filter in mind.
The DAC proposed in this thread is a NOS DAC, the title is clear "Building the ultimate NOS DAC using TDA1541A", again no digital filter in mind.
Moreover nowadays you don't need any digital filter for the above DACs, you can merely resample in software.
Finally, there is no need to punctualize that I2S is the physical interface and PCM is the data format, moreover used by the I2S interface.
It is pure academy as well as out of place.
In this context the meaning is clear even if it is nonsense from an academic point of view.
Both AD1865 and TDA1541A accept PCM data format, but only the TDA1541A provides I2S interface.
So when someone writes I2S to PCM the meaning is providing a I2S interface to a DAC that does not support it.
And it is clear to everyone.
The DAC proposed in this thread is a NOS DAC, the title is clear "Building the ultimate NOS DAC using TDA1541A", again no digital filter in mind.
Moreover nowadays you don't need any digital filter for the above DACs, you can merely resample in software.
Finally, there is no need to punctualize that I2S is the physical interface and PCM is the data format, moreover used by the I2S interface.
It is pure academy as well as out of place.
In this context the meaning is clear even if it is nonsense from an academic point of view.
Both AD1865 and TDA1541A accept PCM data format, but only the TDA1541A provides I2S interface.
So when someone writes I2S to PCM the meaning is providing a I2S interface to a DAC that does not support it.
And it is clear to everyone.
Thanks, I understand each chip is designed for specific protocols, I'll refer to the datasheets. I am uncertain which chip I am interested in - initially TDA1541A given its reputation. However, considering the price for a NOS chip and given it is my first attempt at a design, I thought it would be prudent to build with something more available. The AD1865 seems a popular choice and is still reasonably priced (around $24 USD per for AD1865N-J). My commercial PCM56 NOS DAC uses Crystal CS8414 on the digital front end with coaxial SPDIF inputs from my music server. For the sake of the familiar, I think I would take a similar approach, the reason I was reviewing "DAC END"
In terms of educational text, I've found The Data Conversion Handbook from Analog Devices, seems a useful introduction to design theory.
The Data Conversion Handbook, 2005 | Education | Analog Devices
I'm sorry I did not mean to trigger controversy
You could start with the TDA1543, which is where this lark all started. The internet has more than enough schematics for that one. There is at least two in this forum.
One more thing. In the spirit of it-means-what-I-it-to-mean-when-it-to-mean-it we now have delta-sigma nos dacs so don't you have to restrict yourself to expensive icons.
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I had considered it, and given my inexperience in this area it is sound advice. Starting simple and increasing complexity as knowledge / experience grows has been my approach so far, let me take a look at some of these schematics! Thank you.
Very interesting, I will have to read into this further. Seems it is not trivial to operate the TDA1541A in simultaneous mode, no? The reason I2S is more common?
Thank you for the links, I have been poring over datasheets and schematics for a few hours, the puzzle pieces are beginning to fall into place, I now have a reasonable understanding of the implementation of the CS8412/CS8414 with TDA1543/TDA1541A with I2S input, and better understanding of the need for a hex inverter to generate the right latch signal for the AD1865 in the DAC END. I did much reading on I2S vs. AES/EBU, which was very helpful.
The schematic in post #92 you linked is quite simple! Maybe I will use it as a learning framework. I believe I read somewhere on the forum there are improvements to be had using an external voltage reference as opposed to the on-chip reference for the TDA1543.
Thanks, I understand each chip is designed for specific protocols, I'll refer to the datasheets. I am uncertain which chip I am interested in - initially TDA1541A given its reputation. However, considering the price for a NOS chip and given it is my first attempt at a design, I thought it would be prudent to build with something more available. The AD1865 seems a popular choice and is still reasonably priced (around $24 USD per for AD1865N-J). My commercial PCM56 NOS DAC uses Crystal CS8414 on the digital front end with coaxial SPDIF inputs from my music server. For the sake of the familiar, I think I would take a similar approach, the reason I was reviewing "DAC END"
In terms of educational text, I've found The Data Conversion Handbook from Analog Devices, seems a useful introduction to design theory.
The Data Conversion Handbook, 2005 | Education | Analog Devices
I'm sorry I did not mean to trigger controversy
You could take a look at Ian's Universal I2S-PCM driver board thread
Drive NOS AD1865/62,PCM1704/02/63,TDA1541 from FIFO: Universal I2S-PCM driver board
Although someone keeps to be a professor discussing the meaning of a word, with Ian's I2S-PCM board you can drive the most part of R2R DACs (it does not drive the modern AD5791 and DAC11001).
Don't worry about controversy, you will learn that there are few people (like Ian) who contribute their ideas and projects to this forum, while there are a bunch of people who claim to know the absolute truth but their contribution to the audio community is very little if any.
I attach a picture of my DAC END with the AD1865 I have built some years ago.
Attachments
It is trivial to implement. Most sources supply I2S, so you either find a source that provides PCM directly, or use a converter. Ian's is a fine choice. RyanJ implemented the ecdesigns design in a group buy which may have some advantages. Ian's is readily available while the Ryanj pcb was a one time GB and supply may be exhausted.
Thanks. My understanding in the DAC END, and similar CS8414 AD1865 pairings, is the use of a hex inverter to create the latch signal for the right channel causes a small inter-channel delay that can be fixed by using a shift register? Although it seems it may not be worth it as it is nearly inaudible. I2S to PCM converter would resolve the issue I am sure by syncing the two channels.
Very nice build BTW, clean and well-organized!
My music server outputs coaxial or optical SPDIF and USB. In terms of implementation, could my digital front end look like so:
Coxaxial SPDIF > CS8414 I2S output > Ian's I2S PCM converter > DAC PCM input (AD1865, TDA1541A simultaneous)
Or a similar USB approach. I apologize if I've made a mental error, I've only just learned this yesterday
That should work. Also worth looking at I2S over USB Audio - Home
USB-jlsounds in synchronous mode - TDA1541a
I have no experience, but maybe better sound than spdif?
For best result, look at Andrea's upcoming FIFO with synchronous output with better clocks. He can describe the chain.
USB-jlsounds in synchronous mode - TDA1541a
I have no experience, but maybe better sound than spdif?
For best result, look at Andrea's upcoming FIFO with synchronous output with better clocks. He can describe the chain.
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@ Lord
see my vintage site for TDA1543 stuff or the pdf below
may be of help to you
DDDAC 2000
Just Sharing
see my vintage site for TDA1543 stuff or the pdf below
may be of help to you
DDDAC 2000
Just Sharing
@LordGwyn : you can't use the Ian's I2StoPCM board without it to be slaved by a clock : it has an input uf-l pad for that purpose.
The JLSounds USB to I2S/sim mode is the better place to start with :it sounds bes and is cheaper if you consider you can to do all with a standalone board, and is compatible with several old PCM chip like the ones you talk about.
The JLSounds USB to I2S/sim mode is the better place to start with :it sounds bes and is cheaper if you consider you can to do all with a standalone board, and is compatible with several old PCM chip like the ones you talk about.
Thanxs dear rfbrw,
That buffer on the I2S is interesting. I think I might try it on a 32-chips (16 chips per side) DUAL MONO TDA1543DAC and see if it can handle it.
My present 32-chips DUAL MONO TDA1543DAC - SD card player sounds great dirty but great! And Yes, manganin low inductance-low capacitance I/V for me too.
Cheers,
M.
That buffer on the I2S is interesting. I think I might try it on a 32-chips (16 chips per side) DUAL MONO TDA1543DAC and see if it can handle it.
My present 32-chips DUAL MONO TDA1543DAC - SD card player sounds great
dirty but great! And Yes, manganin low inductance-low capacitance I/V for me too. Cheers,
M.
Thank you for the link! Very intriguing board, I've reached out to JLSounds about a purchase. I'll take a look at the FIFO you mentioned as well.
@ Lord
see my vintage site for TDA1543 stuff or the pdf below
may be of help to you
DDDAC 2000
Just Sharing
Hi dddac - it's funny but I had some across your site already while searching for TDA1543 schematics
I appreciate the work you've done, I will look it over again.Duly noted diyiggy, as I mentioned I think this is the route I will take - I2S over USB for use of either TDA1541A in simultaneous mode or one of the other PCM chips like AD1865, PCM56, etc. Looks like a great offering with a lot of flexibility.
Thanks for the recommendations all
You have a great cheap little board which has few months and one of the best PCM chip : AD1862 in this section by Miro1360 : the input is made with the hex inverters from an I2S source like the AD1865.
Nice project, simple, cheap as it's a shared gerbers and printing cost nothing via JPLCB. The chip can be sourced from Rochester, so genuine; But a member is making a group buy, he also has AD1865. If the TDA1543 is great to start, you will have hard times to find better sounding PCM dac chips than the TDA1541A, AD1862, and PCM56. My humble contribution if music matters ! At least saying things in a jungle is already a contribution, a simple one when you surrounded by noise and egos!
Nice project, simple, cheap as it's a shared gerbers and printing cost nothing via JPLCB. The chip can be sourced from Rochester, so genuine; But a member is making a group buy, he also has AD1865. If the TDA1543 is great to start, you will have hard times to find better sounding PCM dac chips than the TDA1541A, AD1862, and PCM56. My humble contribution if music matters ! At least saying things in a jungle is already a contribution, a simple one when you surrounded by noise and egos!