Dryseals said:
Your a bit far. I live in Coppell, near Dallas. I have been looking at one of the 1 cubic foot enclosures from Parts Express. That should work with any of the designs that have been recommended for an MTM. I know this is not an exact science and if I decide to put together my own configuration, it probably won't work that great the first time around. Besides, if it was an exact science it wouldn't as much fun to learn. Its all about the challenge.
Ceibal said:
No problem, just thought I would offer. I'm bouncing back and forth from the shop to the inside today, a tad cool for these old bones, can't wait for the sun to warm things up.
I would like to make one suggestion, if you plan on cutting your own holes, invest in the Jasper Jig and a router, it will save you time, effort and head aches.
Plunge router works best for this type of work. You don't have to buy a high dollar one, I have more routers than most guys have underwear and the elcheapo craftsman that I keep the jig attached to works just as well as the high dollar Freud and Dewalts I have. I could have bought three or four of the Craftsman for the price of some of the others.
Not all router screw holes line up, each is a tad different. The circular based routers seem to fit better. Many of the truncated bases only allow two screws hole to line up.
Pick up a small piece of 3/4" MDF at one of the box stores and take a few practice runs on it. Write down your setting as you do it and re-measure after your cuts and test fit your speakers. You'll only get one shot at the baffle.
The jig is designed to work with a 1/4" bit, but I use anything from a half on down. Just do the math, 1/2" bit is going to cut a hole 1/4" wider than the mark and saves time rather than making multiple passes with a smaller bit.
Suns out, good luck.
ScottG said:
..but don't fail to mention that the sentiment expressed here does NOT apply to their other tools. OMG - craftsman table saws are barely adequate for cutting framing lumber.
Actually Scott, I have a full wood working shop with pretty much any thing a man could want. Right smack dab in the middle is a 80's vintage aluminum topped 10" Crapsman table saw. I put a decent fence on it a few years back and cannot bring myself to buy another table saw. I've ripped 8/4 redoak with it without a hitch.
More often than not blade alignment, blade and the fence are the problems with table saws, after all, it's just spinning a blade. I've looked at some real nice ones, but until it dies on me, I'll just keep buying the other tools. Just bought a Performax 10/20 drum sander last week end, talk about sweet, no more long hours of sanding for this fool.
Dryseals said:
Well all I can say is good for you!
I've had one, my father has had one, and even my grandfather has tried them, so throughout a substantial period of time altogether with different models (though all 12") - and not one could hold a blade straight for more than a week even with proper adjustment AND quality stabilizers.
In fact the one I got (for helping to frame my parents house) about 16 years back was easily the worst of the bunch.
A good cast delta with stabilizers and an incra fence - THATS a table saw.
Anyway, as long as you are prepared to foot the bill for bits, even a craftsman router with external speed control and a good table attachment can typically do every thing required for this hobby at an overall lower cost and usually better finish level. Hint, Hint Ceibal.
ScottG said:
Well all I can say is good for you!
I've had one, my father has had one, and even my grandfather has tried them, so throughout a substantial period of time altogether with different models (though all 12") - and not one could hold a blade straight for more than a week even with proper adjustment AND quality stabilizers.
In fact the one I got (for helping to frame my parents house) about 16 years back was easily the worst of the bunch.
A good cast delta with stabilizers and an incra fence - THATS a table saw.
Anyway, as long as you are prepared to foot the bill for bits, even a craftsman router with external speed control and a good table attachment can typically do every thing required for this hobby at an overall lower cost and usually better finish level. Hint, Hint Ceibal.
Hint, Hint Ceibal, thats where I was aiming. I'm afraid once I do step off into a better table saw I'll be kicking myself for waiting so long. But folks don't need the best to get going. As Clint Eastwood would say, "A man's got to know his limitations" and it's true with tools too.
Dryseals said:
Hint, Hint Ceibal, thats where I was aiming. I'm afraid once I do step off into a better table saw I'll be kicking myself for waiting so long. But folks don't need the best to get going. As Clint Eastwood would say, "A man's got to know his limitations" and it's true with tools too.
Thanks for the recommendation on the router, I was about to ask some of you that question.
The MTM I will (at some point) build looks to be at 4ohm impedence unless I choose different speakers. My reciever is a Denon avr 2000 with 85w accross the front and 25w in the rear. My rear speakers (which will be my dipoles in the near future) are 8ohm and so is my center channel. Given this do you recommend building 4ohms speakers or 8? I have noticed many if not all of the designs are 4ohm that people are building.
ScottG said:
A good cast delta with stabilizers and an incra fence - THATS a table saw.
Anyway, as long as you are prepared to foot the bill for bits, even a craftsman router with external speed control and a good table attachment can typically do every thing required for this hobby at an overall lower cost and usually better finish level. Hint, Hint Ceibal.
What's this Ceibal you speak of?
Are you talking of using a router and router table as a poor man's table saw?
Thanks for the recommendation on the router, I was about to ask some of you that question.
The MTM I will (at some point) build looks to be at 4ohm impedence unless I choose different speakers. My reciever is a Denon avr 2000 with 85w accross the front and 25w in the rear. My rear speakers (which will be my dipoles in the near future) are 8ohm and so is my center channel. Given this do you recommend building 4ohms speakers or 8? I have noticed many if not all of the designs are 4ohm that people are building.
The MTM I will (at some point) build looks to be at 4ohm impedence unless I choose different speakers. My reciever is a Denon avr 2000 with 85w accross the front and 25w in the rear. My rear speakers (which will be my dipoles in the near future) are 8ohm and so is my center channel. Given this do you recommend building 4ohms speakers or 8? I have noticed many if not all of the designs are 4ohm that people are building.
Ceibal said:
Mi dispiace. I've been watching the God Father, lived in Italy during the 70's, it's very easy for me to get lost in it again.
I'm old school, 8's are for home 4' are for car's. Not to be said that 4' can't perform at home, I'm just set in my ways for various reasons, amp loads being the better of them. If I had had 8's already, I would stay that line. Watts are cheap.
But that's my opinion, just as I like sealed better than ported.
Listen to what you like and build what you want to and if you don't like them, build again. It's a hobby, it's all for fun. Once you fall into the pit of perfection, it's no longer a hobby. And the Don Quixote rule of speakers will eat you alive.
Dryseals said:
Dryseals said:
What is your opinion on the router buddy vs the jasper jig?
http://www.partsexpress.com/webpage.cfm?webpage_id=3&CAT_ID=54&ObjectGroup_ID=876
SURPLUS ITEMS - Blemished speakers, demo speakers, ScanSpeak drivers, surplus electronics and used audio equipment.
Check out the oval 15 and 30 prototypes. I could almost guarantee they will outperfor most anything else at that price and allow a lot of flexibility due to a low crossover point.
Also check out solen.ca if you want someone to design a crossover for you. Very helpful!
Check out the oval 15 and 30 prototypes. I could almost guarantee they will outperfor most anything else at that price and allow a lot of flexibility due to a low crossover point.
Also check out solen.ca if you want someone to design a crossover for you. Very helpful!
Build Seas Thor (in closed box) with this crossover, should be all your looking for.
HTGuide Forum - View Single Post - seas thor crossover redesign help
Whole thread:
HTGuide Forum - seas thor crossover redesign help
Edit: Oh this was an ooold thread...
HTGuide Forum - View Single Post - seas thor crossover redesign help
Whole thread:
HTGuide Forum - seas thor crossover redesign help
Edit: Oh this was an ooold thread...
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I am certain that you have not listened to enough sealed and vented midbass/bass designs to actually know what the audible difference is between them, if any. I don't understand why you are so biased against vented designs; they perform much better than sealed in some (important) ways.
Anyway, for what you currently know, I think you're asking the wrong questions and are definitely putting the cart before the horse.
EDIT: Oh man, perceptionchanges bumped a 3 year old thread. Great.
Anyway, for what you currently know, I think you're asking the wrong questions and are definitely putting the cart before the horse.
EDIT: Oh man, perceptionchanges bumped a 3 year old thread. Great.
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out of 10 good woofers, maybe 9 are best suited fore BR, and just one is ideal fore closed
I think you could say that the technically best woofers are only good fore vented, and designed to be used that way
I still build closed though
besides thta, it seems to me that bass definition is to a large degree determined by crossover
and not only the bass section, but the complete xo as a whole
I think you could say that the technically best woofers are only good fore vented, and designed to be used that way
I still build closed though
besides thta, it seems to me that bass definition is to a large degree determined by crossover
and not only the bass section, but the complete xo as a whole
I have this idea that with the 21st century high SPL pro woofers that are relatively high Fs and low VAS, now is the time for infinite baffle Isobaric (compound mass) to come to its own. SqrtFs and same VAS for same SPL as one at 4 Ohm. Class D and controllers cheap & abundant if for active.
You lower Fs by sqrtHz and you use up as much back box as for one unit when employing two. The gain is you end up with a 35Hz free air resonance from say a 50Hz woofer without increasing volume of air displacement. I.e. you go lower and you economize in box volume. The loss is you go 4 Ohm without any 2.83VSPL referenced increase.
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