Hi!
I have been thinking about building myself a pair of stand mount 3-way speakers with the following drivers.
I have been curious about dome midranges so I thought about trying it out. Not much else to try in the pricerange!
Bliesma t25A or S
Bliesma m74A or S
The youtube channel PresentDayProduction loved the Silk version for their studio monitors but reviews I have read often say they seem soft and the A version is less colored. The same channel used a dayton audio woofer to pair, but as the build is still getting quite expensive a "couple" extra bucks for higher end woofer could be worth it..
For midbass I am not really sure yet, there is a ton to choose from.. The following drivers seems to meet my requirements:
Scan-Speak 18W/8535-01
Scan-Speak 18W/8531G00
SB-Acoustics MW19P-8
But as I said, there is a lot to choose from so any suggestions are welcome.
The plan is to make the speaker as small as possible, or at least not big so I am thinking sealed. Since I am planning to run with subs I do not need a lot of low end extension, crossing at 80hz is probably alright. As subwoofers a pair of SB audience Bianco-18sw450 in sealed enclosures.
Going active crossover with either a Minidsp flex eight or two 2x4hd. Tubes for tweeter and midrange, class D for bass and subwoofer.
I have attached a pair of pictures, please don't mock my sketchup skills, second day of ever using it!
Any advice or suggestions welcome. Or tell me I am an idiot 🙂
Regards Jackbob
I have been thinking about building myself a pair of stand mount 3-way speakers with the following drivers.
I have been curious about dome midranges so I thought about trying it out. Not much else to try in the pricerange!
Bliesma t25A or S
Bliesma m74A or S
The youtube channel PresentDayProduction loved the Silk version for their studio monitors but reviews I have read often say they seem soft and the A version is less colored. The same channel used a dayton audio woofer to pair, but as the build is still getting quite expensive a "couple" extra bucks for higher end woofer could be worth it..
For midbass I am not really sure yet, there is a ton to choose from.. The following drivers seems to meet my requirements:
Scan-Speak 18W/8535-01
Scan-Speak 18W/8531G00
SB-Acoustics MW19P-8
But as I said, there is a lot to choose from so any suggestions are welcome.
The plan is to make the speaker as small as possible, or at least not big so I am thinking sealed. Since I am planning to run with subs I do not need a lot of low end extension, crossing at 80hz is probably alright. As subwoofers a pair of SB audience Bianco-18sw450 in sealed enclosures.
Going active crossover with either a Minidsp flex eight or two 2x4hd. Tubes for tweeter and midrange, class D for bass and subwoofer.
I have attached a pair of pictures, please don't mock my sketchup skills, second day of ever using it!
Any advice or suggestions welcome. Or tell me I am an idiot 🙂
Regards Jackbob
Attachments
Considering the associated cost of the drivers, looking into a waveguide for the tweeter, check out augerpro, and possibly some baffle shaping for the midrange could be a good idea, polar pattern control should be of decent importance.
Otherwise I'm looking forward to the results, I hope you post measurements.
Otherwise I'm looking forward to the results, I hope you post measurements.
An impressive scope.
My only two cents is why not also consider the Bliesma P version, and maybe have a look at the newly revised 18W Classics + the 18WU.
My only two cents is why not also consider the Bliesma P version, and maybe have a look at the newly revised 18W Classics + the 18WU.
I agree that you should give the M74P a serious look. For a woofer you should include the Satori WO24P on your list.
Hm, I can't remember why I disregarded the P version. Upon further review it does seem like the better choice for me. Kind of a middle ground between the two. Guess I was reading with biased eyes after reading good things about the A and S but not heard much about the P.
The 18w classics seems to roll of earlier and offer less headroom than the other woofers.. If I am looking at the right one. I have been looking at the 18WU, but I guess I had to set the budget cap somewhere haha. Really nice woofers but at almost 100% more expensive than the classic 18w, I do not know if it's worth it. The woofer will not be used over that wide of a frequency range.
I have been thinking about a waveguide, but one thing I really like about the Bliesma is the small size. I know, kind of stupid since sound<looks but since the design is occupying my head right now I have a hard time letting it go.
And tips on baffle shaping? I will probably try to make the baffle as small as possible, the cut of edges on the sketchup is more of a general idea than absolute. I am looking for a new tablesaw and depending on what I get a hold of might limit me in form of cutting depth while making the baffle.
Your mock is similar to the facets on https://heissmann-acoustics.de/en/dxt-mon-rly/
He writes about depth tests here https://heissmann-acoustics.de/en/schraege-fasen/
Otherwise, you might like to play with tweeter and mid offsets using The Edge/Basta/Vituicad diffraction tool, on a normal rectangle + big roundovers
He writes about depth tests here https://heissmann-acoustics.de/en/schraege-fasen/
Otherwise, you might like to play with tweeter and mid offsets using The Edge/Basta/Vituicad diffraction tool, on a normal rectangle + big roundovers
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Good read. The plan was to keep the chamfer as close to the mid and tweeter as possible, but since this is a first sketch I just draw lines and saw where it got me. One idea is to make the box more triangular to keep the width at the top smaller and that also leads to non parallel sides i the enclosure, never wrong. Although it makes the volume smaller so I have to see how that effects the response
Another vote for a WO24P in a Sealed Box -
4 ohm version Q=0.7 in 33litres gives f3 50hz (What I have),
8 ohm version Q=0.7 in 35litres gives f3 46hz.
Major break up is around 3khz and can be used up to about 1khz easily with low distortion. Cross over to the M74 at around 700-800hz and you will be fine. I use the EM1308 dome mid and it works really well with the WO24P-4 - active crossover at 700hz (about as low as I dare go).
4 ohm version Q=0.7 in 33litres gives f3 50hz (What I have),
8 ohm version Q=0.7 in 35litres gives f3 46hz.
Major break up is around 3khz and can be used up to about 1khz easily with low distortion. Cross over to the M74 at around 700-800hz and you will be fine. I use the EM1308 dome mid and it works really well with the WO24P-4 - active crossover at 700hz (about as low as I dare go).
The WO24P is the obvious choice if I would like to make the 3-way a full range speaker. But since it's what I'm planning basically becomes a four way system I don't think I need the low end extension. An f3 at 80hz should be enough. A smaller woofer makes it easier to keep the baffle small, C-C distances low and overall speaker looking good on a stand. Although I'm continuing sketching and looking at the simulations and including the WO24P, I not better than I can change my mind.
Thinking crossover at 600hz, maybe lower if I am feeling bold. I live in an apartment and loud listening levels are not common.
Thinking crossover at 600hz, maybe lower if I am feeling bold. I live in an apartment and loud listening levels are not common.
For an accurate low distortion bass driver which works beautifully in 12 to 15 liters I can highly recommend the Beyma MC 500 (sim attached) which sounds gorgeous over the 80 Hz up to 800 Hz band. I crossed it over at 600 Hz to a 5 inch (70 Sd) full range driver and loved it.
It is 250 mm diameter but the extra Sd means at normal 70 dB to 90 dB the driver is hardly moving and even at 96 dB continuous is moving less than +/- 0.8 mm ... Its X max is 8 mm. A single driver will hold 110 dB continuous SPL @ 1 meter with 250 watts (half its rated power of 500 watts AES) .... A pair will hit 116 dB peaks at 1 meter if required!
It is 250 mm diameter but the extra Sd means at normal 70 dB to 90 dB the driver is hardly moving and even at 96 dB continuous is moving less than +/- 0.8 mm ... Its X max is 8 mm. A single driver will hold 110 dB continuous SPL @ 1 meter with 250 watts (half its rated power of 500 watts AES) .... A pair will hit 116 dB peaks at 1 meter if required!
Hence the driver I posted works in just 12 litres...
Hence the sim showing just 0.8 mm cone travel at 96dB....Nice to know it can do 116dB peaks... Better to have it and not need it Vs...6 or 7 inch rubber surround driver flapping about as it has to travel double or triple distance...
Hence the sim showing just 0.8 mm cone travel at 96dB....Nice to know it can do 116dB peaks... Better to have it and not need it Vs...6 or 7 inch rubber surround driver flapping about as it has to travel double or triple distance...
I think the 10" will look to big to fit my design, but I will definitely sketch it up to get a better look at it.
But maybe the 8" version of the drivers might work better design wise and rise the SD of the w19p woofers from 158 to 220 for an 8" beyma.
Another thing I need to think more about is sensitivity, all drivers except for the woofer in my design have high sensitivity. Choosing a woofer that matches makes future amp choosing a lot easier, even if I have power to spare now it would be nice to maybe have a tube amp for woofer duty as well. I have also been thinking about buying an amplifier kit to build, assemble myself. These kits are often low wattage.
This is exactly why I started the thread, all suggestions are welcome and it's getting me think things over so I don't lock myself in to a specific design and drivers.
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Wait, SB Bianco 18" sealed subs?
Do you already have them? I got my Lavoce 12" woofers recently and plan on crossing them at 500Hz to 1kHz for a 2-way design with no subs.
It seems like you're really talking about 4-way, if including the subs. I'm not sure if there would be much benefit for an extra mid between the tweeter and 6.5 woofer. What about the baffle step? 2x horizontally opposed 8" pro-audio mids could fill that gap?
Yes, the system will a 4-way but since the system will be split in two cabinets a choose to call it a 3-way + subs. Maybe a bit confusing! But calling it a 4-way felt wrong as well.