TWEAKERS HEAVEN.
Hi,
Bob,
Have you ever tried to remove the plastic insulation from the BGs and listen to that?
Or any other electrolutic cap for that matter?
Be careful,some may have the - pole connected to the can.
Some while back we discussed that here,I tried it and there just is no going back.
I could point to some other tweaks (no cost involved) that all make a nice difference to the perceived sound.
I just want to take it one step at a time.
Cheers,
P.S.I regret Jean-Pauls' decision but I feel there's more to that than just the BG discussion.
Hi,
Bob,
Have you ever tried to remove the plastic insulation from the BGs and listen to that?
Or any other electrolutic cap for that matter?
Be careful,some may have the - pole connected to the can.
Some while back we discussed that here,I tried it and there just is no going back.
I could point to some other tweaks (no cost involved) that all make a nice difference to the perceived sound.
I just want to take it one step at a time.
Cheers,
P.S.I regret Jean-Pauls' decision but I feel there's more to that than just the BG discussion.
Re: Re: Re: Re: BG stuff
Bob,
You know very well that I will punch holes in those reports, because that was what this was all about: about the relevance (or absence thereof) of these tech reports to the quality of BGs, NOT on how they sound. You believe they sound good, and I accept that. I said that based on the tech reports I would not buy them. I never said they will sound bad based on the tech reports.
I have two identical power amps, each can be switched between class B or class A which I use for comparison purposes. Based on what I read here, I may become tempted to get a couple of BGs and ask my friends (to remain objective) for blind test.
I DO doubt (not sure I said it) that people resorting to outright misleading tech reports (and don't challenge me on that) would be honest in WHATEVER they have to say. I put a lot of value on intellectual honesty, that is my "belief". I also put a lot of faith in Jonathan Carr's post where he stated that he thought the BGs were overly coloring the sound, a statement that is directly in conflict with both most users on this forum and BGs tech info (transparent is one of the words they use). Jonathan makes a living from what he decides to put in his amps, and believe me, if your next installment on the Lexus depends on how well you can sell your amps, you tend to very quickly become good at separating the relevant from the irrelevant.
I regret very much that apparently you cannot accept your own belief that BG sounds good if someone challenges their tech documentation, and that you have to resort to personal hits using words like "juvenile" or "irrelevant info" describing my posts, without being capable to offer one single word of factual critique. Somehow I think my studying of and commenting to the remaining tech info will not change that. Let us therefore all spend our time on more pleasurable pasttimes.
Jan Didden
Bobken said:
Bob,
You know very well that I will punch holes in those reports, because that was what this was all about: about the relevance (or absence thereof) of these tech reports to the quality of BGs, NOT on how they sound. You believe they sound good, and I accept that. I said that based on the tech reports I would not buy them. I never said they will sound bad based on the tech reports.
I have two identical power amps, each can be switched between class B or class A which I use for comparison purposes. Based on what I read here, I may become tempted to get a couple of BGs and ask my friends (to remain objective) for blind test.
I DO doubt (not sure I said it) that people resorting to outright misleading tech reports (and don't challenge me on that) would be honest in WHATEVER they have to say. I put a lot of value on intellectual honesty, that is my "belief". I also put a lot of faith in Jonathan Carr's post where he stated that he thought the BGs were overly coloring the sound, a statement that is directly in conflict with both most users on this forum and BGs tech info (transparent is one of the words they use). Jonathan makes a living from what he decides to put in his amps, and believe me, if your next installment on the Lexus depends on how well you can sell your amps, you tend to very quickly become good at separating the relevant from the irrelevant.
I regret very much that apparently you cannot accept your own belief that BG sounds good if someone challenges their tech documentation, and that you have to resort to personal hits using words like "juvenile" or "irrelevant info" describing my posts, without being capable to offer one single word of factual critique. Somehow I think my studying of and commenting to the remaining tech info will not change that. Let us therefore all spend our time on more pleasurable pasttimes.
Jan Didden
Jensen 4 pole + BG comparison
Bobken + others,
We did not allow the Black Gates to burn in for 200 hours. Only about 48. The issue is though how does one maintain condition of the BGs when it is a singe ended triode amp without destroying the life of the tubes in the process.
If memory serves the DNM slit foil caps are made by BHC Aerovox. I put some of the BHCs in an amp one day and I must say IMO they were a very ordinary sounding cap. So I just did not have the confidence to try anything made by them.
I cannot imagine the BGs "breaking in" enough to bridge the gap that I heard.
Don't get me wrong the BGs do a lot of things excellent + better than the Jensens but to my ears they don't give the musical involvement that wants to keep you listening, they just make me bored instead.
I welcome all flaming for not burning in the BGs. BTW I did not burn in the Jensens either.
Craig.
Bobken + others,
We did not allow the Black Gates to burn in for 200 hours. Only about 48. The issue is though how does one maintain condition of the BGs when it is a singe ended triode amp without destroying the life of the tubes in the process.
If memory serves the DNM slit foil caps are made by BHC Aerovox. I put some of the BHCs in an amp one day and I must say IMO they were a very ordinary sounding cap. So I just did not have the confidence to try anything made by them.
I cannot imagine the BGs "breaking in" enough to bridge the gap that I heard.
Don't get me wrong the BGs do a lot of things excellent + better than the Jensens but to my ears they don't give the musical involvement that wants to keep you listening, they just make me bored instead.
I welcome all flaming for not burning in the BGs. BTW I did not burn in the Jensens either.
Craig.
Hi Frank,
No, I haven't tried that trick yet, but it has been on my "to do" list for nearly a year.
I do always 'damp' electrolytics, however, which is beneficial, but as I will only ever try out one kind of mod at a time until I am quite satisfied I fully appreciate the results of that mod alone, I haven't found a suitable 'window' yet to try this experiment.
Doing more than one mod at a time is fatal, of course, as you never know for sure which has given rise to any perceived changes (good or bad) or whether the two were complementary to each other in effect, or if they have countered any possible benefits by working against each other.
It is interesting to speculate on the likely causes of these effects from 'de-skinning' caps, and I don't think it can be much to do with damping, which, if anything, would probably be slightly lessened by the removal of a relatively soft material.
My thoughts therefore turn to dielectic effects, especially in view of my past experiences with using heatshrink.
Being a very fussy individual, I always used to use (to excess!) heat shrink on every cable or wire, because it looked aesthetically better, and provided some (welcome) support where a cable joined onto a connector.
However, I later discovered that this was actually not so good sonically, presumable entirely due to the DA of the poorish quality polyolefin type of plastic, so I will now only use Kynar, which I understand is close to PTFE in DA effects, or PTFE.
The problem with these is their higher temperature shrink point, so the cables' sleeve will melt before the heatshrink unless it is say Teflon cable, so, mostly, now I don't use anything in the pursuit of better sound.
However, it taught me a valuable lesson, and that surprisingly small areas of contact with these poor dielectrics (like the shoulder or shank of say a speaker spade, of merely a few mm squared) can be consequential.
Thinking about aluminium can electrolytics, with their quite substantial surface area being in contact with their plastic skins, I wonder if this the key to this effect.
All axial caps I have ever seen have one lead friction-welded or soldered directly to the aluminium can, and, as you pointed out, some radial types have their cans connected to one lead, as well.
Also, having tested approx 40 different makes and types of radial caps which I had in stock, many of them exibited zero or quite a low impedance from lead to case, and all of those which were apparently isolated, subsequently 'broke down' and showed a neglible impedance here when tested with a meter which uses the rather higher voltage of 9 volts, as opposed to the more usual 1.5 volt testers.
Maybe this is to be expected in view of their type of construction, and I am not suggesting that these simple tests are very scientific (before anyone else jumps on the criticising bandwagon!), and what I did not get around to trying was (the more-realistic test of) what the effects were on this lead/case impedance when one applies a certain level of voltage direct to the two leads of the caps.
My time is limited (and even more so, since I started commenting on the Forum about BGs!) but the tests I conducted do indicate that (particularly where a substantial voltage is also present, which will almost always be the case with these caps in use) the cans are not very effectively isolated from the signal passing through them!
Bearing this in mind, together with the quite large surface area of contact with these plastic sleeves, perhaps it is not so surprising after all that there are some deleterious effects caused by the inherent DA of the plastic, which diminish when it is removed.
This reminds me of another 'benefit' I gained from reading *all* of the BG reports (poor though they may be) in that in "Tech Report" # 72 it makes clear that simply because of the method of their constuction of apparently all axial electrolytics, they will not sound so good as a similar cap of radial construction. This is something which I had never given any thought to before!
In an earlier thread I mistakenly said that *none* of my recent BGs have "Rubicon" written on them, which, for what it matters, is not entirely true. I don't like making mistakes (even if they are of little consequence, such as here) but as all of my BG caps are inside my gear, I had to rely on memory, which let me down on this occasion.
In fact, after careful inspection, some of them do bear the "Rubicon" name, but they all are (as I had said) rather different packages in apperance from those I had about ten years ago.
I note that, presumably before I joined up, there were some comments on the Forum about the removal of 'cap skins', and given some time, I will look them up for interest's sake.
Regards,
No, I haven't tried that trick yet, but it has been on my "to do" list for nearly a year.
I do always 'damp' electrolytics, however, which is beneficial, but as I will only ever try out one kind of mod at a time until I am quite satisfied I fully appreciate the results of that mod alone, I haven't found a suitable 'window' yet to try this experiment.
Doing more than one mod at a time is fatal, of course, as you never know for sure which has given rise to any perceived changes (good or bad) or whether the two were complementary to each other in effect, or if they have countered any possible benefits by working against each other.
It is interesting to speculate on the likely causes of these effects from 'de-skinning' caps, and I don't think it can be much to do with damping, which, if anything, would probably be slightly lessened by the removal of a relatively soft material.
My thoughts therefore turn to dielectic effects, especially in view of my past experiences with using heatshrink.
Being a very fussy individual, I always used to use (to excess!) heat shrink on every cable or wire, because it looked aesthetically better, and provided some (welcome) support where a cable joined onto a connector.
However, I later discovered that this was actually not so good sonically, presumable entirely due to the DA of the poorish quality polyolefin type of plastic, so I will now only use Kynar, which I understand is close to PTFE in DA effects, or PTFE.
The problem with these is their higher temperature shrink point, so the cables' sleeve will melt before the heatshrink unless it is say Teflon cable, so, mostly, now I don't use anything in the pursuit of better sound.
However, it taught me a valuable lesson, and that surprisingly small areas of contact with these poor dielectrics (like the shoulder or shank of say a speaker spade, of merely a few mm squared) can be consequential.
Thinking about aluminium can electrolytics, with their quite substantial surface area being in contact with their plastic skins, I wonder if this the key to this effect.
All axial caps I have ever seen have one lead friction-welded or soldered directly to the aluminium can, and, as you pointed out, some radial types have their cans connected to one lead, as well.
Also, having tested approx 40 different makes and types of radial caps which I had in stock, many of them exibited zero or quite a low impedance from lead to case, and all of those which were apparently isolated, subsequently 'broke down' and showed a neglible impedance here when tested with a meter which uses the rather higher voltage of 9 volts, as opposed to the more usual 1.5 volt testers.
Maybe this is to be expected in view of their type of construction, and I am not suggesting that these simple tests are very scientific (before anyone else jumps on the criticising bandwagon!), and what I did not get around to trying was (the more-realistic test of) what the effects were on this lead/case impedance when one applies a certain level of voltage direct to the two leads of the caps.
My time is limited (and even more so, since I started commenting on the Forum about BGs!) but the tests I conducted do indicate that (particularly where a substantial voltage is also present, which will almost always be the case with these caps in use) the cans are not very effectively isolated from the signal passing through them!
Bearing this in mind, together with the quite large surface area of contact with these plastic sleeves, perhaps it is not so surprising after all that there are some deleterious effects caused by the inherent DA of the plastic, which diminish when it is removed.
This reminds me of another 'benefit' I gained from reading *all* of the BG reports (poor though they may be) in that in "Tech Report" # 72 it makes clear that simply because of the method of their constuction of apparently all axial electrolytics, they will not sound so good as a similar cap of radial construction. This is something which I had never given any thought to before!
In an earlier thread I mistakenly said that *none* of my recent BGs have "Rubicon" written on them, which, for what it matters, is not entirely true. I don't like making mistakes (even if they are of little consequence, such as here) but as all of my BG caps are inside my gear, I had to rely on memory, which let me down on this occasion.
In fact, after careful inspection, some of them do bear the "Rubicon" name, but they all are (as I had said) rather different packages in apperance from those I had about ten years ago.
I note that, presumably before I joined up, there were some comments on the Forum about the removal of 'cap skins', and given some time, I will look them up for interest's sake.
Regards,
The Web - where anyone can publish anything
And bear in mind they may not be correct in their statement.
It certainly goes against at least one major manufacturers choice of electrolytics in many of their products.
Do the comparisons for yourself, then decide, but never take anyone's word as gospel, in particular those with vested interests.
Andy.
And bear in mind they may not be correct in their statement.
It certainly goes against at least one major manufacturers choice of electrolytics in many of their products.
Do the comparisons for yourself, then decide, but never take anyone's word as gospel, in particular those with vested interests.
Andy.
SKINNING+HEATSHRINK.
Hi,
Well,I can only say that I concur with this statement and that I know for a fact that all else being equal an axial cap does sound better then a radially constructed one.
This is something I know for at least twenty years already.
If one considers the internal construction of most regular electrolytic caps the axial way seems the more logical one.
Admittedly these axial caps are easier to source for valve amps then sand amps.
Re:Heatshrink.
Here's a little trick:
Use some plumber PTFE tape and wrap the surface you want your heatshrink to cover with this.
Then fit the heatshrink over that.
DA problem solved.
Cheers,
Hi,
Well,I can only say that I concur with this statement and that I know for a fact that all else being equal an axial cap does sound better then a radially constructed one.
This is something I know for at least twenty years already.
If one considers the internal construction of most regular electrolytic caps the axial way seems the more logical one.
Admittedly these axial caps are easier to source for valve amps then sand amps.
Re:Heatshrink.
Here's a little trick:
Use some plumber PTFE tape and wrap the surface you want your heatshrink to cover with this.
Then fit the heatshrink over that.
DA problem solved.
Cheers,
Re: The Web - where anyone can publish anything
Hi ALW,
You maybe haven't looked at many of my recent posts, but I have been (almost in vain, it sometimes seems!) espousing exactly this point for several weeks. Everyone must try these things out for themselves.
This comment comes from someone who has said many times on this forum, that I don't really like any electrolytics (by choice I would always prefer to avoid them) as most of them sound lousy, and the few that don't are ridiculously expensive and/or problematic with their burning-in.
I will never solely take notice of what sellers have to say, even if it is not about their own products, but it does give one something to think about, and try for one's self, and that has been one of the 'benefits' of the the otherwise mainly very poor Jelmax information.
Not that I would ever now buy any ready-made gear, but out of curiosity, who are the makers you refer to, I wonder?
Regards,
ALW said:
Hi ALW,
You maybe haven't looked at many of my recent posts, but I have been (almost in vain, it sometimes seems!) espousing exactly this point for several weeks. Everyone must try these things out for themselves.
This comment comes from someone who has said many times on this forum, that I don't really like any electrolytics (by choice I would always prefer to avoid them) as most of them sound lousy, and the few that don't are ridiculously expensive and/or problematic with their burning-in.
I will never solely take notice of what sellers have to say, even if it is not about their own products, but it does give one something to think about, and try for one's self, and that has been one of the 'benefits' of the the otherwise mainly very poor Jelmax information.
Not that I would ever now buy any ready-made gear, but out of curiosity, who are the makers you refer to, I wonder?
Regards,
Re: Re: Jensen 4 pole + BG comparison
I have read here and I think it is in the BG literature that the BGs lose condition, ie. revert to their original condition if not in continous use??????
If this is the case then keeping them conditioned in tubed equipment is an expensive proposition.
peranders said:
I have read here and I think it is in the BG literature that the BGs lose condition, ie. revert to their original condition if not in continous use??????
If this is the case then keeping them conditioned in tubed equipment is an expensive proposition.
EASY ENOUGH.
Hi,
Keeping them conditioned in tubed/valved gear is easy enough to do.
Just don't you use any bleeder resistors across the caps anywhere and it's done.
For safety use 1 bleeder with a STSP switch mounted at the - side and throw the switch to discharge the cap.
You won't meet safety regulations that way but for the DIY person that should do.
Cheers,
Hi,
Keeping them conditioned in tubed/valved gear is easy enough to do.
Just don't you use any bleeder resistors across the caps anywhere and it's done.
For safety use 1 bleeder with a STSP switch mounted at the - side and throw the switch to discharge the cap.
You won't meet safety regulations that way but for the DIY person that should do.
Cheers,
mbroker said:
It doesn't look like there are any other takers for this one Mark, so here I go again.
When initially installed, BGs sound simply 'unbroken' like most other electrolytics, for a short while. They are hard sounding and without too much details, almost slightly muffled, and coarse with no sweetness at the high end.
Then after some hours they seem to undergo some quite unusual changes over a period of the following several days, during which time they swing wildly from being heavy and bloated sounding in the bass, to quite bass light and thin or much brighter sounding.
The first time I heard this it was so apparent that I initially believed that something else had gone wrong with the equipment. It was so bad that I would have taken the caps out, but due to other pressures, it wasn't convenient to do so immediately.
This turned out be good fortune, because several days later, things had settled down again, and they sounded a lot better.
It does seem to take up to 3 months for the best to be had from them, though, and maybe even longer, but, as I have said before, it really is worth the wait.
I always leave all of my equipment on all of the time, simply because it sounds better that way, so I don't know what would happen if you switch things on and off regularly, during this burning-in period. I guess it wouldn't speed the burn-in process up, though.
It is long while since I actually listened carefully to BGs during burning-in, because, nowadays, I don't even listen to any newly installed BGs until a week or more has passed, since the sound is so erratic.
Somewhere in their information, Jelmax suggest that if you 'disturb' BGs, you really need to begin again with the process, or at least that they will not be at their best again until a further period has elapsed.
I cannot say that I have heard this in quite the rather serious way they suggest, but certainly, with any gear (in spite of what all the 'know-alls' will tell you) to me, at least, it never sounds as good, regardless of what type of equipment it is, for the first few hours of use after initial switch-on.
Every piece of equipment I have tried over the years seems to improve over the course of several hours of use, and, no, I cannot explain why this is, regrettably. If you haven't already noticed this, look out for it sometime, and see if you don't think the same.
It is similar in effect (although for different reasons, as it is not only a matter of simple temperature change with audio) to warming up a car in the morning, although it takes longer, whereafter everything seems to 'run' better and audio gear simply sounds sweeter and more pleasurable to listen to. Details are clearer, bass is deeper, and sibilant voices are much less spluttery and take on a more silky sound.
Doubtless there will be a rash of others explaining why I am hopelessly wrong in this, but I am not mistaken, and why I should imagine it, or whatever, I don't know. I just accept it now I am aware of it, in the same way as many other audio phenomena, and I have learned to get along with it!
I don't need to know all about everything in life to accept things, and I am getting too old to waste time on 'fighting' things which don't matter that much to me.
I hope this is of some help.
Regards,
Re: SKINNING+HEATSHRINK.
An interesting point, Frank, and thanks for the tip but, as I said, I have (largely) overcome the problem by using PTFE heatshrink, and being very careful with my heat gun on the cable sheaths!
In fact sometimes I cheat and do it the 'dirty' way with a fag lighter, which localises the heat a lot more than with a gun.
Interestingly, I have some quite reasonable sounding 'star quad' configuration silver cable made by Descadel (from your part of the world, I believe), and when stripping the ends of this cable it is apparent that some of the insulation is made up from just such PTFE plumbers tape. The individual cores have an 'immediate' thin molded PTFE surround, then there are many layers of this plumbers type of tape which simply unwind easily, and then there is a molded jacket surrounding the whole lot for strength etc.
Incidentally, I am not yet certain in my own mind just how far away from the conductor's surface you need to keep poor dielectrics to avoid all possible 'contamination' problems, but I have done some tinkering and experiments in this direction. If I were to adopt your suggestion, I would use several layers of plumbers tape to ensure that there were no problems, as I don't think that a single thin layer would necessarily be enough.
Regards,
fdegrove said:Hi,
Re:Heatshrink.
Here's a little trick:
Use some plumber PTFE tape and wrap the surface you want your heatshrink to cover with this.
Then fit the heatshrink over that.
DA problem solved.
Cheers,
An interesting point, Frank, and thanks for the tip but, as I said, I have (largely) overcome the problem by using PTFE heatshrink, and being very careful with my heat gun on the cable sheaths!
In fact sometimes I cheat and do it the 'dirty' way with a fag lighter, which localises the heat a lot more than with a gun.
Interestingly, I have some quite reasonable sounding 'star quad' configuration silver cable made by Descadel (from your part of the world, I believe), and when stripping the ends of this cable it is apparent that some of the insulation is made up from just such PTFE plumbers tape. The individual cores have an 'immediate' thin molded PTFE surround, then there are many layers of this plumbers type of tape which simply unwind easily, and then there is a molded jacket surrounding the whole lot for strength etc.
Incidentally, I am not yet certain in my own mind just how far away from the conductor's surface you need to keep poor dielectrics to avoid all possible 'contamination' problems, but I have done some tinkering and experiments in this direction. If I were to adopt your suggestion, I would use several layers of plumbers tape to ensure that there were no problems, as I don't think that a single thin layer would necessarily be enough.
Regards,
Craig,
Thanks for the additional information re your comparisons of BGs and Jensens.
I will soon try some of the Jensens myself, and see what I think.
You are quite right about the two DNM caps, they were made by BHC, and as I said before, I wasn't over the moon about either types (compared with my then favourites), but the slit foil ones sounded better to me then than the 'T-network' 4 terminal types.
Regards,
Thanks for the additional information re your comparisons of BGs and Jensens.
I will soon try some of the Jensens myself, and see what I think.
You are quite right about the two DNM caps, they were made by BHC, and as I said before, I wasn't over the moon about either types (compared with my then favourites), but the slit foil ones sounded better to me then than the 'T-network' 4 terminal types.
Regards,
HAVE YOU EVER....???
Hi Bob,
Deskadel cable with PTFE tape?
You must have some very early trial runs our guys at BICC Vero made.
Hmmm,they shouldn't have been on the market in the first place.
The entire Deskadel range of wires was design by yours truly on behalf of Karel De Laet even before the company existed.
To the best of my knowledge Deskadel still sticks to that topology to this day.
It is plenty.
Cheers,
Hi Bob,
Deskadel cable with PTFE tape?
You must have some very early trial runs our guys at BICC Vero made.
Hmmm,they shouldn't have been on the market in the first place.
The entire Deskadel range of wires was design by yours truly on behalf of Karel De Laet even before the company existed.
To the best of my knowledge Deskadel still sticks to that topology to this day.
It is plenty.
Cheers,
Hi Frank,
Have a look at the Audiosynthesis site (audiosynthesis.co.uk , I think) cos thats where they came from about a year ago.
I'm sure David Heaton (from A/S) who I have known for years, and probably you know him too, said they were made by Descadel, but they do bear the A/S logo on them.
In fact, A/S are (or were the last time I saw an advert of theirs) the UK Descadel distributors.
I had some of their SQ (Star Quad) and some of the less pricey stuff too, off the reel, to make up some cables for several other people I know, and I kept a couple of meters back for myself.
Its OK, as I said, but it is rather too stiff for my personal liking, and in shorter lengths (I like to keep things short, Frank!) it 'pulls' on any light-weight gear, and moves it out of position after some time.
Of all the cables I have tried, I like the 'older' Audio Note silver ones the best, but I wouldn't pay their full prices for recent stuff to save my life!
I got some of their (pre UK Audio Note) top range speaker cables very cheap (old and second-hand) and they are so unusually soft to handle, quite the opposite of the A/S stuff. I like them a lot!
They have about 20 separate litz type of strands in them, which is why they are so soft of course. There is so little silver in them they should be much, much cheaper, but their name sells stuff well, I suppose.
I have some Siltech interconect from at least 20 years ago, that I also got at dealer price from Riccardo at Absolute Sounds, and that is quite nice, too.
Regards,
Have a look at the Audiosynthesis site (audiosynthesis.co.uk , I think) cos thats where they came from about a year ago.
I'm sure David Heaton (from A/S) who I have known for years, and probably you know him too, said they were made by Descadel, but they do bear the A/S logo on them.
In fact, A/S are (or were the last time I saw an advert of theirs) the UK Descadel distributors.
I had some of their SQ (Star Quad) and some of the less pricey stuff too, off the reel, to make up some cables for several other people I know, and I kept a couple of meters back for myself.
Its OK, as I said, but it is rather too stiff for my personal liking, and in shorter lengths (I like to keep things short, Frank!) it 'pulls' on any light-weight gear, and moves it out of position after some time.
Of all the cables I have tried, I like the 'older' Audio Note silver ones the best, but I wouldn't pay their full prices for recent stuff to save my life!
I got some of their (pre UK Audio Note) top range speaker cables very cheap (old and second-hand) and they are so unusually soft to handle, quite the opposite of the A/S stuff. I like them a lot!
They have about 20 separate litz type of strands in them, which is why they are so soft of course. There is so little silver in them they should be much, much cheaper, but their name sells stuff well, I suppose.
I have some Siltech interconect from at least 20 years ago, that I also got at dealer price from Riccardo at Absolute Sounds, and that is quite nice, too.
Regards,
INCEST?
Hi Bob,
I get the feeling David rolls his own from the raw materials he orders from Deskadel.
Nothing against it personally.
I know Karel (Deskadel) can be quite errr....foxy when it comes to business.
He uses an A/S preamp that I know he traded for silver.
Peter Qvortrup uses Deskadel wire too...no matter what he says he's half a foot taller then me so I shut up when he's around.
Tip: use the polyiimide (Kapton) wires...they never oxidise and last a lifetime.
You can even use your oven to reorganize the crystals.
Cheers,
Hi Bob,
I get the feeling David rolls his own from the raw materials he orders from Deskadel.
Nothing against it personally.
I know Karel (Deskadel) can be quite errr....foxy when it comes to business.
He uses an A/S preamp that I know he traded for silver.
Peter Qvortrup uses Deskadel wire too...no matter what he says he's half a foot taller then me so I shut up when he's around.
Tip: use the polyiimide (Kapton) wires...they never oxidise and last a lifetime.
You can even use your oven to reorganize the crystals.
Cheers,
I made exactly the same experience a couple of years ago!
The first time I got aware of this effect was while finetuning a mixed active/passive speaker system - fiddling with the passive xover for the mid/high. I got almost mad with it because after turning on the system the other day after some changes I thought oh dear what have You done yesterday - it`s worse now than it was - and when I finished the day before I was sure it is better now.
This went a couple of times until I realized that I modfied the thing in circles and always did the same changes forth and back. When the amps and the other electronics were cold it had a tendency to sound somewhat thin, flat and grainy with less space and less punch in the bass hence I tried to compensate for this. During the time it took to make changes the system "broke in" and everything changed again. Each time I spent hours and hours modifying until I was sure it`s definitely better and switched off. Same game repeated the next day when the thing was cold again.....
Finally I left it the way it sounded better when the system was running for some hours.
Re: Re: EASY ENOUGH.
I'd be curious to try some Jensens if they're affordable enough, and sound better than the Mallory's and LCRs I have in some of my circuits (B+). Mostly I use PP in oils for PSU and bypass when I can get them cheap. Did you get yours from NZ?
Cheers
Yeah, any component that you have to leave on permanently to work well is an issue. My new poweramps will draw about 1200W, so 24/7 to optimise the performance of some caps is a problem. All my gear stabilises sonically in about 15 mins to an hour.CraigBuckingham said:Any way the point is for me the liabilities seem to outweigh there advantages.
Still burning them though.
I'd be curious to try some Jensens if they're affordable enough, and sound better than the Mallory's and LCRs I have in some of my circuits (B+). Mostly I use PP in oils for PSU and bypass when I can get them cheap. Did you get yours from NZ?
Cheers
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