Hi and thanks for the advice. I have the unit you mention.
Actually i wanted to stay all digital. I have to read the thread first to understand the various options to control the volume.
Yes to stay digital as long as possible would be fine. Especially when i see that the unit accepts AES/EBU signal (i love this connection. Dont know why).
Thanks again, gino
Just read the manual. You can download an English version and you know you read the truth. Here on diyaudio you never know what you read - true things or nonsense. ;-)
Jan
Jan
Yes, digital volume control would have been easy to add - but I guess they were really thinking of the unit as a pure crossover.
I would think along these lines.
Adopt the DCX as a cheap PA system crossover.
Select the system gain on every channel to not quite overload any amplifier+speaker.
Now you use the full output of the DCX on every channel. no need for any attenuation.
The audience can hear the full range of audio levels from near silence to not quite overloading the speakers.
Job done.
Adopting the DCX for domestic duty is very different.
You need volume adjustment to suit a variety of listeners and a variety of moods/loudness.
This requires analogue volume control AFTER the DCX.
Adopt the DCX as a cheap PA system crossover.
Select the system gain on every channel to not quite overload any amplifier+speaker.
Now you use the full output of the DCX on every channel. no need for any attenuation.
The audience can hear the full range of audio levels from near silence to not quite overloading the speakers.
Job done.
Adopting the DCX for domestic duty is very different.
You need volume adjustment to suit a variety of listeners and a variety of moods/loudness.
This requires analogue volume control AFTER the DCX.
Hi i have just a question, as ignorant.
Would it be possible to control the volume digitally upstream the DCX ?
I mean some kind of digital preamp that sends the attenuated digital signal to the DCX ? Do digital preamps exist ? are they expensive ?
Thanks again, gino
A win 7 pc. Everything pass through it 😱
I have ripped my cds and loaded them in a NAS. Pc and NAS are connected with Ethernet cables to the same Asus router.
I have already many usb to spdif converters at hand that i could try.
Thanks, gino
Hi ! but the quality will still be ok ? I am confused. I am not an expert.
And with any SW player this way will work ? is that easy ?
Thanks again, gino
And with any SW player this way will work ? is that easy ?
Thanks again, gino
/OT
Hey ginetto, if you happen to stumble into Helgi Joensen's pewter gallery in Stavanger City Park, be sure to give him my regards! ;-)
/OT off
Hey ginetto, if you happen to stumble into Helgi Joensen's pewter gallery in Stavanger City Park, be sure to give him my regards! ;-)
/OT off
Hi of course but not very likely. I understand now of this gallery existence 😱
But i will do for sure. Kind regards, gino
With a 24 bit system, you have something like 70 dB of attenuation before you even hit the background noise of your source material. Assuming your full power, turn-everything-to-11 volume is 110 dB at the most, that means you can turn the volume down to 40 dB without sacrificing any of the dynamic range of the music. Remember that a typical analog recording is the equivalent of maybe 12 bits.
Not very familiar with Windows, but any competent music player should be able to do a decent job.
Thanks a lot again. First i will read the manual and then some tests.
This unit is very complex indeed. But surely also powerful i guess.
Thanks a lot again, gino
Here's my volume control.
Gino, why don't you tell us what system do you have (room size, speakers, amplifiers) and tell us what for will you use the DCX. Maybe we can help you with the setup of your system as a whole. People often focus on one component or an other, but the best results are achieved when you look at the system as a complete unit. This includes room acoustics, choice of speakers to suit that room and listening taste including the crossover design, appropriate amplifier(s) for the speakers, and some source of music. Every single thing adds up to the final quality of the sound.
While software volume control might sound like an easy way around you have to know you are taking away resolution from what you have - in case of your ripped CDs it is 16 bit. And believe me or not I can hear the loss of detail on my system if I do control the volume in software. I compare that with my 6ch relay attenuator, even if I lower the volume a few steps above minimum the music is as enjoyable as when the volume is turned up. Stay digital as far as you can and don't touch the digital signal as far as you can (until the DCX).
This advice cannot be achieved by playing files on a regular WIN7 distribution. While there are ways to do it on a windows platform it is either complicated or pricy. I suggest you try a linux distribution dedicated to playing audio files. I tried Daphile (which uses a tablet or phone as user interface ) and use AP-linux. I can't praise it enough what it did for the sound quality of my system. Switching to it from windows audio made a huge differenec.
I encourage you to try AP-Linux (or some other dedicated distribution you find, either win or linux) and make your own opinion.
Regarding Win vs. Linux or digital volume control, I really don't want to start a flame war or this vs that discussion, only stating my personal opinion & what worked for me.
http://www.ap-linux.com/
Gino, why don't you tell us what system do you have (room size, speakers, amplifiers) and tell us what for will you use the DCX. Maybe we can help you with the setup of your system as a whole. People often focus on one component or an other, but the best results are achieved when you look at the system as a complete unit. This includes room acoustics, choice of speakers to suit that room and listening taste including the crossover design, appropriate amplifier(s) for the speakers, and some source of music. Every single thing adds up to the final quality of the sound.
While software volume control might sound like an easy way around you have to know you are taking away resolution from what you have - in case of your ripped CDs it is 16 bit. And believe me or not I can hear the loss of detail on my system if I do control the volume in software. I compare that with my 6ch relay attenuator, even if I lower the volume a few steps above minimum the music is as enjoyable as when the volume is turned up. Stay digital as far as you can and don't touch the digital signal as far as you can (until the DCX).
This advice cannot be achieved by playing files on a regular WIN7 distribution. While there are ways to do it on a windows platform it is either complicated or pricy. I suggest you try a linux distribution dedicated to playing audio files. I tried Daphile (which uses a tablet or phone as user interface ) and use AP-linux. I can't praise it enough what it did for the sound quality of my system. Switching to it from windows audio made a huge differenec.
I encourage you to try AP-Linux (or some other dedicated distribution you find, either win or linux) and make your own opinion.
Regarding Win vs. Linux or digital volume control, I really don't want to start a flame war or this vs that discussion, only stating my personal opinion & what worked for me.
http://www.ap-linux.com/
Well, as I keep pointing out, if you have a 24 bit system, you can attenuate by 48 dB before you get down to 16 bits - and then you have 24 db more before you get into the dynamic range of normal source material.
Even in a double blind listening test?
Why not?
While I am very strongly for linux, and very much against windows, I would prefer it to be a rational and fact-based decision...
If you control volume in the behringer or some other 24 bit system then I absolutly agree with you. But when you control volume in an audio player on a PC you still have a 16 bit system on players that I am aware of, the upsampling to 24 bit happens in the ASRC chip in the DCX.
Yes, it was a double blind test, although it was hard to achieve on a PC witouth a volume control. After I set up the test procedure three people positivly identified the file with the altered volume. As a remark two files were processed in the same way, with exception of volume altering. Then they were played with the same volume. And the difference was not-so-subtle.
There are many happy hi-fi windows users but it was easier for me to get a plug and play distribution than to thinker with Win.
While I would also like to know the facts that make playing music files on Win and Linux different it is well beyond my knowledge of computers. You may study the toppic if it interests you and tell us what you find, or take a recommendation by chance and adopt the change if you like it. Sorry if it doesn't sound that way but I respect your way looking at things.
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
Yes, it was a double blind test, although it was hard to achieve on a PC witouth a volume control. After I set up the test procedure three people positivly identified the file with the altered volume. As a remark two files were processed in the same way, with exception of volume altering. Then they were played with the same volume. And the difference was not-so-subtle.
There are many happy hi-fi windows users but it was easier for me to get a plug and play distribution than to thinker with Win.
While I would also like to know the facts that make playing music files on Win and Linux different it is well beyond my knowledge of computers. You may study the toppic if it interests you and tell us what you find, or take a recommendation by chance and adopt the change if you like it. Sorry if it doesn't sound that way but I respect your way looking at things.
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
Hi and thanks again.
First of all my sincere congratulations for your very nice unit !
Then i try to explain my main goal.
Just a two ways system, with a satellite above a bass box.
I have not decided yet which bass and which satellite.
But i have in mind to perform the cut between the two with a digital x-over, more precise than a digital one from what i understand, and maybe even more transparent.
Just this.
I am pretty sure the satellites will be compact ... something like a Tannoy 8" DC base speaker. Something that should take care from let's say 150 Hz and above.
Below any possible solution, from two amplified identical sub-woofer up to some passive subs with their dedicated power amp.
I have decided for this solution because the needs of the bass and mid-high are so different. In bass a lot of power is needed but even powerful and class D will be just fine, and actually are very common in amplified subs.
From 150 Hz up some more finesse would be nice, maybe even a tub amp.
So the goal is quite vague ...
I am looking for a final set-up with a flat response from 50-15.000 and with the separation of bass from mid-high ... something like this one here
but with a Tannoy DC as satellite. And this Behringer could be useful to cut between satellite and bass box.
In the meantime i have set for an analog balanced preamp at the input of the x-over ... it will be the easiest way to control the volume.
You are perfectly right. The problem is that it is much easier to intervene on the audio system than on the listening room.
But you are right. To get good results there is a path to follow and the listening room is a main element of the playback system.
I sincerely thought it were much easier. Now i am quite scared.
thanks a lot for the very valuable advice. I will study the SW you mention.
It will be a long process. Also now i am quite busy at work and cannot dedicate much time to audio, sadly.
And much more i am renting my flat, so i cannot modify anything in it.
For now i am mainly putting info together let's say.
Congratulations again for your great design.
Kind regards, gino
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Depends on the player and on what sound subsystem you use.
There is a good discussion at Perfect Volume Control? - Hydrogenaudio Forums
I agree that if you use 16-bit volume control (and dithering), you start exceeding the real-world noise floor if you do any serious attenuation. 24 bits is another matter.
I agree, and a linux audio distro is perfect if you have a dedicated music computer. If you want to use the computer for other stuff too it becomes a more complicated issue.
I recommend reading through The Well-Tempered Computer
For volume control I used the JRiver Media Player ahead of my DCX. As stated in a post above, with 24 bit depth, you have a lot of room for volume control. I rarely used more than 10dB, as the gains of my amps were set accordingly.
And for those who worry about digital volume control, don't. I tested, measured and listened in every way I could think of. The only think I found was a lowering of the S/N ratio, which is to be expected. I could measure it, but never hear it.
And for those who worry about digital volume control, don't. I tested, measured and listened in every way I could think of. The only think I found was a lowering of the S/N ratio, which is to be expected. I could measure it, but never hear it.