BTW, why did I know that you would respond to this😀 😀 😀
The noise figure thing is correct!! No matter how you weigh it!
🙂
The noise figure thing is correct!! No matter how you weigh it!
🙂
steenoe said:
naah ......... you don't need that much of OLG , and noise with J310s certainly isn't critical in
save them for MC stage
I've completed one of my b1 buffers.
Here's my kitchen table effort.
B1 Buffer pics (4)
A few notes...
I used about 10" of 20 guage wire, that's an Lansing enclosure , and I drilled all the holes myself 🙂
It powers up, but I haven't hooked it up to anything yet...
The only other thing is that adapter puts out about ~35 v instead of the 24 it's rated for. (thats what happens when you buy from a electronic surplus store. )
Thanks to everyone that answered my queries.
Here's my kitchen table effort.
B1 Buffer pics (4)
A few notes...
I used about 10" of 20 guage wire, that's an Lansing enclosure , and I drilled all the holes myself 🙂
It powers up, but I haven't hooked it up to anything yet...
The only other thing is that adapter puts out about ~35 v instead of the 24 it's rated for. (thats what happens when you buy from a electronic surplus store. )
Thanks to everyone that answered my queries.
Re: Re: Re: B1
Yeah, I just got notice that my board shipped yesterday.
😛
Now I'm making my big order from Digi-key for a ton of misc parts
troystg said:
Yeah, I just got notice that my board shipped yesterday.
😛
Now I'm making my big order from Digi-key for a ton of misc parts
b-1 buffer- wire size
Merlin- nice link to lansing enclosures- looks like a nice product- how is the pricing?
anyone have a feelling or an opinion on minimum wire size for wiring up some inputs and outputs on the B-1
I have some alpha core solid core wire- ofc silver coated in a teflon coating- but it is 24guage- seems a bit small- but its very flexable- I guess it would be for that guage-
I also have some 20 guage solid core that i was going to use for a quasi star ground scheme
so any thoughts on whether 24 guage is to small for a preamp wire up and whether its a mistake to use two different guage wires- signal versus ground
OPINIONS welcome
rob
Merlin- nice link to lansing enclosures- looks like a nice product- how is the pricing?
anyone have a feelling or an opinion on minimum wire size for wiring up some inputs and outputs on the B-1
I have some alpha core solid core wire- ofc silver coated in a teflon coating- but it is 24guage- seems a bit small- but its very flexable- I guess it would be for that guage-
I also have some 20 guage solid core that i was going to use for a quasi star ground scheme
so any thoughts on whether 24 guage is to small for a preamp wire up and whether its a mistake to use two different guage wires- signal versus ground
OPINIONS welcome
rob
fran
thanks for your input
just for yucks could someone list the min-max wire guages and advantages and disadvantages of different uses(ie heavier ground than signal, stranded vs solid etc) or if its been discussed on the forum before, whereabouts it may lie
tnx
r
thanks for your input
just for yucks could someone list the min-max wire guages and advantages and disadvantages of different uses(ie heavier ground than signal, stranded vs solid etc) or if its been discussed on the forum before, whereabouts it may lie
tnx
r
I got it hooked between my trends TA 10.1 & my diy monica dac /trends ud 10 and it works!!! Sounds great.
I wired up the pots backwards. I'll fix that.
I'm looking forward to building the F5.
I wired up the pots backwards. I'll fix that.
I'm looking forward to building the F5.
Don't take my word as absolute, but the guides I follow are:
solid better than stranded.
smaller the signal smaller the wire size - phono stuff 28-32awg, preamp 24-28awg, power amp 18-24awg and so on.
Silver in teflon from navships on ebay is nice wire very reasonably priced. You generally use so little inside an amp its very cost effective. Buy about 5 different colours, stick with a colour inside for each use.
Flexibility is good to have, makes life easy when routing.
Use decent connectors if you can, quality of cheaper ones from china on ebay is mixed, variation in sizes etc.
I try to wire everything reasonably tidy, but thats not necessary for good sound.
Hows that? I'm no expert but they're the rough guidelines I follow.
Fran
solid better than stranded.
smaller the signal smaller the wire size - phono stuff 28-32awg, preamp 24-28awg, power amp 18-24awg and so on.
Silver in teflon from navships on ebay is nice wire very reasonably priced. You generally use so little inside an amp its very cost effective. Buy about 5 different colours, stick with a colour inside for each use.
Flexibility is good to have, makes life easy when routing.
Use decent connectors if you can, quality of cheaper ones from china on ebay is mixed, variation in sizes etc.
I try to wire everything reasonably tidy, but thats not necessary for good sound.
Hows that? I'm no expert but they're the rough guidelines I follow.
Fran
Solid is fine up to a point. When the wire starts to get kind of thick it stops carrying certain frequencies as well, so then its nice to have stranded.
See the link and scroll down.
http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm
Uriah
See the link and scroll down.
http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm
Uriah
b-1- wire types and sizes
thanks for the input- nice site -american wire size
according to their calculator 24 guage starts loosing a little signal(ohmatic loss) at about two feet(signal there and back) at .005 amps @3vac--lose about.001v- seems reasonable to me
I think stranded has issues with interstand interaction that kinda flies in the face of skin effect, diodic issues with not only conductor purity(grain structure) but also the interaction of the multiple strands and the frequency literally flying down the wire, and just plain old simple is better philosophy-I've worked with both Monster Cable and Audioguest over the years and believe that the solid core approach is better, cost and performance wise. I understand the move to stranded for heavy uses(very low guage for power) but i'm thinking even weaving solid as a sort of litz approach is the way to gofor other applications.
opinions?
rob
thanks for the input- nice site -american wire size
according to their calculator 24 guage starts loosing a little signal(ohmatic loss) at about two feet(signal there and back) at .005 amps @3vac--lose about.001v- seems reasonable to me
I think stranded has issues with interstand interaction that kinda flies in the face of skin effect, diodic issues with not only conductor purity(grain structure) but also the interaction of the multiple strands and the frequency literally flying down the wire, and just plain old simple is better philosophy-I've worked with both Monster Cable and Audioguest over the years and believe that the solid core approach is better, cost and performance wise. I understand the move to stranded for heavy uses(very low guage for power) but i'm thinking even weaving solid as a sort of litz approach is the way to gofor other applications.
opinions?
rob
udailey said:
ha I was just about to post that link after reading the previous page, uriah. I think us audiophiles are often overly conservative on wire size. I was certainly surprised upon seeing that 24AWG wire can safely carry 3.5 amps, and 22AWG can handle TWICE that...7 amps!!
oh and that calculator at the bottom of that page is pretty sweet
edit: ooo here's an even cooler one for you uber geeks http://www.electrician2.com/calculators/wireocpd_ver_1.html
24g and 3.5A, in what conditions with what insulation?pinkfloyd4ever said:I was certainly surprised upon seeing that 24AWG wire can safely carry 3.5 amps, and 22AWG can handle TWICE that...7 amps!!
If the web page does not specify the conditions, then it's almost worthless.
All I can see is "not in a bundle" but there is a caution earlier on about what parameters affect current carrying capacity.
Re: b-1 buffer- wire size
In my opinion, using the two different guage wires is not a deal at all with respect to the ground arragement. If I look into amps, there are several closed paths having own chosen ground points. The concern is how the chosen ground point of each closed path is integrated into one big common in a clever way.
>>🙂<<
rob lenk said:
In my opinion, using the two different guage wires is not a deal at all with respect to the ground arragement. If I look into amps, there are several closed paths having own chosen ground points. The concern is how the chosen ground point of each closed path is integrated into one big common in a clever way.
>>🙂<<
That particular table gives examples of what size wire to use for power transmission and for chassis wiring and also specifies the maximum frequency for 100% skin depth for a given AWG.
Here is their 'disclaimer'
:Load Carrying Capacities (see table below)
The following chart is a guideline of ampacity or copper wire current carrying capacity following the Handbook of Electronic Tables and Formulas for American Wire Gauge. As you might guess, the rated ampacities are just a rule of thumb. In careful engineering the voltage drop, insulation temperature limit, thickness, thermal conductivity, and air convection and temperature should all be taken into account. The Maximum Amps for Power Transmission uses the 700 circular mils per amp rule, which is very very conservative. The Maximum Amps for Chassis Wiring is also a conservative rating, but is meant for wiring in air, and not in a bundle. For short lengths of wire, such as is used in battery packs you should trade off the resistance and load with size, weight, and flexibility. NOTE: For installations that need to conform to the National Electrical Code, you must use their guidelines. Contact your local electrician to find out what is legal!:
Here is their 'disclaimer'
:Load Carrying Capacities (see table below)
The following chart is a guideline of ampacity or copper wire current carrying capacity following the Handbook of Electronic Tables and Formulas for American Wire Gauge. As you might guess, the rated ampacities are just a rule of thumb. In careful engineering the voltage drop, insulation temperature limit, thickness, thermal conductivity, and air convection and temperature should all be taken into account. The Maximum Amps for Power Transmission uses the 700 circular mils per amp rule, which is very very conservative. The Maximum Amps for Chassis Wiring is also a conservative rating, but is meant for wiring in air, and not in a bundle. For short lengths of wire, such as is used in battery packs you should trade off the resistance and load with size, weight, and flexibility. NOTE: For installations that need to conform to the National Electrical Code, you must use their guidelines. Contact your local electrician to find out what is legal!:
AndrewT said:
DUH...of course, you're right, andrew, as always. As an engineering major I should've known better. I was actually looking for a similar chart (but more detailed, with such things as ambient temp, insulation, etc) by an internationally recognized and accepted source, like IEEE or IEC, but couldn't find one in 15 minutes or so I spent looking. Anyone know where to find one? That second calculator seems fairly legit in that aspect, but something by an international engineering standards council would be preferable.