Am I the only one notice this on Wima MKP10 ? - Re-burn In

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After extended periods of inactivity all caps require some time until their sound settles down again. And so does wire and solder joints. And lots of other parts. It is basic empiric knowledge for everyone possessing a pair of ears and having good sound as a hobby.

Ever tried doing a double-blind test for this?


Wire?
Solder joints?


In all my years as a service tech, I never heard such dribble.
Where do these people come up with that stuff? :rolleyes:
 
Given that sims caps are used in things like smps, they have to operate in their tolerance from day one. They may vary but they should remain within their design parameters or there would be a lot of smps issues?

MKP 10 and FKP1 sounds good to me - extremely detailed.
 
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Your quoting the wrong person, but I do find it interesting that these nuances get more common with what must be worse hearing.
There is nothing significant measurable electronically or acoustically with a decent plastic capaciitor "burning in" so I am inclined to suspect that nothing is happening. Plenty of other things do change, especially the speakers in the room and also the listener. It is a feature of our biology that if you over stimulate a nerve, it loses sensitivity
Sorry, I don't know how that happened when using the forum's quote function.

But there are measureable changes both long and short term through understood and documented processes in plastic capacitors, both plastic film, and metalised plastic; small maybe, but the threshold for audibility of changes is well below parts per thousand or no one would bother building hi fidelity amplifiers, etc.
 
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Wire?
Solder joints?
In all my years as a service tech, I never heard such dribble.
Where do these people come up with that stuff? :rolleyes:

I think maybe some folks take their vivid imaginations too seriously...or they are cursed with being able to hear every little flaw in their audio systems and they will never be happy or satisfied...I'm glad I don't have that kind of "super hearing" ability.

Mike


I believe that it results from too much internet bloggings, with some OCD added for good measure.
I've read many blogs on many sites through the years - and enjoyed some of the humorous, if not rediculous beliefs, generated for the masses to chew on.
Some spread, and unfortunatly turn into iron-clad rules of the land.
Usually these start from the younger generation, HS or college-age snotnoses that try to act important to impress others.


Thankfully, I'm not drawn into that silly world.
 
So, if a WIMA (or generally a film cap) has been burned in but then sitting for a while, a re-burn in period is needed ?

Mostly solder joints and leads mechanical stress. You don't necessarily need to have your equipment for "burn-in". Just let it sit. You can think of it like stress relief regeneration. Same thing happens with cables, especially single stranded.

Re-burn (settle) is mostly needed every time you change something that causes stress within wires, solder joints, PCBs, components and chassis. Try and find out for yourself.
 
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Metallic conductors don't care about mechanical stress, the current flows just the same way. Work hardening will change the resistivity, but you have to anneal to change that. Mechanical stress doesn't relieve over time unless the temperature is so high that creep occurs - usually you have to be 1/3rds of the way to the melting point (from absolute zero) for any chance of this - only solder would be affected by this normally, but again creep doesn't influence how current flows in a metal, Ohm's law still holds.
 
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Why is it only in the comparatively non-demanding realm of 20-20kHz that these mysteries of physics arise in electronic gear. We all carry in our pocket devices that are part of a multi-GHz ubiquitous network that seem to work perfectly (software aside) out of the box? I'm certain Apple and Samsung et al aren't burning in millions of smartphones a month. The answer is that the phenomenon described by the OP and endlessly debated here occurs exclusively in the neural cortex of the burnee. Turn on a new piece of gear, hmmm...sounds not so great. Keep listening while the neurons sizzle back and forth on how good the gear looks, all the rave reviews read, the technical wizardry that the neurons know they possess, and the hours and bucks spent putting it together and they realize that it must sound good...no, really good, great, fantastic! Now we need an explanation for why this transformation in sound quality over time takes place - capacitors (or tubes, speaker cables, resistors, you name it) must change their characteristics over time on first exposure to currents. Oh and when I don't listen to said component for a long while then plug it back in it starts out not so good again but gets better quicker, so this change in component behavior must revert with long disuse but return more quickly the second time. OK that's it...it's burn-in!

But why do these components never start out with better sound and burn in to worse?
 
Oh nobody is suggesting that electronic components don't deteriorate and eventually fail although many seem to chug happily along for half a century or more unscathed. The mystery I allude to here is why these magical components that burn-in early in life only do so to the benefit of the sound quality. It's in the mind of the beholder.
 
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Oh nobody is suggesting that electronic components don't deteriorate and eventually fail although many seem to chug happily along for half a century or more unscathed. The mystery I allude to here is why these magical components that burn-in early in life only do so to the benefit of the sound quality. It's in the mind of the beholder.


Indeed, perception is in the mind, and it can be a powerful force at times.
Well designed equipment IMO has no "changes" going on other than the long-term deterioration effects which vary by design.


The so-called "burning in" craze only started since the internet bloggers invented it, and with that a marketing trend to make money from.
Like those idiotic "cable burners" that are supposed to "season" your cables and wiring for better sound.
I put those, among other crap, into the Snake Oil bin.