Zen Mod said:
YGM.
Regarding my process.. I have EnABl'd both drivers including dustcaps..
As for sound I will comment on that a little later..
I have been listening a few days to only the blockpatterns now and will apply some microgloss soon.. Then I'll report back here 🙂
Yunick,
May I suggest after you have finished with all the mods, say close to 95%, you may want to summarise what you have done,
eg, final x-over network, woofer mod, etc.
so that all the viewers here can appreciate what you have done. More importantly what mods give the best result sonically.
cheers...
May I suggest after you have finished with all the mods, say close to 95%, you may want to summarise what you have done,
eg, final x-over network, woofer mod, etc.
so that all the viewers here can appreciate what you have done. More importantly what mods give the best result sonically.
cheers...
Yunick said:
you still need some directions for phase plug instalation?
off course- after EnABL-ing it completely .........
Mamboni treatment isn't bad idea , too
Zen Mod said:
Naa.. I think I got how to do it.. But the Alpha-6 dust cap looks a bit different from regular dust caps.. I guess I will cut it open and see how it looks from the inside..
But first I would like to get to know the differences the EnABl made..
What do you think of EnABl'ing the Beta driver?
I'm not sure how the Mamboni treatment is done thou...
Did you send the picture or should I get a new (read better 😉 ) one tonight?
re inside quote of yours (I'm lazy for cut'n'paste)
yes- send better one - if you can;
they look absolutely proper ; that's hand work,after all .
Yunick said:
Naa.. I think I got how to do it.. But the Alpha-6 dust cap looks a bit different from regular dust caps.. I guess I will cut it open and see how it looks from the inside..
****cut from center to outer edge,then just peel it with knife,cutting glue around former -almost as peeling apple
But first I would like to get to know the differences the EnABl made..
What do you think of EnABl'ing the Beta driver?
******** YES!
I'm not sure how the Mamboni treatment is done thou...
**** I'll later try to dig these threads....... in short - gluing felt triangles on back side of cone
Did you send the picture or should I get a new (read better 😉 ) one tonight?
yes- send better one - if you can;
they look absolutely proper ; that's hand work,after all .
EnABL ...... Yunick started
for all greedy boyz eyes
and for BudP , if he drop by
URL http://audiotehnika.co.yu/pdf/alpha_6.pdf
for all greedy boyz eyes
and for BudP , if he drop by
URL http://audiotehnika.co.yu/pdf/alpha_6.pdf
Attachments
how strange.
I've been using the beta 15 and the APT80, with a 10" ...... In a sound reinforcement rig!
I've been using the beta 15 and the APT80, with a 10" ...... In a sound reinforcement rig!
planet10 said:
It's on it's way... 🙂
I have them hooked up now to get to know what's happening with the blocks only..
Btw.. Did you treat any paper cone driver?
Could you please post a picture too .. please?
Yunick said:
look at several last pages in EnABL thread ..........
P10 doesn't sleep anymore , all he do now is painting cones 😉
Zen,
Looks like very good workmanship.
Now, you need to put a dot in the middle of those central block rings. The dot should be paint first and then, when dry, a drop of PVA (white wood glue or speaker surround to frame glue).
This PVA dot is going to enforce maximum lateral dispersion for highs.
The end result will be that, as you move from an angle that allows you to just look into the cone, all the way to the voice coil, all the way across to the other side of that cone described arc, there will not be any hot spots or any cone specific location clues, even directly in front of the dome. All sound will seem to arise from behind the driver and will be coherent to that sound field, without ever seeming to come from the driver, at all regardless of your angle to the cone.
You use the gloss to enhance this performance by using between 1 to 3 times as much on the cone as on the dome. You are correct to listen before applying the gloss. If the bare treated cone already has no hot spots, then a 50% coating of gloss on dome and cone may be all you need.
Another 50% coating on the cone will not harm matters, but may cause a "tight" sense to the sound until break in is done. Any more will provide a very hard and somehow edged sound that some folks like, but has little to do with reproducing music.
Minimum application and careful listening, to understand what the first coat has provided, is needed here. I always listen to increasingly "dense" music, until I either run out of torture tracks or the music suddenly gets corrupted in politeness.
This corruption will get down to some very small issues. The difference between a pair of soprano's and an alto horn being three voices or swirled up into one, is a useful marker here. Piano's embedded in a violin wash are also excellent torture. If the piano sounds sick or flat, but is still quite distinct from the violins, you need a couple of Electron Pools, not more gloss.
When the corruption no longer occurs, I stop applying gloss coat, and this has always been just enough.
You are proceeding exactly as I would, with an unknown driver. Just take tiny steps from here on, listen carefully and learn to hear what "politeness" might mean from treated speakers.
Bud
Looks like very good workmanship.
Now, you need to put a dot in the middle of those central block rings. The dot should be paint first and then, when dry, a drop of PVA (white wood glue or speaker surround to frame glue).
This PVA dot is going to enforce maximum lateral dispersion for highs.
The end result will be that, as you move from an angle that allows you to just look into the cone, all the way to the voice coil, all the way across to the other side of that cone described arc, there will not be any hot spots or any cone specific location clues, even directly in front of the dome. All sound will seem to arise from behind the driver and will be coherent to that sound field, without ever seeming to come from the driver, at all regardless of your angle to the cone.
You use the gloss to enhance this performance by using between 1 to 3 times as much on the cone as on the dome. You are correct to listen before applying the gloss. If the bare treated cone already has no hot spots, then a 50% coating of gloss on dome and cone may be all you need.
Another 50% coating on the cone will not harm matters, but may cause a "tight" sense to the sound until break in is done. Any more will provide a very hard and somehow edged sound that some folks like, but has little to do with reproducing music.
Minimum application and careful listening, to understand what the first coat has provided, is needed here. I always listen to increasingly "dense" music, until I either run out of torture tracks or the music suddenly gets corrupted in politeness.
This corruption will get down to some very small issues. The difference between a pair of soprano's and an alto horn being three voices or swirled up into one, is a useful marker here. Piano's embedded in a violin wash are also excellent torture. If the piano sounds sick or flat, but is still quite distinct from the violins, you need a couple of Electron Pools, not more gloss.
When the corruption no longer occurs, I stop applying gloss coat, and this has always been just enough.
You are proceeding exactly as I would, with an unknown driver. Just take tiny steps from here on, listen carefully and learn to hear what "politeness" might mean from treated speakers.
Bud
BudP said:
as always-tnx Bud for time and patience .
in fact -Yunick boy is man with cal. pens in hands this time ;
I just haven't enough time yet for your tide fences .......... some plain things and works take all my -free and not free - time in last few months
besides my 2. trip in solid state ....
seems that I mis more and more my toobz
regarding little Alpha 6 - like you said for eminence 8" ( I think) ...... rare example of proper dust cap 😉
hakunin,
I use a Duetsche Grammophn recording of the Chicago Symphony orchestra playing Gershwins Rhapsody in Blue, conducted by James Levine. DG # 431 625-2. This is just about the wildest, most densely populated music you can find. The piano arpeggio 1/3 of the way in should stand out clearly, with all of it's wood resonances intact, as the rest of the orchestra attempts to bury it.
Dave Grusin "The Gershwin Collection" tracks 12 & 13. Track 12 is just a primer for piano, a superb pianist interpreting a superb pianist. Track 13 is the violins and piano. Shmaltzy, but VERY difficult to get correct. Use the previous track as a guide for how the piano should sound while buried in the ocean of violins. GRP Records #GRD 2005.
Rodrigo "Concerto De Aranjuez" written for and played by the Romero family. Mercury SACD with a Red Book CD track overlay. Mercury # 475 6184. Absurdly difficult to reproduce violin section. They are not harsh and screechy, just overwhelming. Plus, the placement and working relationship between guitars and orchestra is difficult to recapture. Then there is the sheer beauty of the music, with some of the most captivating Vivaldi, after the incredible Rodrigo pieces, you have ever heard.
Windom Hill Records Guitar Sampler. # WD1072. Stunning recordings, as is usual with Windom Hill. Track 8 is the telling blow. 12 string guitars, played in a minor key, so the sound should be faintly sick to begin with. The bass passages are the key here. If, while buried in the rest, they do not shred or rumble then all is well. You have to listen carefully here though.
This is all incredibly dense music and it will take more than EnABL'd drivers to get it all correct. You will have a superb tool to use, while rooting out corruption and colorations in the rest of your system, between these CD's and EnABL'd drivers.
It only took me thirty years and three unconventional inventions to do so... take heart, you can copy them, and only have to fight with the signal amplification equipment and signal sources now.
Bud
I use a Duetsche Grammophn recording of the Chicago Symphony orchestra playing Gershwins Rhapsody in Blue, conducted by James Levine. DG # 431 625-2. This is just about the wildest, most densely populated music you can find. The piano arpeggio 1/3 of the way in should stand out clearly, with all of it's wood resonances intact, as the rest of the orchestra attempts to bury it.
Dave Grusin "The Gershwin Collection" tracks 12 & 13. Track 12 is just a primer for piano, a superb pianist interpreting a superb pianist. Track 13 is the violins and piano. Shmaltzy, but VERY difficult to get correct. Use the previous track as a guide for how the piano should sound while buried in the ocean of violins. GRP Records #GRD 2005.
Rodrigo "Concerto De Aranjuez" written for and played by the Romero family. Mercury SACD with a Red Book CD track overlay. Mercury # 475 6184. Absurdly difficult to reproduce violin section. They are not harsh and screechy, just overwhelming. Plus, the placement and working relationship between guitars and orchestra is difficult to recapture. Then there is the sheer beauty of the music, with some of the most captivating Vivaldi, after the incredible Rodrigo pieces, you have ever heard.
Windom Hill Records Guitar Sampler. # WD1072. Stunning recordings, as is usual with Windom Hill. Track 8 is the telling blow. 12 string guitars, played in a minor key, so the sound should be faintly sick to begin with. The bass passages are the key here. If, while buried in the rest, they do not shred or rumble then all is well. You have to listen carefully here though.
This is all incredibly dense music and it will take more than EnABL'd drivers to get it all correct. You will have a superb tool to use, while rooting out corruption and colorations in the rest of your system, between these CD's and EnABL'd drivers.
It only took me thirty years and three unconventional inventions to do so... take heart, you can copy them, and only have to fight with the signal amplification equipment and signal sources now.
Bud
BudP said:
Thanks for your reply Bud,
I will follow your advice and post my results as I proceed...
Also thanks for your reply to Hakunin, I also found it very helpful 🙂
Yunick,
Good that Zen admitted his conniving. He did not say that you were the important party in the discussion when he asked me to stick my nose in here.
Thanks for giving EnABL a chance and you are welcome to any help I can provide. I will monitor your progress, now that I know you are treating drivers. And thanks to Zen for conniving........ like thanking the wind for blowing, though.
Bud
Good that Zen admitted his conniving. He did not say that you were the important party in the discussion when he asked me to stick my nose in here.
Thanks for giving EnABL a chance and you are welcome to any help I can provide. I will monitor your progress, now that I know you are treating drivers. And thanks to Zen for conniving........ like thanking the wind for blowing, though.
Bud
caps
Bud : Thank you, I'll look for them.
Everyone : i was curious how will my system sound without caps on Alpha 6.. Now i'm not going to put them back for a while and see how they bahave. Bit too bassy, but generally the mids are way better than with cheapo caps i have.
I also finally got beter cap for tweeter and will look further for a better one (they make them in my town).
How does the A6 without caps sound to you Yunick?
Bud : Thank you, I'll look for them.
Everyone : i was curious how will my system sound without caps on Alpha 6.. Now i'm not going to put them back for a while and see how they bahave. Bit too bassy, but generally the mids are way better than with cheapo caps i have.
I also finally got beter cap for tweeter and will look further for a better one (they make them in my town).
How does the A6 without caps sound to you Yunick?
- Status
- Not open for further replies.