I think he's asking for links to ASR where Amir says subjective commentary is now allowed.
That I don't have for you, sorry. What I did see was people freely talking about how things sound and not getting threatened for it. I mentioned I thought it unusual to someone else (don't recall who) that said he thought it happened when Amir started listening to speakers, that he heard differences between pieces of equipment not accounted for by their measurements. Could be. What I know first hand is that people have been threatened with being banned in the past for talking too much about how something sounds without backing it up with measurements. Something has changed which I could see from reading there recently, couldn't believe my eyes at first.
Acko has published details of his board, see post below:
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vendor-s-bazaar/348088-ackodac-based-ak4499eq-2.html#post6247891
It does seem to be the definitive implementation of the chip compared to what I have seen for the Topping D90, Gustard A22 and A18, SMSL M400 etc. all of which seem to be constrained by commercial considerations. It appears to have individual regulators for each AK4499 power pin, USB isolation, a proper high quality IV/LPF - a no holds barred approach? This might turn out to be the best audio DAC ever?
I would be interested in peoples views and comments of this implementation as I really fancy going for it.
Here's a quote from Amir after being criticized for recommending speakers based at least in part on listening (remember, this is Amir talking): "As I said in my last response to you, you must listen. In my case, dialing in just one PEQ resulted in superb sound."
Amir recommendation criticism | Page 9 | Audio Science Review (ASR) Forum
Next thing you know he will probably be using the term "Sound Quality" without formal definition!
Amir recommendation criticism | Page 9 | Audio Science Review (ASR) Forum
Next thing you know he will probably be using the term "Sound Quality" without formal definition!
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Excuse for missing it...
You have phase noise pots for these Accusilcon models? I must have missed that, any idea how far back int he thread i should go to find them, the search function here is not that helpful.
Have you seen these, OCXO, pretty good numbers but no plots, probably unobtanium anyway... Suspicious that they leave out the really relevant frequencies from the phase noise specs though... View attachment AS509.pdf
There are also NDK DuColon, expensive and maybe not obtainable in the US
You have phase noise pots for these Accusilcon models? I must have missed that, any idea how far back int he thread i should go to find them, the search function here is not that helpful.
Have you seen these, OCXO, pretty good numbers but no plots, probably unobtanium anyway... Suspicious that they leave out the really relevant frequencies from the phase noise specs though... View attachment AS509.pdf
There are also NDK DuColon, expensive and maybe not obtainable in the US
There is a datasheet available.. It includes the phase noise plots.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjAAegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw0NbkQtpMm1SpT7lKdVj2PL
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjAAegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw0NbkQtpMm1SpT7lKdVj2PL
Attachments
Here's a quote from Amir after being criticized for recommending speakers based at least in part on listening (remember, this is Amir talking): "As I said in my last response to you, you must listen. In my case, dialing in just one PEQ resulted in superb sound."
Amir recommendation criticism | Page 9 | Audio Science Review (ASR) Forum
Next thing you know he will probably be using the term "Sound Quality" without formal definition!
With loudspeakers you have to listen though especially if he's trying to recommend a way to listen to a bad design without melting your ears. Ie his recommendations towards what EQ to use.
All loudspeakers are compromised in some way and these compromises interact with your room. As a result you do need to listen to them to see if they'll work well with where they are placed.
With the electronics this isn't the case.
@Markw4: Good morning (as it is here now) ...
Thanks for the link ... I will check it out. One question: Did you experience any "suboptimal" performance from the card or the drivers - could be drop outs, mute noise, sudden "something" ... ?? Maybe DSD playback issues, pushing the PC "to the limits", long processing delay, or the like? I am asking because I actually am interested in this card so I would appreciate hearing about any issues up front.
Also, briefly commenting on the clock quality now being discussed in the thread it would be interesting to me if this card has an external clock input. Would you happen to know if this is the case - and if so how it is configured (clock division or just the clock frequency input to the card)?
Thanks for the tip on this ... very useful! As it is I have been using my Amanero card for some years now with a battery supply - it works very well both practically and sound-wise. To my memory I didn't remove the inductor you mention but the voltage regulator regulating the USB 5V.
And then just a brief comment on the clocks you are mentioning here: Might I suggest taking a look at Andrea Mori's latest oscillator implementations ... Reaching better than - 120 dBc at 1 Hz, and also with a generally very low phase noise level (~- 170 dBc) for frequencies further away from the oscillator frequency. This is for a 5.6 MHz oscillator.
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/dig...itter-crystal-oscillator-218.html#post6238801
Besides the cost of the crystals themselves I would also assume them to be very accessible price wise as to my knowledge there are no "special / high cost" components in the oscillators.
Cheers,
Jesper
Thanks for the link ... I will check it out. One question: Did you experience any "suboptimal" performance from the card or the drivers - could be drop outs, mute noise, sudden "something" ... ?? Maybe DSD playback issues, pushing the PC "to the limits", long processing delay, or the like? I am asking because I actually am interested in this card so I would appreciate hearing about any issues up front.
Also, briefly commenting on the clock quality now being discussed in the thread it would be interesting to me if this card has an external clock input. Would you happen to know if this is the case - and if so how it is configured (clock division or just the clock frequency input to the card)?
Thanks for the tip on this ... very useful! As it is I have been using my Amanero card for some years now with a battery supply - it works very well both practically and sound-wise. To my memory I didn't remove the inductor you mention but the voltage regulator regulating the USB 5V.
And then just a brief comment on the clocks you are mentioning here: Might I suggest taking a look at Andrea Mori's latest oscillator implementations ... Reaching better than - 120 dBc at 1 Hz, and also with a generally very low phase noise level (~- 170 dBc) for frequencies further away from the oscillator frequency. This is for a 5.6 MHz oscillator.
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/dig...itter-crystal-oscillator-218.html#post6238801
Besides the cost of the crystals themselves I would also assume them to be very accessible price wise as to my knowledge there are no "special / high cost" components in the oscillators.
Cheers,
Jesper
No. However, I have not been using the board for very long so experience is limited.
My SMSL M400 doesn't sound different, there is just more music and less noise.
Through Neurochrome amps , Total Harmonic Distortion + Noise 0.00051% 1 kHz, 110 W, 4 ", 20 kHz BW and Quad electrostatic loudspeakers.
Anyone who cannot hear a large difference needs a new hobby.
I have not compared the best measuring implementation of the ESS chip to the AKM chip, so cannot say how much may be down to the chip.
It wasn't necessary, it wasn't the slight improvement you get from adding supercaps to your 4 rail LifeP04 supply, or adding a seperate rail to your NDK clocks.
It was more akin to opening several more windows into the recording. Each mike feed into the mixing desk snapped into focus.
I loaned it to a friend who has heard more systems than I have had hot dinners and he commented 'the layering is remarkable'.
Glad people are listening to their gear rather than just attempting to measure the performance, isn’t nearly as fun imo.
I was impressed by the regimen over at that other site, but soon had began to wonder if any of the higher rated equipment even sounded good.
I have been wanting to try clean usb power for my work setup for a few years now, might have to try it for myself. I haven’t been listening as much like I had been some 4-5 years ago, is surprising at how much focus the listening and comparing takes to be effective.
I was impressed by the regimen over at that other site, but soon had began to wonder if any of the higher rated equipment even sounded good.
I have been wanting to try clean usb power for my work setup for a few years now, might have to try it for myself. I haven’t been listening as much like I had been some 4-5 years ago, is surprising at how much focus the listening and comparing takes to be effective.
Did anyone answer this?
I have the same question.
Are we talking on chip resistive ladder dac?
Hi Pico,
No, AK4499 and ESS Sabre dacs are not old R-2R ladder dacs, if that's what you mean. They are modern sigma delta oversampling dacs without internal buffer stage(s) before the analog outputs. Therefore they need external I/V stages to convert current outputs to voltage signals (at least they do for lowest distortion). Many of us here are done bothering with Sabre dacs due to various issues. AK4499 is the new high performance dac on the market and it sounds very good indeed if surrounded by a good implementation design.
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