Spedge, The receiver I have is an Onkyo TX-NR809. In the specs it says:
Audyssey MultEQ XT Automatic Speaker Setup:
Crossover: Set the crossover point for each set of speakers (front, center, surround, surround back, front height, front wide) and the subwoofer individually. The speaker crossovers can bet set to full bandwidth, 40 Hz, 50 Hz, 60 Hz, 70 Hz, 80 Hz (THX standard), 90 Hz, 100 Hz, 120 Hz, 150 Hz, or 200 Hz. The subwoofer crossover can be set to bypass, 80, 90, 100, or 120Hz.
The subwoofer itself has an adjustable crossover setting which allows me to set the crossover frequency to anything in the 40 - 180 Hz range.
So it seems I have a fair bit of flexibility on what low frequencies the rear channel surrounds will be required to handle so long as I can find the Audyssey microphone.
The wall is 1/2" drywall on studs so I can mount directly onto it. It is old 2 x 4 construction and behind the stud wall is the cement foundation wall (with some fibreglass insulation in between).
If possible, I was thinking if it wouldn't mess up the sound too bad, I'd like to hide the panels inside stretched canvas artwork like one of these sets of 3 pieces in the 36" x 24" size. The frame depths are 1.5".
https://www.amazon.ca/wall26-Canvas-Abstract-Artwork-Stretched/dp/B0786CNKYQ/ref=sr_1_9
If the frames are 1.5" square, that would limit the panel sizes to a maximum of 21" x 33" but I suppose you'd want to make them a bit smaller than that to leave a gap for foam tape to go in between the frames and the panels.
I can buy 2' x 8' sheets of 1/2" thick XPS from Home Depot here so that should allow me to hide half decent sized speaker panels inside the right and left art pieces. If the 1/2" XPS is not recommended, I can look at using other materials in the 1/2" thick range like maybe acoustic ceiling tile.
If the hiding the panels inside the stretched canvas artwork is a bad idea then I have a lot more options for panel sizing and numbers of panels.
Given all of this, what are my options and what would you recommend?
Audyssey MultEQ XT Automatic Speaker Setup:
Crossover: Set the crossover point for each set of speakers (front, center, surround, surround back, front height, front wide) and the subwoofer individually. The speaker crossovers can bet set to full bandwidth, 40 Hz, 50 Hz, 60 Hz, 70 Hz, 80 Hz (THX standard), 90 Hz, 100 Hz, 120 Hz, 150 Hz, or 200 Hz. The subwoofer crossover can be set to bypass, 80, 90, 100, or 120Hz.
The subwoofer itself has an adjustable crossover setting which allows me to set the crossover frequency to anything in the 40 - 180 Hz range.
So it seems I have a fair bit of flexibility on what low frequencies the rear channel surrounds will be required to handle so long as I can find the Audyssey microphone.
The wall is 1/2" drywall on studs so I can mount directly onto it. It is old 2 x 4 construction and behind the stud wall is the cement foundation wall (with some fibreglass insulation in between).
If possible, I was thinking if it wouldn't mess up the sound too bad, I'd like to hide the panels inside stretched canvas artwork like one of these sets of 3 pieces in the 36" x 24" size. The frame depths are 1.5".
https://www.amazon.ca/wall26-Canvas-Abstract-Artwork-Stretched/dp/B0786CNKYQ/ref=sr_1_9
If the frames are 1.5" square, that would limit the panel sizes to a maximum of 21" x 33" but I suppose you'd want to make them a bit smaller than that to leave a gap for foam tape to go in between the frames and the panels.
I can buy 2' x 8' sheets of 1/2" thick XPS from Home Depot here so that should allow me to hide half decent sized speaker panels inside the right and left art pieces. If the 1/2" XPS is not recommended, I can look at using other materials in the 1/2" thick range like maybe acoustic ceiling tile.
If the hiding the panels inside the stretched canvas artwork is a bad idea then I have a lot more options for panel sizing and numbers of panels.
Given all of this, what are my options and what would you recommend?
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dangerboy.
It seems you missed the canvas painters art panel.
The easiest option would be to glue the exciter to The stud wall,that's if the wall doesn't buzz?
I have a similar stud wall ,for interest sake I might give it a try and see what the response might be before I suggest anything else
Steve.
It seems you missed the canvas painters art panel.
The easiest option would be to glue the exciter to The stud wall,that's if the wall doesn't buzz?
I have a similar stud wall ,for interest sake I might give it a try and see what the response might be before I suggest anything else
Steve.
Attachments
What would happen, if you glue the exciters to the stud wall itself? Won't the whole wall become a speaker(s)? I don't have a stud wall, so the question.
Chdsl.
Some companies plaster the dml panels into the wall, (amina I think they are called,)at great expense.
It could sound crap ,I don't know?
But for rear ambiance and effects it could be OK ?
I was thinking that a couple of my smaller panels on either side of the couch ,close to the wall could work.
Small panels don't suffer so much from being close to walls (if I remember rightly? )
They could be attached to the back of the couch ,so no wall fixings?
You could toe them in a little but the dispersion pattern should be pretty good,giving good rear sound effects.
It's a little bit of guess work ,but should be implementable, and very cheep.
Not sure about getting down to 200hz ,but being that close (very near field) it might be OK?
I used to use them (4inch panels) down to about 500hz or so,but that was for a good in room response at 3 meters.
Steve.
Some companies plaster the dml panels into the wall, (amina I think they are called,)at great expense.
It could sound crap ,I don't know?
But for rear ambiance and effects it could be OK ?
I was thinking that a couple of my smaller panels on either side of the couch ,close to the wall could work.
Small panels don't suffer so much from being close to walls (if I remember rightly? )
They could be attached to the back of the couch ,so no wall fixings?
You could toe them in a little but the dispersion pattern should be pretty good,giving good rear sound effects.
It's a little bit of guess work ,but should be implementable, and very cheep.
Not sure about getting down to 200hz ,but being that close (very near field) it might be OK?
I used to use them (4inch panels) down to about 500hz or so,but that was for a good in room response at 3 meters.
Steve.
In a DML, we have a flat panel, but what if we make a wide and stiff frame around it? Won't it give more bass? I am just thinking aloud.
Dangerboy.
I wasn't really expecting much so i wasn't really set up for some serious listening.
The phone microphone was just plonked down somewhere and I was just tapping the exciter on the wall,the exciter has a screw in the middle which is supposed to be screwed into the wall.
I will when I get time ,try to do a better job,and do justice to the sound I could hear.
This is a 50watt exciter and the amp is only a ten watt digital amp!
But I wasn't even pushing the amp!
I'll see if I can turn it up a bit and get things shaking.
Steve.
I wasn't really expecting much so i wasn't really set up for some serious listening.
The phone microphone was just plonked down somewhere and I was just tapping the exciter on the wall,the exciter has a screw in the middle which is supposed to be screwed into the wall.
I will when I get time ,try to do a better job,and do justice to the sound I could hear.
This is a 50watt exciter and the amp is only a ten watt digital amp!
But I wasn't even pushing the amp!
I'll see if I can turn it up a bit and get things shaking.
Steve.
Spedge, that sound was quite remarkable considering you were just holding an exciter to the wall! It sounded way better than what I expected to hear. It seems like it might be adequate for rear channel fill in sound.
The only problem I see is that I'll have a right and left rear channel exciter and they'll both have to be on the same wall. There's no way to isolate the two sides. It would be a bizarre and fun experiment to try though.
Now if the wall was being built, there may be a way to sonically isolate a drywall sheet on one side of the wall from another on the opposite side but the wall's already built so there's no way to do that unless I tore out some of the drywall in the middle and reinstalled some with some sort of isolation strip on each side. Don't want to get into that...
So for now lets concentrate on me creating some rear channel panel speakers and possibly hiding them in stretched canvas artwork, okay? Could use some advice on the material to use and sizing, exciter to use, etc.
The only problem I see is that I'll have a right and left rear channel exciter and they'll both have to be on the same wall. There's no way to isolate the two sides. It would be a bizarre and fun experiment to try though.
Now if the wall was being built, there may be a way to sonically isolate a drywall sheet on one side of the wall from another on the opposite side but the wall's already built so there's no way to do that unless I tore out some of the drywall in the middle and reinstalled some with some sort of isolation strip on each side. Don't want to get into that...
So for now lets concentrate on me creating some rear channel panel speakers and possibly hiding them in stretched canvas artwork, okay? Could use some advice on the material to use and sizing, exciter to use, etc.
Hdn8😨
Danger boy.
Some more recordings.
It isn't easy holding the exciter against the wall,.
I did try to record Batman the dark knight ,very loudly , but there was too much going on.
This exciter rattles too much,mainly because of the plastic enclosure, as you can tell when I take the exciter off the wall,it still makes quite a noise!!!
It was impossible to keep good contact.
Sorry for the singing on duty hast.
This would probably be my choice for rear surround speakers,it's a very quick and easy fix.
I'd only charge 2000 dollars the pair 😅
If using a stud wall for your screen,you could mount the exciters on the back like amina ,for the dialogue channel?
Just a thought?
Steve.
Danger boy.
Some more recordings.
It isn't easy holding the exciter against the wall,.
I did try to record Batman the dark knight ,very loudly , but there was too much going on.
This exciter rattles too much,mainly because of the plastic enclosure, as you can tell when I take the exciter off the wall,it still makes quite a noise!!!
It was impossible to keep good contact.
Sorry for the singing on duty hast.
This would probably be my choice for rear surround speakers,it's a very quick and easy fix.
I'd only charge 2000 dollars the pair 😅
If using a stud wall for your screen,you could mount the exciters on the back like amina ,for the dialogue channel?
Just a thought?
Steve.
Spedge, the sound on those two new recordings is surprisingly good. I'm impressed. It makes me wonder about the potential for using drywall as a panel material.
Your idea of placing an exciter on a studded wall behind the TV and running the center/voice channel to it is intriguing. In certain situations, it may prove to work well for that channel. I wonder if anyone's ever tried it.
BTW, good choice on the SRV tune for that demo recording...
Your idea of placing an exciter on a studded wall behind the TV and running the center/voice channel to it is intriguing. In certain situations, it may prove to work well for that channel. I wonder if anyone's ever tried it.
BTW, good choice on the SRV tune for that demo recording...
VERY interesting, Mpte. I find the placement of the exciters used in the models displayed in the article intriguing. I wonder if there's something to be learned from there...
My tv is on an exterior wall but its 2 feet from a corner with a wall i share with my neighbors bedroom, wonder how far the sound goes in a direct mounted ecciter and if it goes around corners into other wall, at least much worse than a suspended dml of the same spl. My walls have cellose insulation.
Can you do some testing comparing sound on the other side of the wall and also in a room a short distance around a corner and compare to a panel?
Mpte.
If you get on well with your neighbour ,you could phone them while banging on the wall,or attach an exciter.
They could tell you how loud it is.
They might even say they can also hear your tv?
My stud wall is on an outside brick wall (converted garage )but the back is attached to my utility are.
My normal music playing is easily heard there.
That's all I can suggest.
Steve.
If you get on well with your neighbour ,you could phone them while banging on the wall,or attach an exciter.
They could tell you how loud it is.
They might even say they can also hear your tv?
My stud wall is on an outside brick wall (converted garage )but the back is attached to my utility are.
My normal music playing is easily heard there.
That's all I can suggest.
Steve.