If I put the first row of subs with the exit on the bottom and I put the next row of 4 on top of these as normal upright keystones cabs with the keystone exits (total height would be 71.5") would there be any phase or delay issues or would the bass add together nicely ?
The issues would be in the upper end, the LF would be OK.
I would stick to one cabinet type or the other, unless separately processing each.
In addition, for your KF850 cabinets to properly array, they should be in an arc, the 22.5" depth of a standard Keystone is too shallow to support that.
1) Properly designed, with the right driver, a TH will put out more SPL than a BR box, but will be larger.
2) Your description lacks details needed to give any insight. Screen shots of what you are comparing are helpful.
3) Probably a little of both, best to read up and try plugging in other designs to start understanding "what's what" with TH.
Some good information here:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-d...mple-tapped-horn-tutorial-using-hornresp.html
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Hi Y'all,
Just thought I post the 1st Try @ a modified form factor Keystone for Scientific. The path is still a bit long, and the depth is a bit more than 32", which is bad for wood usage, so I hope to find the time tomorrow to give it another try.
Regards,
Just thought I post the 1st Try @ a modified form factor Keystone for Scientific. The path is still a bit long, and the depth is a bit more than 32", which is bad for wood usage, so I hope to find the time tomorrow to give it another try.
Regards,
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Oliver, That's interesting. I want to see how this unfolds, i.e. how it is fine tuned as others contribute to the design.
The streets are very narrow. The aim is to send the sound as far back as possible. Arcs are not required in our application.
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Ah-hah - you're talking about a music truck for Carnival, right? 🙂. That type of config seems to be almost dominated by "scoop" horns for bass - nice to see someone trying something a bit different.
Single-fold THs seem almost ideal for this situation. You don't have lots of width to work with, but you do have lots of length. You can go both deep and loud, though the music likely won't require going much below 50 Hz anyway.
You got that one unscrambled.
I've done scoops in the past. Big bass but no thud.
The Keystone is a single fold TH especially if used with the bottom as the exit so that should be good. Are there any other options?
50Hz can't cut it. Systems use subharmonic generators and exiters (aphex, cosmos etc.) to generate low end. The low end travels further and reaches the end of the crowd. In addition, bass guitarist use 5 and 6 string bass guitars that go down to like 31Hz. They also use a special effects pedal that sweeps form like 80 Hz to 25 Hz and back up to 80Hz. Also there is no control of truck speed so if your truck gets sandwiched between 2 trucks that are dumping 30 Hz thunder at you and all you have is 50 Hz you're dead in the water. If your bass is deep and powerful other trunks will stay at a distance.
@Scientific, my cousins in Trinidad just took the Danley route with a bunch of dbh218's and sh46's with a lpf@80 and hpf@25. They've created a monster. The newer soca is gettin down deep and there is also a big edm presence now because of Major Lazer and some of the newer Machel joints. They used a flh similar to the zann enclosure loaded with RCF's. But the Danleys leave them in the dust. Hope to see your finished rig one day. I'm in and out of the islands with car shows. My company is called NYCE1S and we come down to the islands a couple times a year.
I can imagine how those dbh218's sound. Like they say here you have to "respect Danley labs". Well when you can't afford the real thing you have to DIY. I hope I end up something good. Where is NYCE1S based?
I don't think the fine folks in this forum can ever let us down. I'm sure your project will surpass many a dj or sound down there with what you're planning. Nyce1s is based in New York. I now live in Florida and we are still growing!
I think when Carnival rolls around and you are "dressed to impress" with some keystones, you'll see the haters comin out of nowhere. ......with tons on questions too. Lol.
I think when Carnival rolls around and you are "dressed to impress" with some keystones, you'll see the haters comin out of nowhere. ......with tons on questions too. Lol.
Hi m R g S r,
Would you mind if I keep on posting on the subject of modified Keystone/truck sub/Scientific's questions in your thread? Or, would it be better if a moderator split this off into it's own thread?
Regards,
Would you mind if I keep on posting on the subject of modified Keystone/truck sub/Scientific's questions in your thread? Or, would it be better if a moderator split this off into it's own thread?
Regards,
If you're trying to come up with a KS with the mouth at the bottom, then it's no longer a KS. What makes the KS a KS is not only the location of the mouth, but also its shape.
The Danley DBH218 is a 2x18 FLH with a 2 ohm impedance (that's pretty low, but if you're talking mobile sound where getting enough current is a bit easier than getting enough voltage, it certainly does come in handy). Its sensitivity rating is 117dB/2.83V/1M, which means its efficiency is somewhere around 105dB/1W/1M. There is also a 5dB drop between 100 Hz and 40 Hz, and another 8dB down from 40 Hz to 30 Hz (according to their FR chart). So that suggests efficiency at 30 Hz is around 92dB/1W/1M. You'll have to stack multiple DBH218s to flatten the response and increase efficiency down to 30 Hz.
Doing 30 Hz at PA volume takes a LOT. I'm a Machel Montano fan (I think his HMA is one of the best tracks I've heard in years), but I don't know if his work actually requires 30 Hz capability to be enjoyable.
Ok, if you're going to do it (going for that clean 30 Hz), there are two routes I see:
1. Multiple 2x18 FLHs. Four at least to flatten the FR which will boost LF performance. Use Danley's idea and use 4 ohm drivers to keep the impedance low. Give a lot of consideration to how you're going to power them, because they will be soaking up quite a bit.
2. Multiple 18" 30 Hz THs. Again, use 4 0hm drivers for the same reasons as above.
Keystone refold w/ reduced height and width
Hi Y'all,
Here is a better refold of Art's Keystone than the one in Post #404, still trying to be able to provide the choice of a modified Keystone exit as well as the bottom mouth for Scientific's Carneval truck. The Keystone mouth cannot be properly simulated in Hornresp, but the bottom mouth can. I reduced the overall horn length from the first attempt, but ended up w/ a bit more internal volume, not necessarily a bad thing.
I'm attaching simulations for the bottom exit/mouth that Scientific referred to for: the latest greatest redraw of the Keystone Original, the refolded version MOD#3, MOD#3 with a bigger mouth, and MOD#3 with a maximized mouth. For fun I also mirrored the drawing to show a possible (huge) DUAL TH.
Take a look through the simulations, and see what you come up with.
Regards,
Hi Y'all,
Here is a better refold of Art's Keystone than the one in Post #404, still trying to be able to provide the choice of a modified Keystone exit as well as the bottom mouth for Scientific's Carneval truck. The Keystone mouth cannot be properly simulated in Hornresp, but the bottom mouth can. I reduced the overall horn length from the first attempt, but ended up w/ a bit more internal volume, not necessarily a bad thing.
I'm attaching simulations for the bottom exit/mouth that Scientific referred to for: the latest greatest redraw of the Keystone Original, the refolded version MOD#3, MOD#3 with a bigger mouth, and MOD#3 with a maximized mouth. For fun I also mirrored the drawing to show a possible (huge) DUAL TH.
Take a look through the simulations, and see what you come up with.
Regards,
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I am always amazed at how high a sensitivity DSL gets with their cabinets. I am still working on my horn but the best I can get with my monster is 100-101db. It is 101db at 30hz though. Anyways.....
Hi BP1Fanatic,
That DUAL @ Eg=104 2pi would just be loud. At 42Hz Hornresp has the power conversion efficiency @ 54.25%.
Regards,
That DUAL @ Eg=104 2pi would just be loud. At 42Hz Hornresp has the power conversion efficiency @ 54.25%.
Regards,
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Something looks... strange there. If there is constant expansion between S1 and S4, then shouldn't the three internal panels starting with the driver's baffle be at right angles to each other, a result of panel 2 being at the same angle to the adjacent external panel as panels 1 and 3?