How did you cross those ?
I’m a bass head. I don’t go under 8”, but I sit 8’ away and listened mostly under 50db Fleetwood Mac. My preferences in speakers is they need a bit of punch. Smaller drivers (to me) just can’t do bass that far away. Just my opinion.
If I can dial in the bass, I’ll try making another box so I can hear them in stereo.
I’m a bass head. I don’t go under 8”, but I sit 8’ away and listened mostly under 50db Fleetwood Mac. My preferences in speakers is they need a bit of punch. Smaller drivers (to me) just can’t do bass that far away. Just my opinion.
If I can dial in the bass, I’ll try making another box so I can hear them in stereo.
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From 2021. SEAS A26 vented. Near the end of the A26 ReViz document. More a thot experiment. FR could be embedded in the box. It could be sealed. This is the CGR on the bottom, sealed, or any of the aperiodic boxes could be used.
https://frugal-phile.com/boxlib/A26-ReViz-0v90-080323.pdf
dave
Straight forward 2nd order. The 2.5" was mounted centered on the baffle, be more ideal offset for flat response.
No big deal I did a low Q wide notch to fix the response. About 500 Hz symmetric.
Not many phase issues with a highpass wideband. Almost comical how easy it is.
Most your tradeoff with a small 2.5" wideband is low sensitivity, so for big bass with a 12" almost any 12" will be too loud.
The poly cone I used had low sensitivity, so it worked out well actually. link to the thread and crossover
Such a small driver and such a large woofer, center to center is to easy, cakewalk with phase
Augmenting FR driver is harder than it may appear. Its far easier to add subwoofer to a regular monkey coffin (which is not so easy) than successfully support a full range speaker you happen to like. Most of the time your FR driver so adorable alone will loose all its charm. Just listen your FR in the setup where it is pretty much comfortable with your music of choice. If it only plays good in your car than install a mini fridge in the car and make yourself comfortable there. A lot of 8" FR are fine in very small bedrooms. Not sure what to make of 2.5" -headphones?
Based on the pics in this thread, and my own fullrange build, I have to say they don't cut it. Nearly everyone is adding a bass or treble.
As a curve ball, a line array might party. A number of fullrange, used together.
The word #party shouldn't be overlooked.
As a curve ball, a line array might party. A number of fullrange, used together.
The word #party shouldn't be overlooked.
Nice ideas as always! it is a very logical thought process for WAW and have had similar ideas.
Recently I stumbled upon some Technics models, where seems again similar minds think alike.
I wanted to try playing with physical Time alignment.
Roaming the internet TECHNICS !! you jerks they already got to it. Guess its assuring
Once you start understanding sound more an more. Logical designs just start lining up.
Exactly, you can go in both directions, augment bass, treble Both have tradeoffs.
Eventually goes full circle to just a 3 way.
Ironically after the great History of what Altec did and was.
Far as wideband after the name was sold. I have had countless 3" desktop computer speakers and eventually wish they had tweeters.
Remembering the 90s desktop speakers. Eventually they did just that, add tweeters. Remember the first higher end ones with tweets
branded as Altec.
Of course almost being a insult to, Agree some of the greater systems you can do with classic Altec drivers.
Just interesting, any logical design you could come up with today. Highly likely already been done by real Altec or had the name Altec on it
I use a Alpair 10.3 with a 10" Scanspeak 26W woofer and that also works in my case. I do use dsp today to do the crossover (at 300Hz LR4) but did it passive before also (with decent results). This speaker is very good and neutral (with dsp) in the small room where i ue it, and is a joy to listen to. This is the response i get on my seating position after finetuning (without using DIRAC on my MiniDSP Flex). I use now Ncore based amplifier with this setup.
(the black speakers are other speakers, not part of the WAW and the picture is not from that measurement)
I Know also that dispertion is not that good, but in a small space like mine, the reflections of the room will fill that up largely. And as the room is small, the delay of those reflections are very short so it's not sounding like a delay. I had clean neutral speakers side by side to this setup and they did not sound better on axis. You also see some room mode at 90Hz, that is something you can't eq out but has little effect. That room mode was also visible when i had K&H O300's (ancestor of the Neuman KH310) in my room to compare (i don't own the K&H).
But this is not the ultimate speaker i think (as far as that exist). It's a speaker that fits its purpose very well. And if you want clean low distortion even dispertion speakers, then you better go elsewhere, that is also true. But they bring me and others a lot of joy, that is the main purpose. for me.
I Know also that dispertion is not that good, but in a small space like mine, the reflections of the room will fill that up largely. And as the room is small, the delay of those reflections are very short so it's not sounding like a delay. I had clean neutral speakers side by side to this setup and they did not sound better on axis. You also see some room mode at 90Hz, that is something you can't eq out but has little effect. That room mode was also visible when i had K&H O300's (ancestor of the Neuman KH310) in my room to compare (i don't own the K&H).
But this is not the ultimate speaker i think (as far as that exist). It's a speaker that fits its purpose very well. And if you want clean low distortion even dispertion speakers, then you better go elsewhere, that is also true. But they bring me and others a lot of joy, that is the main purpose. for me.
I took apart a set of late 60s, erly 70s Norescos with an AlNiCo 10” Fostex woofer and an FE83A and i am sure earlier examples expect.
dave
Im not Altec fan . All of thier factory speakers are useless junk. Some of the drivers are outstanding and some very good. 15" biflex is very good .
Augmenting bass is in my opinion a loosing proposition in FR game. It's the easiest way to kill the advantages of wide band driver., the coherence, the tone and color
Philips also did speakers like that. I have repaired an old Philips speaker (probally mid 1960's) with a 9710M4 as top and a AD5201S "Bombardon" woofer. The owner had the cabinet rebuild as the old was so beaten up that repairs were not an option anymore and asked me to do the crossover. He had the papers of the original design by Philips also, but i don't think this speaker was sold worldwide. Outside the documents he had i did not find any info about this setup.
But yes, even in the 1960's they made waw speakers.
But yes, even in the 1960's they made waw speakers.
here a 30 cm bass with removed dustcap goes easily up to the point (5khz) where the piezo tweet takes over. Sounds ok.
Advantage is, no filter needed.Using natural roll off.
Mini fullrange with bass works good if you have an amp with adjustable electrical crossover and filter the satellite at least with 6db and well damped (stuffed) box.
Advantage is, no filter needed.Using natural roll off.
Mini fullrange with bass works good if you have an amp with adjustable electrical crossover and filter the satellite at least with 6db and well damped (stuffed) box.
in general "assisted" fullrange loudspeakers work very well filtered above 5khz and below 500hz as you preserve with crossovers "untouched" the area where the ear is most sensitive to phasing faults.
However I heard several times very well designed multi ways leaving no wishes open.
But much more often designs which were "phasey".
However I heard several times very well designed multi ways leaving no wishes open.
But much more often designs which were "phasey".
Good to know, Thanks guys. Any fuel for the search engine fire is fun to see what is out there.
Waxx, Yes indeed, I have been just recently exploring Philips history, very much so with paper cone 2 ways.
Some look very familiar now looking back. Possible I have seen many on thrift store shelfs in the 90's
Probably could have picked up many for cheap in my younger years.
planet10 doing searches now and exploring this brand as well. Very similar designs with paper cones for WAW inspirations.
Seems to be the norm for a era before dome tweeters became more common in consumer lines.
Im already guessing anything that is real interesting or models that stand out. You probably might actually have the drivers in your collection
The fullrange of the one i had in my hand is a 9710, with a doped paper cone and alnico magnet. The AD5201S "Bombardon" woofer is using a poysterene cone and an alnico magnet . The original cabinet was made of of thin full wood (probally oak) with a kind of whool as lining on the walls. The owner rebuild the cabinet in plywood with bracing with full wood battens (like in the original cabinet). For lining he used wool felt sheets.
I have a pair of those in the middle...at least the one pictured resembles them
Grabbed from a portable ( I think Lesa) turntable set, 32Ω 6-7" cone with reversed magnet mount (in front ) and whizzer.
A true reference!
...30 yrs ago!
Now they're ( those...) are sitting
Last incarnation was a TDA 2822 piloting a 1:4 minuscule transformer
Outdated by TPAs...
Edit: no, mine have octagonal basket
Grabbed from a portable ( I think Lesa) turntable set, 32Ω 6-7" cone with reversed magnet mount (in front ) and whizzer.
A true reference!
...30 yrs ago!
Now they're ( those...) are sitting
Last incarnation was a TDA 2822 piloting a 1:4 minuscule transformer
Outdated by TPAs...
Edit: no, mine have octagonal basket
I agree that it is hard. The bass unit has to sound the same just much lower. Drivers from the same company line/tech sometimes work together. Other times one might need that aha! moment to pick out the right mate (Lowther with resin-coated carbon-fiber). I don't like the sound of monster caps and would rather look for other means to high-pass. To date no problem with monster aircores.