Yes have tried UFG for my dac but didn't like the sound. If I recalled kind of sluggish but than again it might work good on other electronics.
The nichicon muse BP not bad too but I only use it for decoupling on my SS amp, on dac only so so.
Thanks for the compliment. As the saying goes no pain no gain. For me if I were to diy PS means all the way back to transformer. Don't know why, when I started diy I just dislike the sound of Toroid trafos so all my trafos are custom wound EI with split bobbins & if bobbins of the required VA is not available than
a copper shield between primary & secondary will be added with a ground wire attached to it for experimenting. Off course later years someone did some testing & found that Toroid trafos are wide band as compared to EI. Haven't tried other more exotic variants though. For PS rectifiers especially for amps, the
best that I've found are Shindengen Schottky bridge rectifiers, grainless.
Cheers
Thanks, sumotan, for your feedback 😉
I reckon the challenge then is where to start looking for replacements? With the Silmics gone and KZ & KG also gone - and as far as I can see neither of these companies introducing suitable replacements - it will sort of be like beginning from scratch ... Too bad, actually
Jesper
Are KZ & KG gone ????? Silmics not for me accept for the Silmic Gold which I got from Japan.
Anyway dont be caught up with boutique caps, there's some nice commercial types too but for
me just too many varieties to test. For amps Sikorels are good too.
Anyway dont be caught up with boutique caps, there's some nice commercial types too but for
me just too many varieties to test. For amps Sikorels are good too.
Yes, the KZs & the KGs are now discontinued 🙁 ... So yes:
Cheers, Jesper
this has also been my thought. Well, time will see what shows up ...
Cheers, Jesper
How you go about it to connect 2 capacitors in parallel,What is your trick to keep it clean and efficient?
@nicoch58
I would be interested in reading this document in full, could you provide a link to it please?
The one in this post: https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/best-electrolytic-capacitors.151392/post-7537687
Thanks,
Alex
I would be interested in reading this document in full, could you provide a link to it please?
The one in this post: https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/best-electrolytic-capacitors.151392/post-7537687
Thanks,
Alex
A good thing would be greater values for Jupiter cosmos caps since there is no elna silmic left!!! 1000, 2200, 3300uf! Please!
Hi, I had made an amplifier on a breadboard which I use for listening sometimes and to also test various capacitors, it's a fairly simple signal path, 1 input and output cap with a voltage divider bias and emitter feedback, single stage with single ended supply. (I also try to minimise the parasitic capacitance and inductances by shorter leads and close terminals), anyways, I had some 10uf 50v Gemcon capacitors lying around and I used that as the input coupling cap (replacing a 10uf 100v Nichicon KZ), just letting you know that it's not a fair comparison but I've noticed the high frequency to sound more metallic/realistic and transparent from the gemcon than KZ. It has the least smear, however, I think this is what some might call sterile/lifeless? Maybe you can try them out using the same values and compare the ESR and see if you find the same generalisation.
Aside from the above, I'll give my opinions on a bunch of different series from various manufacturers that I have tested repeatedly regardless of capacitance but the same voltage.
I don't have a reference point or in other words to say that this cap may have "unnatural high frequency/grainy midrange" intrinsically so I'll just compare them with eachother, they all sound different but I have a hard time telling which is as close to real life for some.
Elna Silmic II - bloated upper bass, rounded and slightly veiled midrange (some say 3D, I also agree but I think it's simultaneously 3D and veiled or whatever), somewhat exaggerated highs but not that smeared (especially after burn in)
Nichicon FG - exaggerated and slightly smeared treble, smooth/smeared midrange, slight emphasis on lower midrange
Nichicon KZ - most neutral, least smeared, detailed and transparent, silmic has more emphasis on the higher treble frequencies I think or maybe more "air"/space but the KZ sounds the most realistic here (tonality wise)
Nichicon KA - most smooth/smeared for the midrange and treble here
Old Matsushita M (Panasonic) capacitors (47 years old) - similar to KZ (neutral FR and similar tonality) but harsh of course and slightly smeared
Rubycon CE W - similar to Nichicon KA, smeared treble, slightly smooth and is either neutral or thin sounding
I have yet to try the Panasonic series, FC, FM and FR, bipolar and polar Kaiseis and also the rubycon ZL (I've heard people describe the ZL as stringent, sterile and shrill lol, and it was found to be due to having much lower ESR at the higher audible frequencies than other caps, I would also like to hear your opinion on those), but I think ESR doesn't necessarily have to solely determine tonality and its more of the dielectric composition and how certain parameters that we can or can't measure interact with the AC signal, could well just blame the degree of phase shift and call it a day.
I don't have a reference point or in other words to say that this cap may have "unnatural high frequency/grainy midrange" intrinsically so I'll just compare them with eachother, they all sound different but I have a hard time telling which is as close to real life for some.
Elna Silmic II - bloated upper bass, rounded and slightly veiled midrange (some say 3D, I also agree but I think it's simultaneously 3D and veiled or whatever), somewhat exaggerated highs but not that smeared (especially after burn in)
Nichicon FG - exaggerated and slightly smeared treble, smooth/smeared midrange, slight emphasis on lower midrange
Nichicon KZ - most neutral, least smeared, detailed and transparent, silmic has more emphasis on the higher treble frequencies I think or maybe more "air"/space but the KZ sounds the most realistic here (tonality wise)
Nichicon KA - most smooth/smeared for the midrange and treble here
Old Matsushita M (Panasonic) capacitors (47 years old) - similar to KZ (neutral FR and similar tonality) but harsh of course and slightly smeared
Rubycon CE W - similar to Nichicon KA, smeared treble, slightly smooth and is either neutral or thin sounding
I have yet to try the Panasonic series, FC, FM and FR, bipolar and polar Kaiseis and also the rubycon ZL (I've heard people describe the ZL as stringent, sterile and shrill lol, and it was found to be due to having much lower ESR at the higher audible frequencies than other caps, I would also like to hear your opinion on those), but I think ESR doesn't necessarily have to solely determine tonality and its more of the dielectric composition and how certain parameters that we can or can't measure interact with the AC signal, could well just blame the degree of phase shift and call it a day.
Hi Austrian Printer,
& thanks for sharing your listening impressions. Just a couple of remarks on the Rubycon ZLs: I've used - and still use - them (mainly lower voltage i.e. 16V or 25V types, 12.5mm diameter maximum in sound related circuitry) for many years in a couple of designs and to my ears they do have some noticable qualities like good and realistic spacing, fine dynamics, and good lower end. However, again to my ears, they also exhibit a sort of tonal "darkness" that never really allows the tonal aspects of the music to "live", or "bloom". And, yes, this likely also contributes to a top end that may be sort of realistic but again without tonal warmth or bloom.
Also, from a practical point of view, it looks as if Rubycon is discontinuing many of the ZL series capacitors (at least if Mouser may be an indication of this) and in my experience the other ZL "extention" capacitors (ZLJ, ZLH) do not sound quite the same.
Just on a side note: A very practical aspect of Rubycon capacitors is that I have never found just one of them to fail even after soldering them many times. IME reliability is very good indeed.
Cheers, Jesper
& thanks for sharing your listening impressions. Just a couple of remarks on the Rubycon ZLs: I've used - and still use - them (mainly lower voltage i.e. 16V or 25V types, 12.5mm diameter maximum in sound related circuitry) for many years in a couple of designs and to my ears they do have some noticable qualities like good and realistic spacing, fine dynamics, and good lower end. However, again to my ears, they also exhibit a sort of tonal "darkness" that never really allows the tonal aspects of the music to "live", or "bloom". And, yes, this likely also contributes to a top end that may be sort of realistic but again without tonal warmth or bloom.
Also, from a practical point of view, it looks as if Rubycon is discontinuing many of the ZL series capacitors (at least if Mouser may be an indication of this) and in my experience the other ZL "extention" capacitors (ZLJ, ZLH) do not sound quite the same.
Just on a side note: A very practical aspect of Rubycon capacitors is that I have never found just one of them to fail even after soldering them many times. IME reliability is very good indeed.
Cheers, Jesper
Elna Cerafine are actually better than the Nichicons in signal path duty. Like for cathode bypass caps. They work good in power supply stuff too its just I can't hear the difference between them and the Nichicons there. If you can find them and the size isn't too large Sanyo Os-Cons are also great for signal path stuff.
Elna Cerafine may be approved sonically, they are too often leaking and bulging after years where the normal electrolytic caps still go strong (in the same device).
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I have Cerafines in my 300B SET amp as cathode bypass caps for 5 years now. Thats my only experience with them. Maybe just make sure you over rate the voltage? I am using 100V in my amp FWIW.
Put a 100uf poly like motor run ,
osCon in driver stage katode is good with cerafine on input katode e good mix balance
osCon in driver stage katode is good with cerafine on input katode e good mix balance
For low voltage,low capacitance values you can`t beat solid polymer E-caps.Take a look at the Wikipedia article on polymer caps and notice the conductivity index of various types of electrolytic caps.The polymer types are in a different class.
I recently upgraded a Nova Fidelity streamer/dac by replacing all the post regulator/local decoupling Nichicon FGs with Panasonic solid polymer.
The sound immediately lost that typical smearing colouration and grain which charactarises E-caps using a standard wet separator type technology.
I recently upgraded a Nova Fidelity streamer/dac by replacing all the post regulator/local decoupling Nichicon FGs with Panasonic solid polymer.
The sound immediately lost that typical smearing colouration and grain which charactarises E-caps using a standard wet separator type technology.
Cerafines for me has lots of transparency but trade off, it eats up the bass alot than again it depends on where the component is used.
Thanks for sharing Gemcon Austrain, there's just too many brands to try really. As I mentioned KZs highs are zinggy it needs to be parallel
with something else to balance the sound. Ultimate for realism are actually BG N series but it too has it's weakness transparency not so good.
We all should be sharing our findings here regardless of what caps. There should be lots of none boutique types that too will sound good but
have yet to be discovered. For me as long as no RF etc is being pick up, I've never been too concern about lead lenght etc. Why cause pcb in
itself has more sins.
Cheers
Thanks for sharing Gemcon Austrain, there's just too many brands to try really. As I mentioned KZs highs are zinggy it needs to be parallel
with something else to balance the sound. Ultimate for realism are actually BG N series but it too has it's weakness transparency not so good.
We all should be sharing our findings here regardless of what caps. There should be lots of none boutique types that too will sound good but
have yet to be discovered. For me as long as no RF etc is being pick up, I've never been too concern about lead lenght etc. Why cause pcb in
itself has more sins.
Cheers
Speaking of coloration and smearing... The biggest improvement in this area I have experienced (and it wasn't even close) was when I switched to autoformer volume control and got away from resistive. Easily the biggest single improvement I have ever encountered by swapping a single component. It was like two bedsheets were lifted off my speakers. And I had a DACT volume control prior. Off topic I know... But if anyone has not ever experienced one of these I would make it a priority for your next mod. I don't know how the input impedance police feel about them but my phono amp and DAC appear to take no issue with it.
I have an autoformer from Intact Audio. That parts house in England I forget the name also has good prices on these. HIFI Collective is the place..
I have an autoformer from Intact Audio. That parts house in England I forget the name also has good prices on these. HIFI Collective is the place..
Handy that you don’t mention that particular volume controllers impedance (nor its brand and typenumber) 😉 and also not the phono and DACs Output impedance. Let alone the previous DACTs impedance. So we as readers know exactly nothing.
Ha you edit faster than I do. Which type is it? Do you have a link?
Ha you edit faster than I do. Which type is it? Do you have a link?
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