I am looking for recommendations on a significantly improved phono preamp kit for my analog system. The sonic performance is currently really quite good: full bass, good separation and sound stage, and very realistic. Would I be better with a solid state or tube preamp.
(1) Lenco L-75 turntable modified with a custom plinth and Silver Note 512S tone arm. Stanton 681 cartridge with a Pickering 625DJ stylus. I would like the option of upgrade to a moving coil cartridge in the future.
(2) Hagerman, Bugle 2 phono pre-amp
(3) Bottlehead Stereomour 2A3 SE tube amp
(4) Klipsch KLF-20 horn speakers (100dB/m)
Below is a list of the phono pre-amp kits I have found.
(1) RJM, Emerald (RJM Audio)
(2) Elliot, P06 HiFi Phono Preamp (Hi-Fi RIAA Phono Preamp)
(3) Tindie, Muffsy Phono Preamp PP-4 Kit (https://www.muffsy.com/muffsy-pp4)
(4) Pass Labs, Pearl 2 (https://www.passdiy.com/pdf/PEARL 2.pdf)
(5) Signal Transfer, Phono Preamplifier (The Signal Transfer Company: RIAA PCB with unbalanced outputs)
(6) Boozhound, Deluxe Phono Preamp (https://boozhoundlabs.com/collections/all/products/deluxe-phono-peramplifier)
(7) Tavish, Vintage 6SL7 Phono Stage (https://tavishdesign.com/products/vintage-6sl7-phono-stage?variant=13907030662)
(8) GlassWare, Aikido Tetra (https://glass-ware.stores.yahoo.net/tetrasansps.html)
(9) Bottlehead Reduction 1.1 (https://bottlehead.com/product/reduction-1-1-phono-preamplifier-kit/#)
(10) Bottlehead Eros 2 (https://bottlehead.com/product/eros-2-phono-preamplifier-kit/)
Thanks!
(1) Lenco L-75 turntable modified with a custom plinth and Silver Note 512S tone arm. Stanton 681 cartridge with a Pickering 625DJ stylus. I would like the option of upgrade to a moving coil cartridge in the future.
(2) Hagerman, Bugle 2 phono pre-amp
(3) Bottlehead Stereomour 2A3 SE tube amp
(4) Klipsch KLF-20 horn speakers (100dB/m)
Below is a list of the phono pre-amp kits I have found.
(1) RJM, Emerald (RJM Audio)
(2) Elliot, P06 HiFi Phono Preamp (Hi-Fi RIAA Phono Preamp)
(3) Tindie, Muffsy Phono Preamp PP-4 Kit (https://www.muffsy.com/muffsy-pp4)
(4) Pass Labs, Pearl 2 (https://www.passdiy.com/pdf/PEARL 2.pdf)
(5) Signal Transfer, Phono Preamplifier (The Signal Transfer Company: RIAA PCB with unbalanced outputs)
(6) Boozhound, Deluxe Phono Preamp (https://boozhoundlabs.com/collections/all/products/deluxe-phono-peramplifier)
(7) Tavish, Vintage 6SL7 Phono Stage (https://tavishdesign.com/products/vintage-6sl7-phono-stage?variant=13907030662)
(8) GlassWare, Aikido Tetra (https://glass-ware.stores.yahoo.net/tetrasansps.html)
(9) Bottlehead Reduction 1.1 (https://bottlehead.com/product/reduction-1-1-phono-preamplifier-kit/#)
(10) Bottlehead Eros 2 (https://bottlehead.com/product/eros-2-phono-preamplifier-kit/)
Thanks!
You might be interested to add the Salas Simplistic JFET RIAA to your list. Tea Bag just did an initial group buy on an updated “Ultra” version. There is a dedicated thread and group buy here.
It is based on the same circuit the Boozehound phono amp is which is the Jean Hiraga “LePacific”...albeit with a shunt regulated power supply and now a few more bells and whistles like switchable gain.
I lived with the original Boozehound Labs phono amp for several years which I run off of a rechargeable NiMH battery pack. I made it source switchable so I could use either MM straight through or my ZYX CPP1 head amp in front of it for MC carts. It is very quite and enjoyable to listen to. I am very sensitive to hum and hiss from phono amps as I use Lowther DX3 in front horns. That being said, I already have two versions of the Salas Simplistic waiting to be built.
In the mean time I built an RJM VSPS which is an OP AMP based design. It was something that was cheap and partially built that I found in the swap meet. I set it up the same way to use with MM and MC through my head amp. I haven’t been using it long. It is not as quiet as the Boozehound. It is nice sounding. I would like to give it more time and possibly try other OP AMPs in it to see what its potential might be.
The only other operating phono amp I have is the one built into my Audible Illusions 2D tube pre. I haven’t used it since I built my Salas DCB1 based preamp. Nothing wrong with it, but its gain structure doesn’t seem to work properly with my MC head amp in order to be able to use MC carts. Compared to the Boozehound using just MM I would say I prefer the Boozehound as it has more detail and a better sound stage.
I also have what turned out to be a set of Pearl 2 board copies. Didn’t bother building them once I found out they weren’t from PASS Labs so I can’t share any experience.
It is based on the same circuit the Boozehound phono amp is which is the Jean Hiraga “LePacific”...albeit with a shunt regulated power supply and now a few more bells and whistles like switchable gain.
I lived with the original Boozehound Labs phono amp for several years which I run off of a rechargeable NiMH battery pack. I made it source switchable so I could use either MM straight through or my ZYX CPP1 head amp in front of it for MC carts. It is very quite and enjoyable to listen to. I am very sensitive to hum and hiss from phono amps as I use Lowther DX3 in front horns. That being said, I already have two versions of the Salas Simplistic waiting to be built.
In the mean time I built an RJM VSPS which is an OP AMP based design. It was something that was cheap and partially built that I found in the swap meet. I set it up the same way to use with MM and MC through my head amp. I haven’t been using it long. It is not as quiet as the Boozehound. It is nice sounding. I would like to give it more time and possibly try other OP AMPs in it to see what its potential might be.
The only other operating phono amp I have is the one built into my Audible Illusions 2D tube pre. I haven’t used it since I built my Salas DCB1 based preamp. Nothing wrong with it, but its gain structure doesn’t seem to work properly with my MC head amp in order to be able to use MC carts. Compared to the Boozehound using just MM I would say I prefer the Boozehound as it has more detail and a better sound stage.
I also have what turned out to be a set of Pearl 2 board copies. Didn’t bother building them once I found out they weren’t from PASS Labs so I can’t share any experience.
The Bugle is a good little phono stage. I loaned mine to a friend and never got it back. The testimonials on Hagerman's web page are clear enough, so it's hard to recommend an improvement unless you say what you'd like to be better.
I know a few of the ones you've listed above and they're good but they all have their own distinct character. Maybe you like maybe you not like. Eventually it just boils down to the system it's in and your personal taste. for eg. I have yet to hear a jFet circuit that I liked enough to not consider something else an improvement. They have always sounded kind of flat to me. Others will point you to some very good circuits that use them with strong recommendations and there's nothing to argue about.
I guess in short I'd say, if you're looking for something better stay with the Bugle until your doubt about it is stronger than your enjoyment of it. On the other hand if it's an interest in exploring the larger sonic (or circuit) terrain in general, then the one on your list that interests you the most is the best place to start.
=2¢
I know a few of the ones you've listed above and they're good but they all have their own distinct character. Maybe you like maybe you not like. Eventually it just boils down to the system it's in and your personal taste. for eg. I have yet to hear a jFet circuit that I liked enough to not consider something else an improvement. They have always sounded kind of flat to me. Others will point you to some very good circuits that use them with strong recommendations and there's nothing to argue about.
I guess in short I'd say, if you're looking for something better stay with the Bugle until your doubt about it is stronger than your enjoyment of it. On the other hand if it's an interest in exploring the larger sonic (or circuit) terrain in general, then the one on your list that interests you the most is the best place to start.
=2¢
Hello ptlud
About 8 months ago I was looking for a new tube pre-amp for my phono system. I did alot of research and finally choose the Little Bear T-11.
Some online reviews are not so good, complaining of being noisy, but I
decided to get one anyway. I do not regret my choice. My amp is dead silent.
Its design is a clone of the EAR 834 using 3 12AX7's. I replaced the Chinese tubes with 7025's in V1 and V2 and a 12AX7LPT in V3. Best sounding pre-amp
I ever heard. Cost if just over $150.00 usd. It has a pot to vary the output
level which I find very useful so as not to overload the input of my computer
sound card. I used the pre-amp to convert all my LP's to digital and when in
the mood, I run the output into my power amp just to listen to LP's.
I think the T-11 is hard to beat for the price.
About 8 months ago I was looking for a new tube pre-amp for my phono system. I did alot of research and finally choose the Little Bear T-11.
Some online reviews are not so good, complaining of being noisy, but I
decided to get one anyway. I do not regret my choice. My amp is dead silent.
Its design is a clone of the EAR 834 using 3 12AX7's. I replaced the Chinese tubes with 7025's in V1 and V2 and a 12AX7LPT in V3. Best sounding pre-amp
I ever heard. Cost if just over $150.00 usd. It has a pot to vary the output
level which I find very useful so as not to overload the input of my computer
sound card. I used the pre-amp to convert all my LP's to digital and when in
the mood, I run the output into my power amp just to listen to LP's.
I think the T-11 is hard to beat for the price.
Actually, you've got a nice thing going there. Klipsch KLF-20 can be really brash and harsh if driven by the usual solid-state super-low-distortion amplification, especially if your listening room has hard surfaces. (I know, I've heard them that way.) But a Stanton 681 (a real smoothie) and an SE 2A3 would certainly change that.
I built one of the older Bugles. It's pretty good. It's pretty neutral. It was too 'solid-state sounding' for me, but I'm into tubes. Others are not. It's all good.
Which way do you want to go with the sound from your records? Do you want warm and smooth, or do you want to add 'air' and excitement to your setup?
Maybe you'd prefer a moving coil cart for the added air and excitement they usually bring? Denon DL103? That's a very different sound from a Stanton 681.
It all depends on what you want, right?
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I built one of the older Bugles. It's pretty good. It's pretty neutral. It was too 'solid-state sounding' for me, but I'm into tubes. Others are not. It's all good.
Which way do you want to go with the sound from your records? Do you want warm and smooth, or do you want to add 'air' and excitement to your setup?
Maybe you'd prefer a moving coil cart for the added air and excitement they usually bring? Denon DL103? That's a very different sound from a Stanton 681.
It all depends on what you want, right?
--
I have built and heard the Bugle, Bottlehead Seduction, Boozehound, ESP, Muffsy and Pearl 2. The Bottlehead will NOT disappoint and was my favorite tube stage until I built the BigBottle MM/MC. The BigBottle blows the others out of the water and is now my go-to phono stage. For solid-state, the Pearl 2 was my favorite by a long shot but it did not come close to the 3D soundstage the tube versions offered.
Does it specifically have to be a kit? I have a 6dj8 based phono preamp that I built on perf board that sounds fantastic.
I built the power supply into a separate enclosure and put the pre into a shielded box. I shielded it with copper foil tape and then grounded that. All dc heaters and HV is regulated with an lr8/pass transistor so it is completely silent. I've attached the schematic for you if you are interested.
I built the power supply into a separate enclosure and put the pre into a shielded box. I shielded it with copper foil tape and then grounded that. All dc heaters and HV is regulated with an lr8/pass transistor so it is completely silent. I've attached the schematic for you if you are interested.
Attachments
Depending on what cartridge you use, an updated version of the basic old RCA RIAA phono stage sounds really good, if constructed well. You will need to add an output buffer, either a cathode follower (12AT7 works well for this) or a MOSFET (Zetex ZVN0545A works well for this).
I built one of these years ago, with a 12AT7 cathode follower direct-coupled from the last 12AX7 plate. I used a plain and simple CRCRC network for the B+, and a simple DC rectified heater supply. Hum is inaudible except at very loud levels. If I were to do it again, I'd regulate the DC supplies (with silicon stuff).
The last time I heard it (it was built for a family member) I really liked the sound of it with a Denon DL110 HOMC. The one caveat is that any phono stage with a 12AX7 at the input will have high input capacitance ('Miller effect' of high mu triode), which could adversely affect the frequency response of some MM cartridges or MC step-up transformers.
So it is a circuit that's sensitive to your choice of cartridge. Figure on a hefty 300pF or so load on your cartridge.
MerlinB (Valve Wizard) offers some nice PCBs for this kind of circuit.
3-Valve Phono PCB
Merlin also offers a mono PCB with a 12AX7 to a MOSFET source follower.
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I built one of these years ago, with a 12AT7 cathode follower direct-coupled from the last 12AX7 plate. I used a plain and simple CRCRC network for the B+, and a simple DC rectified heater supply. Hum is inaudible except at very loud levels. If I were to do it again, I'd regulate the DC supplies (with silicon stuff).
The last time I heard it (it was built for a family member) I really liked the sound of it with a Denon DL110 HOMC. The one caveat is that any phono stage with a 12AX7 at the input will have high input capacitance ('Miller effect' of high mu triode), which could adversely affect the frequency response of some MM cartridges or MC step-up transformers.
So it is a circuit that's sensitive to your choice of cartridge. Figure on a hefty 300pF or so load on your cartridge.
MerlinB (Valve Wizard) offers some nice PCBs for this kind of circuit.
3-Valve Phono PCB
Merlin also offers a mono PCB with a 12AX7 to a MOSFET source follower.
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Thank you very much. I am actually using Denon DL-110 HOMC cartridge.
I googled the phono PCB and is this the one that you are referring to?
3-Valve Phono PCB
Has anyone tried Hagerman Bugle 2? I saw that the shop is selling PCB Kit, too and wondering how this one compares with other Kit such as 3 value phono PCB.
Thank you again.
I googled the phono PCB and is this the one that you are referring to?
3-Valve Phono PCB
Has anyone tried Hagerman Bugle 2? I saw that the shop is selling PCB Kit, too and wondering how this one compares with other Kit such as 3 value phono PCB.
Thank you again.
Difference between valve and solid state is night and day. Valve gives you much better dynamics and soundstage with the increased dynamic range and overload capability. Be careful with the EAR ... too warm in my opinion. The modified RCA is a great circuit but as mentioned too much capacitive load. If you want a kit, you can't go wrong with Bottlehead. I have heard MANY phono stages and the BigBottle sold here on this site is hard to beat!
I'm sure Oliver will mention them, if you order the BigBottle board, be sure to get the multi-fet boards with it. They're not expensive and reduce noise by around 3db. I'm waiting for some parts from Mouser then I can start building mine.
It's a nice board and printed on both sides so you have a choice on having the valves showing nor not.
It's a nice board and printed on both sides so you have a choice on having the valves showing nor not.
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