How better is a Turntable compared to a CD?

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Scott, re strain gauges, of course they need EQ, and the good suppliers (e.g., Sao Win, Robertson) never claimed that they didn't and provided correct EQ. It's just not RIAA EQ, it's a pole and a zero in the midrange where RIAA has zero and a pole (respectively).

The "no EQ needed" nonsense is just more audiophile legend, in the same category as "mold release on CD/vinyl."

Fair enough, it is obvious. I'm with Kevin this myth is ingrained pretty deeply with some very knowledgable people. I found photos of both sides of the Win inteface box, no evidence of any equalization (pretty cheezy actually). On second look that graph from Win is exact over the whole range, their box just does not reflect that. The vinylengine threads reflect this totally, that guy is taking some flak for including the EQ.
 
The vinylengine threads reflect this totally, that guy is taking some flak for including the EQ.

As you've seen in some other threads, doing design correctly to achieve success in demonstrably audible factors is bound to cause howls and sneering from "audiophiles," especially those who have not designed so much as a volume control knob. Props to the fellow who understands the obvious, the flak notwithstanding.
 
Hi Bill,

There is simply no goddamn way! You might be kidding yourself but you ain't kidding me.

NorthStar, thank you.

Maybe I am delusional. This weekend is TAVES, I am in room 889. If you have audiophile friends in the Toronto area, send them for a listen. THEY will then give your their observations, not mine.

At this point I would like to make a general statement. I started on my quest to build a great speaker. There is no way I could have done it without diyAudio. I love all of you, and thank you again.

Bill, I hope you didn't interpret my post as a virtual reality.
I just meant that it is simply impossible to recreate a live event; just no way jose. The instrument's tones are different when reproduced by loudspeakers; all of them. And the dynamics; no way you can get the live dynamics of a full orchestra with choir and 16Hz pipes from that church's organ.

The best loudspeakers in the whole world ($2,000,000+/pair) simply cannot replicate the accuracy of live instruments and voices (piano, tenor, alto flute, cello, violin, viola, trumpet, saxophone, xylophone, trombone, clarinet, baritone, flugelhorn, etc.) in a way that you'd be completely fooled.

Besides, the mixing consoles, the tape recorders, the microphones, their critical positioning, etc., are all liabilities to the live events and venues.

* What's in room 889 Bill?
 
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SY said:
Props to the fellow who understands the obvious, the flak notwithstanding.
Given that this is so obvious mathematically, it is astonishing that people could argue about it. One might expect that a 12.5dB mid-range shelf might be audible too? Or does this provide a 'smooth' top end?

As in so many other cases, 'audiophiles' really are trying to ignorantly argue that black is white and seem offended when someone tries to correct them.
 
I did! SACD is much better than equivalent CD
It did not hear any difference or so little I could not tell there is a difference.

So did others on the dutch audioforum where I post, as far I know.

So I ask my self did you listen the cd throug a 24bit dac like I did when comparing it to the SACD player.
What was the cd source and what the was the sacd source.
 
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I did! SACD is much better than equivalent CD

I do hear significant differences between the CD layer and SACD layer on many recordings on my modified SCD-777ES, these differences are preserved through my external (24 bit) dac, and rips played via media server. In terms of the differences I (and others) can hear I would say the SACD version sounds more analog like, preserves more of the ambiance of the recording venue (if there) and the highs are frequently better. The CD layer sounds a lot more two dimensional by comparison.

Unusually subjective comment for me. I usually avoid this stuff.. 😱

I have some material in .DSF format (DSD file format) from Bluecoast records on the server, and these are probably the best sounding recordings on the server including a number HD PCM files of 24/88, 24/96, and 24/192.
 
I do hear significant differences between the CD layer and SACD layer on many recordings on my modified SCD-777ES, these differences are preserved through my external (24 bit) dac, and rips played via media server. In terms of the differences I (and others) can hear I would say the SACD version sounds more analog like, preserves more of the ambiance of the recording venue (if there) and the highs are frequently better. The CD layer sounds a lot more two dimensional by comparison.

Unusually subjective comment for me. I usually avoid this stuff.. 😱

I have some material in .DSF format (DSD file format) from Bluecoast records on the server, and these are probably the best sounding recordings on the server including a number HD PCM files of 24/88, 24/96, and 24/192.
I play a lot with speaker and simulate also a lot. Now I am building a speaker I want to sell on the high end market.
My previous speaker sounds better on the PSE tube amp because it sounds more relaxed and 3D on it.

The new commercial 3way loudspeaker also sounds 3D on the class-d amp just as on the tube amp. Now I would even prefer the class-d amp because it has very low THD that results on this very low THD speaker as more detailed music reproduction.

As you maybe self already discovered, not always happens what you would assume when your designing audio equipment.

I say this because you hear more 3D in the SACD, here it doesn't matter SACD or CD through quality 24 bit dac on the new speaker both sound 3D.
 
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I do hear significant differences between the CD layer and SACD layer on many recordings on my modified SCD-777ES, these differences are preserved through my external (24 bit) dac, and rips played via media server. In terms of the differences I (and others) can hear I would say the SACD version sounds more analog like, preserves more of the ambiance of the recording venue (if there) and the highs are frequently better. The CD layer sounds a lot more two dimensional by comparison.

Unusually subjective comment for me. I usually avoid this stuff.. 😱

I have some material in .DSF format (DSD file format) from Bluecoast records on the server, and these are probably the best sounding recordings on the server including a number HD PCM files of 24/88, 24/96, and 24/192.

it is exactly what the difference is!! :cloud9:
 
All the debate about the cost of gear and what is good or not good is flawed, so is the assumption that certain nationalities fit certain types or lacks certain skills. Too much of that here.

What is the profound difference on the signal from a TT than from any digital source..??
 
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