I don't have these special designed for his new DAC, I have All Fet's regulators for his I/V DAC & for his balanced All Fet pre-amplifier.
Your opinion is welcome for me, you are very kind sharing for free your work with us. I own a lot of Erno Borbely stuff but I like also DIY & I enjoy also trying to learn something here.
Attached information about Erno's reg. +-5V 1uV noise for DAC, enjoy.
Telstar,
Normally all Erno's stuff go with +-24V & differente currents: 100mA-130mA-200mA always using All Fets (not Shunt).
Also have an All Fet reg. (not shunt) dual low noise +-(5V-36V) 200mA.
Super-shunt have two:
1st Load current up to 100mA +-(12V-28V)
2nd Load current up to 200mA +-(12V-28V)
Erno Borbely Web: Home Page
Hi qusp,
I was thinking of waiting for about a week after the price of the boards has been made public so that we give people a change to make up their minds. Here's a tentative schedule:
* Wednesday Jan. 20, 2010 -- Start collecting funds
* Wednesday Jan. 27, 2010 -- Order enough boards for all those who sent funds plus a few more
So this is the first time I ever do anything like this, I'm a bit unsure how to proceed with the prototype boards. If we order five boards of each circuit (positive and negative) it will take about 8-12 days to get it, plus, the cost per board is very high. For the price of these five boards we could get many more if we order in volume.
Also, another problem is with shipping. If we don't have a flat shipping fee, I cannot collect funds until I take the parcel to the post office and get it weighed, and then get an estimate price. This would be a nightmare to do for more than a hundred people. On the other hand, how can we set a flat fee if some people want a few boards, while others want more boards? What do you guys think about this? Any suggestions?
I was thinking of waiting for about a week after the price of the boards has been made public so that we give people a change to make up their minds. Here's a tentative schedule:
* Wednesday Jan. 20, 2010 -- Start collecting funds
* Wednesday Jan. 27, 2010 -- Order enough boards for all those who sent funds plus a few more
So this is the first time I ever do anything like this, I'm a bit unsure how to proceed with the prototype boards. If we order five boards of each circuit (positive and negative) it will take about 8-12 days to get it, plus, the cost per board is very high. For the price of these five boards we could get many more if we order in volume.
Also, another problem is with shipping. If we don't have a flat shipping fee, I cannot collect funds until I take the parcel to the post office and get it weighed, and then get an estimate price. This would be a nightmare to do for more than a hundred people. On the other hand, how can we set a flat fee if some people want a few boards, while others want more boards? What do you guys think about this? Any suggestions?
Not waiting for the testers opinions?
ah-ha.
That depends on the kind of improvements that you think can be done.
I think that before the mass order you should wait for a more precise measurement from one of the testers.
Go to the post office or check online all various rates vs continents and size/weight of package to figure an average, i.e. for europe, canada, us, asia, africa. If the differences are small you can set an average, I dont think people will be pissed about paying 2-3$ more or less for shipping.
I do not know. I would need to ABX in my own system.
Also, it depends WHERE the regulator is used, in low level gear like a DAC which is more sensitive to power, i bet most people would. To power the VAS of my future AMP, probably not 😉
About PTFE vs non-PTFE PCBs subjectively speaking is very difficult for me (english is not mine language) but the improvement is serious and not only in one area of sound.
About caps, I have tested: Nichicon (Muse & KZ), Sanyo Oscon, Elna Cerafine & Silmic II, Panasonic FC, Rubycon ZL, Black-Gates (WK, FK,STD & NP).
It's important remark that BG ceased production, Oscon is very difficult get all values trough hole.
About sound quality the best is BG in all situations (decoupling, PS, etc), for digital decoupling I use also Oscon in this position are very goods, lastly used Elna Silmic II (Nelson Pass best choice) and I said that is the best cap actually in production, following the rest ordering best to less best: Nichicon KZ, Nichicon Muse, Panasonic FC, Rubycon ZL & Elna Cerafine.
Good answer, is the same like I said in a Spanish forum🙂
Of course that when I speak of regs. is for analog or digital line level never for AMP.
sounds like we have a very similar taste in caps then, except I dont place BG above all others, my question was a bit rhetorical 😀, I too have used all of the above, but rubicon ZN does not really even need a mention IMO, really a bit behind the rest in that mix. I just finished making up some jung regs with silmic II as well, well actually a mixture of silmic II, KZ and BG FK. I too prefer oscon in digital supplies like everyone seems to, I can find that they are kind-of 'too good' in other positions so they can sound a bit boring, but in digital supplies thats what you want (not boring, but too good). I use mainly the SMD SEPC and SVP though, I prefer SMD where I can, for through-hole I use the SP version
ok well looks like PTFE is gonna happen
thanks for the reply
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I think they solved this in a neat way over at the B1-SalasShunt power buy.
They agreed, in advance, with the PCB manufacturer on the number of boards they'll get and pressed him to include an early delivery of some prototypes for a good price (which was then divided and added to the value of the big batch of boards people bought).
If I'm not mistaken, this is a feature many PCB manufacturers offer as an option anyway.
for sure, that sounds like a really good way of approaching it , if the fab place is happy to. I certainly have no qualms in putting in my share towards the prototypes. especially considering its a pretty well trodden design.
The only reason for having the pcb sent to testers would be to test the manufactured pcb. I don't expect to change the circuit, which has been tested already.
But sure, we do it the way you guys want. To make five boards at the specs we want costs about $125. Double this to include the negative side, and add to this the shipping to each of the testers, let's assume $6 each.
That's $280, just to have five boards for testing.
I should say that I have etched PCBs of this exact board design at home a few times already.
There is something interesting that telstar said, that the testers would measure the performance more precisely. So far none of the testers has the instruments to do that. 🙂 Should we wait for someone that has the right instruments to do professional measurements on the circuit?
I'm not sure how to proceed now. Perhaps I should have the boards produced by me entirely. Meaning I would have the factory make 275 positive boards and 175 negative boards, and then hope to sell them almost all, in time. It's kind of risky though, because I don't know know how serious people are about actually getting them. It would not be a group buy then, but more like other people sell boards. I'm not a business, I would prefer not to do that.
I'll think some more about it and perhaps more of you can email me suggestions as well? Thanks guys!
It's good suggestion, thanks. I will do that. I was worried that people would mind the flat rate, but I don't really see that we have another option. Actually another option is to put the boards on eBay, where they have those shipping calculators. But the eBay fees get added then 🙁
Yes, that's a great way. I've sent them this proposal already but didn't get an answer yet. This would be ideal, right? I hope that they agree, of course!
Today I was thinking about caps too!
But most of the above are of too small capacitance to be worth of such use (min 10,000uF each).
I have some experience (all in power amps, not digital nor low level gear) only with Nichicon gold and they are decent for psu filtering (CRC). For this purpose i'm looking for something better, and since I'm in europe like you, I plan to try the Mundorf M-Lytic, Rifa PEH200 and especially the BHC T-Network specced and used by DNM.
Will follow Nelson advice to try the Silmic II where medium values are needed and also the rather cheap Panasonic FM (which are supposed to be quite better than the FC).
I have Nichicon Gold 10.000uF/43V or similar & Jensen 10.000uF/63V both in PS. For 10.000uF go for Epcos/Siemens Sikorels😉
also Toshin UTSJ are very good in 10000uf, though they do need bypassing due to the steel leads IMO. they are difficult to find outside of japan though. I much prefer these to nichicon gold (FW).
regarding the silver on teflon, i'll PM you a link later on, i'm not at home at the moment. its here in australia, though you should be able to find it elswhere too. they offer a hard gold plate as well, so i'm considering silver immersion with gold plate, though i'm not sure the gold plate is needed due to silver oxide being a pretty decent conductor.
@ ikoflexer, yeah since this design has been tested thoroughly, I think if they wont comply to that request just go ahead with the order, that seems like a lot of money otherwise. it'll sort itself out, dont let the stress of expectation effect what you would do otherwise mate. i'm perfectly happy to trust your judgement on this.
regarding the silver on teflon, i'll PM you a link later on, i'm not at home at the moment. its here in australia, though you should be able to find it elswhere too. they offer a hard gold plate as well, so i'm considering silver immersion with gold plate, though i'm not sure the gold plate is needed due to silver oxide being a pretty decent conductor.
@ ikoflexer, yeah since this design has been tested thoroughly, I think if they wont comply to that request just go ahead with the order, that seems like a lot of money otherwise. it'll sort itself out, dont let the stress of expectation effect what you would do otherwise mate. i'm perfectly happy to trust your judgement on this.
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