Hold your horses. PMA seems to show that ability on a foobar ABX in Can you hear a difference between 2 solid state preamps? thread. You can independently verify his findings.
Yes, known to both of them. Ironically IIRC Mark didn't do the test, he was rather dismissive of it, as was Douglas, but for entirely different reasons. Yet another interesting result, as far as I'm concerned
I'm not saying there aren't differences in sound, of course there are, and I can hear most of them too. For example: I have two little mini-amps both based on the TPA3116d2 chip that sound noticeably different. They have differences in low bass response.
But lets keep it reasonable. Nobody is going to hear a difference caused by a 100khz roll off. Nobody is going to pick up on tiny bits of distortion, microsend jitter, fractional db level differences, single digit frequency differences, etc. These things are quite simply beyond the range of human discernment. Physical impossibilities.
Similarly the claim that trading cables can affect things like "soundstage" which comes entirely from the source recording, or "speed" whatever that means, or "presence" which is equally ethereal, are sheer folly. It's a piece of wire, the ultimate in passive components... it simply can't do that.
That difference between my two amps can be traced directly to the input capacitors. (1.0uf vs 3.3uf) I can hear it and I can measure it... I know it's real.
For the rest, I call "Bullsmut"... Show me the science or stop bothering me with it.
Yet another interesting result, as far as I'm concerned
No matter what you may think about my opinion of that exercise, the outcome was interesting. At least I don't throw bigoted insults at anyone if and or when they describe what they hear.
Douglas,
Despite your vast overconfidence, research shows it is quite normal for each and every human to believe only they perceive the one true reality, and all other people that disagree must be mistaken.
If is a much further step of bigotry to throw insults at other people who are more perceptive than you, calling their descriptions 'bullsmut', and liken them to dogs that lap drinks up with their tongues. Don't know if ScottJ (Matt) read all the nasty words you used to describe him and PMA. If I were them I would be highly offended.
Which is why we have history books, photographs, diaries, evidence and test equipment... to ensure that our often frail perceptions remain rooted in demonstrable reality.
I really don't care what colour the sky is on your world. I do however care that you don't demand I live there without good and sufficient reason.
Where's the science --the proof-- of your assertions? All these years and not one of the subjectivist crowd has ever offered me even the first bit of a reason to believe their claims... not one.
And, NO... "I hear it, why can't you" is not proof of anything.
I call them like I see them ... and feigning offence after getting called on your crap brings up a new adjective you can add to the list...
Snowflake.
Not my 'crap.' I didn't say I listened to the files of the two preamps and in fact I did not. Still, you had a lot of foul language to throw at those who did hear a difference according to their descriptions of what happened.
I think that your propensity to resort to name-calling in the foulest way should result in you being banned from this forum. Probably won't happen, but I hope you get your due comeuppance at some point.
Okay let me explain this to you one more time...
If this was face to face, in person, I would treat you exactly as I am now.
Do you have any idea who much perfectly good money is wasted on junk -- plain and simple junk-- that does not and cannot live up to the claims the so called Golden Ear crowd puts on it?
You do not live in the real world.
You demand I live in your dream world.
You try to punish me for not complying.
Can you figure out what "G. F. Y." might stand for?
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Okay, Mr. Only Proven Research, how much? Please provide a link to the research you are referring to that states the amount of money you are claiming?
Oh! Don't have research for that? Only when it suits your false arguments, eh?
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It's a 23 Billion dollar market, in the US alone.
Market analysis...
The Retail Market for Audio Equipment in the US - Industry Data, Trends, Stats | IBISWorld
And probably a hundred other links too.
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Buy the report and find out ...
Accessory sales --cords, adaptors, etc.-- accounts for about 10% of the market.
And even without a "plain and simple junk" category... how do you justify THIS?
$11,900 for 15 feet of wire ... Even NASA doesn't waste that kind of money.
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So, you are claiming that cords and adapters are 100% 'plain and simple junk?'
And or are you claiming that audiophiles waste 10% of the money spent on audio equipment?
Most are.
As I've already explained, I've seen all nature of really bad ideas with very high price tags on them. Things like RCA cables with batteries attached, shields only connected at one end, totally unshielded, so heavy the break the female connectors on your gear, made of the most ridiculous materials... and Speaker wires so oversized that you need to be a body builder to lift them... and power cords with ridiculous construction that does nothing... and on and on and on.
No... I am telling you that predatory companies like Monster, AudioQuest, WireWorld, DH labs and not a few others are blatently capitalizing on the "subjectivist" movement in audio to rip people off for Billions of dollars a year.
Now, what part of that do you not understand?
And yet it appears they did, why and/or how is the interesting question.
The ITD threshold is debatable, cable reflections and/or delays could have an effect, interesting but easily remedied if channels are identical I think.
Buy the wire and find out, is your approach?
Look, you said you listened to something and you know what you heard and that it was what was real.
Then you said you only believe in proven research.
Then you asked if I knew how much money was wasted by audiophiles on plain and simple junk.
When I asked you to say how much you were claiming was spent on junk by audiophiles, and to point to proven research, you waffled around pointing at some market research that has nothing to do with finding out how much money audiophiles waste per year.
Basically, you are a blustering fraud. You claim one thing then another, keep changing your story to whatever suits you at the time, and when called out on it you bluster, threaten, scream and yell foul language and generally try to intimidate others into shutting up and going away.
When it comes right down to it you don't know what you are talking about half the time from what I can see. The other half of the time you quote what you learned in school or what you otherwise happen to have right. Your problem is that you have no idea if and when you are wrong. You just switch to intimidation and insults so you don't have engage in any self examination when you might be wrong.
A sad state of affairs to be in that state.
I'm not offended, the words used by people are often a reflection of their positions, I try to have a open mind, I have no vested interests one way or the other. Interesting points can be raise in "heated" debates.
Did you know that Demian Martin who is a respected member of this forum was the main engineer for Monster for 20-years? Or that another member, Richard Marsh (who also was a writer of many hobbyist articles in audio magazines) also designed a very high quality power conditioner product for Monster?
Would you like to tell them to their faces what you think of them? Or would you be willing to hear their side of the story before condemning them?
Take a look at the lead post in that thread...
"If you can you hear THE difference" ... Creates the expectation that there is a difference and to not hear it is a failure. People will hear a difference, even if there is none, just because that is what is expected of them.
I took the two files and loaded them up in Audacity... I was not able to time align them well enough to get a null test showing me the difference. The tempo is off by a tiny bit and the files are different sizes... which might actually be what people heard.
Love to.
I'd also like to hear their explanation of why the "standard speaker wire" side of the Monster showroom demo units was loaded with #26 wire...
I'll listen... no harm in that... But don't be surprised if they get called on their BS too.
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