Hi everyone!
I've got two 18" pro woofers collecting dust, so I'm wondering if I should try them in a dual driver ripole. I don't know what brand the drivers are, but I've measured the T/S parameters, and from what I have read, they seem alright(?). But realising my own lack of experience here, a second opinion (or more!) would be fantastic...
The driver parameters are:
Sd 1194 [cm2]
Re 6.65 [Ohms]
Fs 27.59 [Hz]
BL 19.70 [N/A]
Qms 4.537
Qes 0.585
Qts 0.518
Vas 338.500 [liters]
L10k 1.07 [mH]
dBSPL 92.74 [1W/1m]
Ms 196.80 [grams]
Cms 0.17 [mm/N]
I don't know the xmax...
In other words, the total Sd for 2 drivers is 2388 cm2. I was thinking the following dimensions for the cabinet, with equal sized front and rear cavities:
Front and rear cavities: 48 x 48 x 13 cm = 29952 cm3 / approx. 30 liters
Front and rear openings: 48 x 13 cm = 624 cm2 (approx. 1/4 Sd)
So will the driver be ok for ripole use, and how are the cabinet dimensions looking? I'm prepared to give it a shot if it looks alright-ish, and then do some measurements and adjust. This will be a learning experience as much as anything else...
I've got two 18" pro woofers collecting dust, so I'm wondering if I should try them in a dual driver ripole. I don't know what brand the drivers are, but I've measured the T/S parameters, and from what I have read, they seem alright(?). But realising my own lack of experience here, a second opinion (or more!) would be fantastic...
The driver parameters are:
Sd 1194 [cm2]
Re 6.65 [Ohms]
Fs 27.59 [Hz]
BL 19.70 [N/A]
Qms 4.537
Qes 0.585
Qts 0.518
Vas 338.500 [liters]
L10k 1.07 [mH]
dBSPL 92.74 [1W/1m]
Ms 196.80 [grams]
Cms 0.17 [mm/N]
I don't know the xmax...
In other words, the total Sd for 2 drivers is 2388 cm2. I was thinking the following dimensions for the cabinet, with equal sized front and rear cavities:
Front and rear cavities: 48 x 48 x 13 cm = 29952 cm3 / approx. 30 liters
Front and rear openings: 48 x 13 cm = 624 cm2 (approx. 1/4 Sd)
So will the driver be ok for ripole use, and how are the cabinet dimensions looking? I'm prepared to give it a shot if it looks alright-ish, and then do some measurements and adjust. This will be a learning experience as much as anything else...
After you are done "learning" how inefficient ripole coupling can be.
You can sort of salvage by installing it into a huge simple open baffle.
Nelson Pass did something slot loaded like that, go check his threads.
When Zob did it (and I got somehow dragged into this mess) it only
took up half his living room to fix it, but finally with an added baffle,
his ripole worked!
Don't suggest anything elaborate or permanent with the baffle, so the
wood can later be repurposed into a PPSL, Tapped horn, or Karlson that
might actually work for you in a reasonable enclosure size.
In short, you are wasting your time on something already proven to
be nonsense. Best you can hope for is some cool pics that will mislead
others to waste even more time and wood.
That said: Every ripole dreamer I've ever tried talking sense to, built
one anyway. Just don't blow a lot of effort on making it look good till
you have heard one.
You can sort of salvage by installing it into a huge simple open baffle.
Nelson Pass did something slot loaded like that, go check his threads.
When Zob did it (and I got somehow dragged into this mess) it only
took up half his living room to fix it, but finally with an added baffle,
his ripole worked!
Don't suggest anything elaborate or permanent with the baffle, so the
wood can later be repurposed into a PPSL, Tapped horn, or Karlson that
might actually work for you in a reasonable enclosure size.
In short, you are wasting your time on something already proven to
be nonsense. Best you can hope for is some cool pics that will mislead
others to waste even more time and wood.
That said: Every ripole dreamer I've ever tried talking sense to, built
one anyway. Just don't blow a lot of effort on making it look good till
you have heard one.
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Inefficiency is not a concern, I have plenty of power available. And huge open baffles are unfortunately not an option (or anything else huge for that matter), as this, if successful, will be placed in the living room.
Power is irrelevant to the problem. Cancel coupled, 6th order pair
of 18's will run out of xmax before you feel enough bass to satisfy.
Look forward to huge kludgefix that takes up half the living room.
I suggest you read some PPSL threads and see if you might build
your ripole such that your efforts can be easily converted. The
manifold you have to build in either case isn't all that dissimilar.
Keep PPSL in mind for plan B. PPSL works.
The front and back have to be tuned differently, else it doesn't
work to dump them into the same room so close together with
no baffle separation between. Complete cancellation. Been there,
done that, TWICE! How I get shanghigh'd into these projects???
of 18's will run out of xmax before you feel enough bass to satisfy.
Look forward to huge kludgefix that takes up half the living room.
I suggest you read some PPSL threads and see if you might build
your ripole such that your efforts can be easily converted. The
manifold you have to build in either case isn't all that dissimilar.
Keep PPSL in mind for plan B. PPSL works.
The front and back have to be tuned differently, else it doesn't
work to dump them into the same room so close together with
no baffle separation between. Complete cancellation. Been there,
done that, TWICE! How I get shanghigh'd into these projects???
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Simple, Alcohol (and sometimes), food .
Seriously, Don't bother with a ripole. It will work if all the stars and moons line up, but isn't the best way to achieve any particular goal.
As kenpeter mentioned (whined), the SLOB approach will work but can get large . The push pull SLOB bass arrays that I built were about 4 ft wide and 3 ft high and blocked out half the sunlight in the room. I put my foot down at that point. I still have them in storage, hoping someday to incorporate them in some sort of push pull infinite baffle experiment.
I'd say, try a pair of H-baffles or a single linkwitz W baffle first (I've compared a W baffle to a a ripole in the past and it was superior in most aspects except a bit of extension)
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I probably shouldn't write this, but...
Hi linaudio,
I have not build any Ripol subs myself, but cannot believe that reputable individuals and companies have just made all the data about the Ripols up.
One big difference may be the usage in relatively small european living rooms v. large american style living rooms. There seems to be a buble in front of the Ripol in which this sub is most effective.
There are quite a few reputable individuals who have used the Ripol concept successfully. Here is the Jazzman's example:
Jazzman's DIY Electrostatic Loudspeaker Page: Ripole Subwoofers:
,and another one:
http://rstaudio.de/Subwoofer/sub_en.html
From my purely theoretical understanding the passive filter that reduces the 1st major peak after the passband is part of the basic design, and should not just be replaced w/ an active solution; but, Rudolf Finke has shown some measurements for what he calls the M-Dipol that show passive and active solutions, so that may be possible. The filter is important, and an integral part of the design.
Another problem may be the same cancellation that reduces the output of attempts at building all forms of small dipole sub(?)woofers. The ripol trades output level in the passband for low frequency extension. It is not a PA subwoofer of any kind. If the posted measurements are correct it is a true, but very low efficiency, subwoofer. Even lower efficiency than a standard H/W/M baffle dipole. It will, according to the literature, lower the in-box resonance frequency of the driver from it's free air Fs. This requires a driver with a slightly higher Fs, 27.59Hz should be OK. The driver will also need a high Xmax, or, at least a high Xmech.
Ultimately, you'll have to build and measure (or at least listen to) to get an answer.
I'll attach a drawing (sketch really) of mine that was never build or tested. It has a few notes, and may be a starting point should you decide to give this a try.
I have heard, that the originator of this design, Axel Ridtahler, will answer questions (for free), and (for a fee) design system.
Regards,
Hi linaudio,
I have not build any Ripol subs myself, but cannot believe that reputable individuals and companies have just made all the data about the Ripols up.
One big difference may be the usage in relatively small european living rooms v. large american style living rooms. There seems to be a buble in front of the Ripol in which this sub is most effective.
There are quite a few reputable individuals who have used the Ripol concept successfully. Here is the Jazzman's example:
Jazzman's DIY Electrostatic Loudspeaker Page: Ripole Subwoofers:
,and another one:
http://rstaudio.de/Subwoofer/sub_en.html
From my purely theoretical understanding the passive filter that reduces the 1st major peak after the passband is part of the basic design, and should not just be replaced w/ an active solution; but, Rudolf Finke has shown some measurements for what he calls the M-Dipol that show passive and active solutions, so that may be possible. The filter is important, and an integral part of the design.
Another problem may be the same cancellation that reduces the output of attempts at building all forms of small dipole sub(?)woofers. The ripol trades output level in the passband for low frequency extension. It is not a PA subwoofer of any kind. If the posted measurements are correct it is a true, but very low efficiency, subwoofer. Even lower efficiency than a standard H/W/M baffle dipole. It will, according to the literature, lower the in-box resonance frequency of the driver from it's free air Fs. This requires a driver with a slightly higher Fs, 27.59Hz should be OK. The driver will also need a high Xmax, or, at least a high Xmech.
Ultimately, you'll have to build and measure (or at least listen to) to get an answer.
I'll attach a drawing (sketch really) of mine that was never build or tested. It has a few notes, and may be a starting point should you decide to give this a try.
I have heard, that the originator of this design, Axel Ridtahler, will answer questions (for free), and (for a fee) design system.
Regards,
Attachments
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You stored them? I was sure those had gone the way of firewood by now.
We should try converting one end to PPSL and see if it can be salvaged.
Either seal the back for 4th order, or stagger tune the back for 6th order.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/177905-thread-those-interested-ppsl-enclosures.html
-----
Speaking of Ripoles and Linkwitz and reputable individuals...
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/woofer.htm#Dipole Woofer
"The woofer is directional with a cos(angle) or figure-of-eight polar pattern.
The response is 3 dB down at 45° off-axis. When placed near the side walls
the woofer may need to be angled towards the listening position.
The woofer requires electronic equalization of the 6 dB/oct frequency
response roll-off which is due to front-to-rear sound cancellation."
We should try converting one end to PPSL and see if it can be salvaged.
Either seal the back for 4th order, or stagger tune the back for 6th order.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/177905-thread-those-interested-ppsl-enclosures.html
-----
Speaking of Ripoles and Linkwitz and reputable individuals...
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/woofer.htm#Dipole Woofer
"The woofer is directional with a cos(angle) or figure-of-eight polar pattern.
The response is 3 dB down at 45° off-axis. When placed near the side walls
the woofer may need to be angled towards the listening position.
The woofer requires electronic equalization of the 6 dB/oct frequency
response roll-off which is due to front-to-rear sound cancellation."
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Hi kenpeter,
Post #7: "...Speaking of Ripoles and Linkwitz and reputable individuals..."
No doubt, his results seem to confirm bjorno's Hornresp simulation (as well as generally know data about open baffles). I have no problems with your or zobsky's expertise either, and the idea to make the basic plenum the same as the one in a PPSL is great.
How big would a standard box be, e.g.: PPSL bass-reflex, in comparison to a dual 18" Ripol. How should the comparison be conducted, same size, same SPL_max (obviously not), same F3? How about the people that use the Ripol to add low frequency extension to their fullranges?
But I guess you've been there, and can provide all the documentation anyone would want to look at.
Regards,
Post #7: "...Speaking of Ripoles and Linkwitz and reputable individuals..."
No doubt, his results seem to confirm bjorno's Hornresp simulation (as well as generally know data about open baffles). I have no problems with your or zobsky's expertise either, and the idea to make the basic plenum the same as the one in a PPSL is great.
How big would a standard box be, e.g.: PPSL bass-reflex, in comparison to a dual 18" Ripol. How should the comparison be conducted, same size, same SPL_max (obviously not), same F3? How about the people that use the Ripol to add low frequency extension to their fullranges?
But I guess you've been there, and can provide all the documentation anyone would want to look at.
Regards,
Ken,
I certainly have enough drivers left over from the project - at least a dozen 12" subwoofer drivers lurking in various dark corners of the house. But time to undertake this, .. another matter entirely
linaudio, ...
I really suggest you try building an H-frame out of scrap . Here's how MJK did it. Jordan JX92S OB with a Goldwood GW-1858 Woofer in an H Frame Project
If you want to be rigorous and need help modeling your driver in his spreadsheets, I have his mathcad spreadsheets and shoud be able to plug your driver parameters in . I need to find some free time first.
I am listening to two Ripole subs ( 2 x 12" divers each ) and I have to say that they would give my Linn Isobarik's a run for their money for bass output. They are each a 14" cube, roughly speaking, so take up very little room and they go very deep. My room is 5 x 4 m's
Sure I have to use some eq. and up the gain on the amp but it is a very worthwhile experiment. I cannot believe how much bass comes out from such a small space. I'm not talking about the sort of Spl that proper Home theatre set ups put out, but far more than adequate for any normal listening levels.
Using two 18" drivers will ( with some eq. and extra power ) produce a lot of bass when you have found the best location in your listening room.
There are a lot of opinions about Ripoles, some based on theory and some based on actual builds, and some of those opinions are positive and some negative. The negative ones will be from those that do not have any concerns about neighbours or have large rooms to fill or like very high spl's for movie sound effects. ( chest thumping bass ) which you will probably not get with a Ripole, although I might prove myself wrong on that point! The positive ones will be from those that like bass free from the effects of boxes and that goes very low from a small space in a normal sizes domestic setting, and who does not really want their ornaments falling off shelves when listening to movie soundtracks.
I use mine to fill in the very bottom end of a Line Array which run at 99db/w each side and they blend in very nicely, ( both open baffle ) so any talk of inefficiency is subjective really.
Sure I have to use some eq. and up the gain on the amp but it is a very worthwhile experiment. I cannot believe how much bass comes out from such a small space. I'm not talking about the sort of Spl that proper Home theatre set ups put out, but far more than adequate for any normal listening levels.
Using two 18" drivers will ( with some eq. and extra power ) produce a lot of bass when you have found the best location in your listening room.
There are a lot of opinions about Ripoles, some based on theory and some based on actual builds, and some of those opinions are positive and some negative. The negative ones will be from those that do not have any concerns about neighbours or have large rooms to fill or like very high spl's for movie sound effects. ( chest thumping bass ) which you will probably not get with a Ripole, although I might prove myself wrong on that point! The positive ones will be from those that like bass free from the effects of boxes and that goes very low from a small space in a normal sizes domestic setting, and who does not really want their ornaments falling off shelves when listening to movie soundtracks.
I use mine to fill in the very bottom end of a Line Array which run at 99db/w each side and they blend in very nicely, ( both open baffle ) so any talk of inefficiency is subjective really.
Not saying anything sensible like "Don't build Ripole".
Those clearly infected are going to build one anyway.
Just saying build with skepticism and an exit strategy.
Think through salvage plan B or C well in advance.
PPSL, SLOB, Sealed Box come immediately to mind.
Resist the urge to blow 2 weeks of your free time and
half a paycheck creating a masterpiece till you have
auditioned a quick and dirty proof of concept, or better
yet someone else's.
Zob's was not of the quick and dirty variety. No, he
put in a full effort to make every detail right (Both
times) , and they were very impressive solid pieces
of workmanship that got broken up for firewood.
We didn't know about PPSL at the time, or might
have tried that. SLOB was tried and worked, but
much too big.
Those clearly infected are going to build one anyway.
Just saying build with skepticism and an exit strategy.
Think through salvage plan B or C well in advance.
PPSL, SLOB, Sealed Box come immediately to mind.
Resist the urge to blow 2 weeks of your free time and
half a paycheck creating a masterpiece till you have
auditioned a quick and dirty proof of concept, or better
yet someone else's.
Zob's was not of the quick and dirty variety. No, he
put in a full effort to make every detail right (Both
times) , and they were very impressive solid pieces
of workmanship that got broken up for firewood.
We didn't know about PPSL at the time, or might
have tried that. SLOB was tried and worked, but
much too big.
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Hi,
typically this forum provides for good useable infos, but sometimes a few frustrated-by-their-disappointments ´ol bitches just try to spoil the fun.
Hardly seen so much hate and rubbish spread about Ripoles in a single thread.
Certainly a Ripole is no onefitsall solution for all circumstances.
And Yes, it´s good to warn about possible drawbacks and circumstances where a positive outcome is not to be expected.
But the kind of bashing shown here is neither correct nor helpful.
Now OT again.
jerryo describes exactly why and when a Ripole may be a very good option.
Especially when You rent a flat and don´t want to put visits from angry neighbours or the police on Your daily agenda, a Dipole may be the only chance to enjoy truely deep low bass.
From the parameters, the measured values seem consistant and believable.
If the drivers perform large strokes without noise, there´s nothing that obviously hinders Dipole useage.
The suggested dimensions are rather small, but should be useable if the driver doesn´t perform more than ~10mm of stroke.
If the driver is a longthrow type capable of more, You might think of slightly increased dimensions.
The small dimensions lead to a considerable drop in base resonance frequency.
My sim tells that it drops down to 17.5Hz wo filter.
The chamber resonance will occur at ~215Hz and can be notched and LPed with a passive filter.
Lser: 3.9-4.7mH, 0.25-0.3Ohm
LCR parallel: 1.0mH, 540µF, 0.25-0.3Ohm
With filter the base resonance frequency drops further down to 15.8Hz.
bandwidth limits (@1m,-3dB) 17Hz, 130-115Hz.
The impedance minimum at ~90Hz is 3,4Ohms wo filter and 2Ohms with filter.
So choose an appropriate amplifier.
With every Hz below 20Hz the driver tends to (uselessly) flap around more.
You might think of implementing the filter with active circuitry here.
This is a case where the omittance of the passive filter may be advantageous.
A design after Linkwitz seems more appropriate to me with this set of TSPs as the Fs doesn´t drop so much with a larger design.
In any case, a bit of wooden boards doesn´t cost a life and the drivers seem worth a try with this kind of cabinet.
jauu
Calvin
typically this forum provides for good useable infos, but sometimes a few frustrated-by-their-disappointments ´ol bitches just try to spoil the fun.
Hardly seen so much hate and rubbish spread about Ripoles in a single thread.
Certainly a Ripole is no onefitsall solution for all circumstances.
And Yes, it´s good to warn about possible drawbacks and circumstances where a positive outcome is not to be expected.
But the kind of bashing shown here is neither correct nor helpful.
Now OT again.
jerryo describes exactly why and when a Ripole may be a very good option.
Especially when You rent a flat and don´t want to put visits from angry neighbours or the police on Your daily agenda, a Dipole may be the only chance to enjoy truely deep low bass.
From the parameters, the measured values seem consistant and believable.
If the drivers perform large strokes without noise, there´s nothing that obviously hinders Dipole useage.
The suggested dimensions are rather small, but should be useable if the driver doesn´t perform more than ~10mm of stroke.
If the driver is a longthrow type capable of more, You might think of slightly increased dimensions.
The small dimensions lead to a considerable drop in base resonance frequency.
My sim tells that it drops down to 17.5Hz wo filter.
The chamber resonance will occur at ~215Hz and can be notched and LPed with a passive filter.
Lser: 3.9-4.7mH, 0.25-0.3Ohm
LCR parallel: 1.0mH, 540µF, 0.25-0.3Ohm
With filter the base resonance frequency drops further down to 15.8Hz.
bandwidth limits (@1m,-3dB) 17Hz, 130-115Hz.
The impedance minimum at ~90Hz is 3,4Ohms wo filter and 2Ohms with filter.
So choose an appropriate amplifier.
With every Hz below 20Hz the driver tends to (uselessly) flap around more.
You might think of implementing the filter with active circuitry here.
This is a case where the omittance of the passive filter may be advantageous.
A design after Linkwitz seems more appropriate to me with this set of TSPs as the Fs doesn´t drop so much with a larger design.
In any case, a bit of wooden boards doesn´t cost a life and the drivers seem worth a try with this kind of cabinet.
jauu
Calvin
Hi,
I like the SLOB concept, here is a link to Nelson Pass's project:
http://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_slob.pdf
, and the diyaudio thread:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/195734-nelson-pass-slot-loaded-open-baffle-project.html
There are all kinds of ways to approach what is basically an open baffle loudspeaker.
Regards,
P.S.: Thanks Calvin for chiming in on this.
I like the SLOB concept, here is a link to Nelson Pass's project:
http://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_slob.pdf
, and the diyaudio thread:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/195734-nelson-pass-slot-loaded-open-baffle-project.html
There are all kinds of ways to approach what is basically an open baffle loudspeaker.
Regards,
P.S.: Thanks Calvin for chiming in on this.
If you want to experiment, you could (with the same driver / baffle) try variations:
1. ripole
2. h-baffle
3. single driver SLOB - such as this : http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/mult...oaded-open-baffle-project-28.html#post2715779
1. ripole
2. h-baffle
3. single driver SLOB - such as this : http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/mult...oaded-open-baffle-project-28.html#post2715779
Strong opinions on both sides here.. Thanks for all the input guys!
I already have a pair of Eminence Alpha15A in H-baffles (I´ve got MJKs worksheets, but thanks for the offer zobsky) and I like them, but I was tempted by the idea of using both my 18s in a single, super compact cabinet. Also, two H-baffles is too much to keep permanently in the living room, but a single cabinet (be it ripole/H/W) that can be moved into position only when used might be ok.
Thanks for your very informative post Calvin, much appreciated. What software do you use to sim the ripole? I checked out the W-frame at the Linkwitz website, it seems to me that it wouldn’t necessarily end up that much bigger than the ripole (especially if I were to increase the front opening of the ripole anyway..). How can I sim a W-frame?
Thanks for all the input guys!I already have a pair of Eminence Alpha15A in H-baffles (I´ve got MJKs worksheets, but thanks for the offer zobsky) and I like them, but I was tempted by the idea of using both my 18s in a single, super compact cabinet. Also, two H-baffles is too much to keep permanently in the living room, but a single cabinet (be it ripole/H/W) that can be moved into position only when used might be ok.
Thanks for your very informative post Calvin, much appreciated. What software do you use to sim the ripole? I checked out the W-frame at the Linkwitz website, it seems to me that it wouldn’t necessarily end up that much bigger than the ripole (especially if I were to increase the front opening of the ripole anyway..). How can I sim a W-frame?
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Strong opinions on both sides here..
I already have a pair of Eminence Alpha15A in H-baffles (I´ve got MJKs worksheets, but thanks for the offer zobsky) and I like them, but I was tempted by the idea of using both my 18s in a single, super compact cabinet. Also, two H-baffles is too much too keep permanently in the living room, but a single cabinet (be it ripole/H/W) that can be moved into position only when used might be ok.
Thanks for your very informative post Calvin, much appreciated. What software do you use to sim the ripole? I checked out the W-frame at the Linkwitz website, it seems to me that it wouldn’t necessarily end up that much bigger than the ripole (especially if I were to increase the front opening of the ripole anyway..). How can I sim a W-frame?
You're welcome. Please post your results, when done .
Hi linaudio,
You can simulate open baffle speakers in Hornresp, see the attachment in Post #6. Hornresp has an Export AkAbak Script feature which will give you a basic AkAbak script to which you can add acoustic details and electronic filters (passive and active).
Well worth learning, even if it has a steep learning curve (I'm still trying).
Like zobsky, I'd would also appreciate any information you can share about your experiment.
Regards,
You can simulate open baffle speakers in Hornresp, see the attachment in Post #6. Hornresp has an Export AkAbak Script feature which will give you a basic AkAbak script to which you can add acoustic details and electronic filters (passive and active).
Well worth learning, even if it has a steep learning curve (I'm still trying).
Like zobsky, I'd would also appreciate any information you can share about your experiment.
Regards,
Lol, I had to read this for bit and dig into the links provided before I could figure out what a Ripole was. it turns out to be a slot loaded push push open (or should I say no baffle) baffle. I have modeled this in AkAbak based on the Linkwitz dipole sub and yes, the efficiency is awful. Adding narrow 12in wide baffle with 8in bent back wings improved things substantially. I have to say that although low SPL - I like how it sounds. Great dynamics. I would not be so discouraging to the OP. I did if with cardboard and qnty 6 cheap 6.5in drivers so nothing was at stake and expectations were not high. However, if I were to go back and build a wooden speaker this will be at the top of my list for listening to jazz and vocals.
it turns out to be a slot loaded push push open (or should I say no baffle) baffle. I have modeled this in AkAbak based on the Linkwitz dipole sub and yes, the efficiency is awful. Adding narrow 12in wide baffle with 8in bent back wings improved things substantially. I have to say that although low SPL - I like how it sounds. Great dynamics. I would not be so discouraging to the OP. I did if with cardboard and qnty 6 cheap 6.5in drivers so nothing was at stake and expectations were not high. However, if I were to go back and build a wooden speaker this will be at the top of my list for listening to jazz and vocals.- Status
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