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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide
Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide
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Old 21st May 2020, 04:15 AM   #11
xrk971 is offline xrk971  United States
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Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide
Here is the much awaited polar data - rough eyeballed angles +/-3 deg, but distance of 0.50m is measured at each angle with a ruler. Data is shown as 6 cycle FDW to reduce effect of room boundaries and show more intrinsic behavior of the speaker. I think it looks excellent and the integration of the waveguide and 6.5in woofer is ideal with a 3.6khz crossover frequency.

Data presented here with 6 cycle FDW:
Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide-ptt6-5-rs28f-woofer-axis-polar-data-0-5m-2vrms-jpg

Here is same data in plain 1/24th oct smoothing with no FDW:
Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide-ptt6-5-rs28f-woofer-axis-polar-data-0-5m-2vrms-24th-oct-jpg
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Last edited by xrk971; 21st May 2020 at 04:26 AM.
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Old 21st May 2020, 05:52 AM   #12
pelanj is offline pelanj  Czech Republic
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Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide
These speakers reminded me this model: S400 White — Buchardt Audio

I imagine a luxury version of these with CNC'd front panel with integrated waveguide in high gloss finish and the original passive membrane. I almost bought the S400, but I did not like the sharp edges.

I wonder how would the large AMT integrate with this woofer.
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Old 21st May 2020, 05:59 AM   #13
xrk971 is offline xrk971  United States
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Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide
Those look nice and you are right. Even the waveguide on the bottom and passive radiators on the back. I doubt it is transient perfect or Harsch XO though. The crossover has 5 caps and 3 inductors. They look like Dayton components too.

Click the image to open in full size.

Thanks for pointing it out though.
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Old 21st May 2020, 07:35 AM   #14
pelanj is offline pelanj  Czech Republic
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Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide
Watching this forum is dangerous, I think I will need to expand my long list of future project with one compact box like this - based on your design.
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Old 21st May 2020, 08:51 AM   #15
ErikdeBest is offline ErikdeBest  Switzerland
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Nice! For my understanding: what does the Purifi unit donin this design that could not be done by a driver like the mw16p SB Acoustics MW16P - 6.5" Mid Bass
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Old 21st May 2020, 12:07 PM   #16
xrk971 is offline xrk971  United States
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Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide
Hi Erik,
The Satori is perhaps one of the best 6.5in mid bass ever made. I don’t have one, yet. It might work in this configuration - I don’t know, but I think its response might take a few more components to get as smoothly rolled off. I think the main thing about the PTT6.5 is it’s ultra low distortion - it’s similar or even better than a dedicated midrange like a class leading 10F/8424 over the 1k to 4K range, plus it has 10m Xmax. This pumps a lot more air.

PTT6.5:
Click the image to open in full size.

Satori:
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 21st May 2020, 02:42 PM   #17
wilbur-x is offline wilbur-x  Norway
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We managed for a MTM to smooth the Satori-bump at 1khz by passive components. (Google "WVT hřyttaler" )
Now Troels tamed and smoothed Satori by edge-coating (and other lo-mids) with a "secret" glue. I discussed that case with member "Rallyfinnen".
We might try a strong flexible glue meant for book binding. (Danafix).
I am really exited to watch XRK's experience with Purify in a transmission line. In addition to temper the bass, the rear wave reflex will be attenuated. Dangerous reading indeed !

Last edited by wilbur-x; 21st May 2020 at 02:58 PM.
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Old 21st May 2020, 02:50 PM   #18
picowallspeaker is offline picowallspeaker  Italy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pelanj View Post
These speakers reminded me this model: S400 White — Buchardt Audio
These reminded the SF...
Diffusore Acustico Special Edition Ex3ma | Sonus faber
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Old 21st May 2020, 03:26 PM   #19
454Casull is offline 454Casull  Canada
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Good stuff!

What does the Purifi woofer have that enabled the all-passive Harsch XO, that the Dayton woofer does not and therefore could not? Just that the response is usable to a higher frequency?
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Old 21st May 2020, 05:11 PM   #20
xrk971 is offline xrk971  United States
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Simple Passive Harsch XO Using PTT6.5 and RS28F in a Waveguide
PTT6.5 has an absolute lack of breakup anomalies in the higher frequencies so no extra filtering or notch filters needed, plus a wide bandwidth and low distortion that allows it to work as an excellent midrange.

If you look at the factory response curve below, the woofer looks like it has a natural electronic low pass filter / DSP applied. But that’s just the natural roll-off.

Let’s compare to the grand daddy of all high end mids - the VM752 soft dome:
Click the image to open in full size.

Except for not having 94dB sensitivity, PTT6.5 is flatter and goes even higher?:
Click the image to open in full size.

Let’s compare to the response of the RS180P that I measured in same box:
Click the image to open in full size.

There’s a huge 16dB (from ideal falloff baseline) hump at 6kHz that has to be dealt with. There is a 2kHz bell mode ringing distortion at 2kHz that grows rapidly with SPL.
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Last edited by xrk971; 21st May 2020 at 05:25 PM.
 

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