I've been looking for a good reasonably priced coaxial driver for some time and have been reading about various units , some which cost quite a packet of money. We always find some drivers that are liked by many but not really focused upon. I see references to the Eminence Beta CX-10 in several unrelated posts .
So I thought that it would be a good idea to collect the experiences of all Eminence Beta CX-10 users in one thread. So we hope to see pictures, technical details and listening results of the designs being used. It also happens to be a driver that appears to be available in quite a few countries at a reasonable price.
My interest in the CX-10 arose because it is basically a coaxial full range unit and I wanted that to use in an OB design. I also like the sound it produces even without any enclosure which to me gave it great potential to sound good when the implementation is completed. I plan to handle the LF with a sub . Not quite decided at the moment on how that will be done.
I might add that there appear to be many choices for the HF driver and I have the Eminence APT50 and ASD1001 drivers with me. Hopefully I will also get the Selenium D220Ti driver which some claim to be audibly better than the ASD1001.
Cheers.
So I thought that it would be a good idea to collect the experiences of all Eminence Beta CX-10 users in one thread. So we hope to see pictures, technical details and listening results of the designs being used. It also happens to be a driver that appears to be available in quite a few countries at a reasonable price.
My interest in the CX-10 arose because it is basically a coaxial full range unit and I wanted that to use in an OB design. I also like the sound it produces even without any enclosure which to me gave it great potential to sound good when the implementation is completed. I plan to handle the LF with a sub . Not quite decided at the moment on how that will be done.
I might add that there appear to be many choices for the HF driver and I have the Eminence APT50 and ASD1001 drivers with me. Hopefully I will also get the Selenium D220Ti driver which some claim to be audibly better than the ASD1001.
Cheers.
I've run it and the previous lower qts version with multi-pleat surround in Karlson couplers. Eminence's values of 2mH/10uF for the lowpass and 3.3uF/0.33mH are ok for a crossover. I've run it with the PRV D280ti, old APT50 and ASD1001 - its a good little driver and gives a sense of power in a Karlson 12
a Karlson 12 is 24.5" high by 16.75" wide by 13.75" deep - I've gone smaller. A sub would be useful but even with a relatively high cutoff, subjective bass punch is good and enough for pop and jazz genre. Sometimes its more useful to have decent sensitivity and low cone excursion on peak transients than a speaker with kiwer F3 which has no useful power.
smaller than K12 - about 21" tall - this has run 10cx - that's a Delta10A
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
smaller than K12 - about 21" tall - this has run 10cx - that's a Delta10A
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
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Wow that's a lot of Karlson enclosures ! You must really find it very good. My concern would be the fact that some of the lower mids might be coming from pretty close to the floor ? Does that affect the localisation of voices ?
Is there any specific curvature to be used that is related to the enclosure size ?
I've always wondered how the Karlson slot sounds on a tweeter like you have done.
Is there any specific curvature to be used that is related to the enclosure size ?
I've always wondered how the Karlson slot sounds on a tweeter like you have done.
Here's a Beta-8CX set of horizontal measurements I just did, in case that interests anyone. The CD is a CDX1-1746. These are high resolution measurements and gated, but I smoothed to 1/3 because I was trying to look at directivity and didn't want it any messier than necessary. The driver is recessed 1cm beyond flush. It kinda looks like the woofer makes a better horn than the horn...
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I picked the 10 inch to go as low as possible and because the Xmax is higher than the 8 inch. The 8 inch also seems to have a large peak beyond 1 khz .
But like the Alpha-6 and Alpha-8 , does the smaller driver 'sound' better in the midrange ( CX8 vs CX10)?
I've seen measured response curves of the CX-10 not having as severe a peak as it's published spec shows.
Still have to mount my driver to see how it sounds on a baffle!
But like the Alpha-6 and Alpha-8 , does the smaller driver 'sound' better in the midrange ( CX8 vs CX10)?
I've seen measured response curves of the CX-10 not having as severe a peak as it's published spec shows.
Still have to mount my driver to see how it sounds on a baffle!
I have been playing with the discontinued 8" CX2008 and the Beta 8CX mated with APT50 and DH200E. I like the drivers a lot. Attached are some measurements made with SE. Crossover consisted of 10 ohm resistor & 2.2 uF cap on tweeter, driven by electronic crossover with B4 @ 2 KHz on woofer and B3 @ 2 KHz on tweeter. Measured 22 deg off axis, at 20", no smoothing.
Drivers are CX2008 and APT50.
They are in a reflex box, 0.8 cu ft. Sound is very nice, spooky imaging. Satisfying bass, not quite enough, but OK.
Drivers are CX2008 and APT50.
They are in a reflex box, 0.8 cu ft. Sound is very nice, spooky imaging. Satisfying bass, not quite enough, but OK.
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Yes, I use AkAbak and developed a way to approximate the response of a Karlson aperture through a series of rectangular ports which approximate the shape of the Karlson aperture function. The rest of the cabinet is modeled as a series of interconnected waveguides and chambers. More info is in the Karlsonator thread in the Full Range forum. Here is a sim of the Beta 10CX in the Karlsonator in a large room so no wall reflection effects, also no high freq CD installed.
SPL vs Freq
Impedance
Cone Excursion
Attachments
beta 10cx , isobarik way
I've made a beta 10cx with a extra (noname) basspeaker on the isobarik way. From an old prototype after the Adire he 10 design, I put an extra speaker in the box and removed the port. I also removed the APT 50's for a big noname titanium compression-driver that can crossed much lower. I've used a DEQ and a DCX to tune the box. I like the 6db butterworth on 1, 4 k the best. The compression driver which I use has no detailed specifications and 6db slope on 1,4k is maybe a bit heavy. But I don't hear any problems on this driver. It has a 44mm VC and is maximum advised filtering 12 db on 1.2k by PA usage.
The isobarik way, the different compressiondriver and the tuning with DEQ/DCX changes the bit boring Adire 10 design in a kind of super Lowther kind of thing with excellent bass. The delay of the woofer (automatic feature of the dcx) and the coax build make this a very coherent speaker.
It inspired me to do the same with the 12cx.
I've made a beta 10cx with a extra (noname) basspeaker on the isobarik way. From an old prototype after the Adire he 10 design, I put an extra speaker in the box and removed the port. I also removed the APT 50's for a big noname titanium compression-driver that can crossed much lower. I've used a DEQ and a DCX to tune the box. I like the 6db butterworth on 1, 4 k the best. The compression driver which I use has no detailed specifications and 6db slope on 1,4k is maybe a bit heavy. But I don't hear any problems on this driver. It has a 44mm VC and is maximum advised filtering 12 db on 1.2k by PA usage.
The isobarik way, the different compressiondriver and the tuning with DEQ/DCX changes the bit boring Adire 10 design in a kind of super Lowther kind of thing with excellent bass. The delay of the woofer (automatic feature of the dcx) and the coax build make this a very coherent speaker.
It inspired me to do the same with the 12cx.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Did you get the Beta 8CX horn to sound anything but harsh? I can't seem to. Tried all kinds of things, still nasty. I haven't tried a different compression driver yet, though. Using a Celestion 1746.
My Selenium D220Ti driver arrived. A direct switch from ASD1001 to 220 Ti sounds nice. HF is louder and I think that is due to the higher sensitivity of the 220Ti . Sometimes there is sibilance in the 220Ti which was not there ( or not so noticeable) in the ASD1001.
Can't make any definitive conclusion without changing the crossover and measuring the response. This might take some time. I want to run in the drivers for a while before measuring them.
Can't make any definitive conclusion without changing the crossover and measuring the response. This might take some time. I want to run in the drivers for a while before measuring them.
the PRV D280ti sounded more full than ASD1001 and was a bargain at $33 - I think they're up around $39 each now. B52 has a polymide diaphragm thread-on compression driver for $50 shipped which is nice. AS1001 is a good driver. The old APT50 with APT3 adapter sounded snappy in some setups. The Eminence 12cx I use in little Karlson have 54, 80 and 120 ounce magnet slugs. Beta 10cx in a Karlson 12 is a good combo with good subjective power. With a little Pass amp my old analog spl meter swung to 115dB or so at one meter on a drum beat - might have been some room gain.
Well I'd be interested to see any measurements of the HF you'd care to post (with enough details to try to duplicate, hopefully). I do still have a box with the 8CX hanging out on my shelf. I was planning to leave it until I feel like buying a fancier 8" coax, but I'd be up for giving it another try with the 8CX too.
I was able to pin down the problem to bad performance 3-9kHz or so, and it did not seem to be anything fixable with EQ (passive, DSP, anything). I also confirmed the performance of the compression driver was fine on other horns.
I was able to pin down the problem to bad performance 3-9kHz or so, and it did not seem to be anything fixable with EQ (passive, DSP, anything). I also confirmed the performance of the compression driver was fine on other horns.
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