Scottmoose said:
I guess that would be really fine for people who don`t have the opportunity of corner loading. I simulated the Ciare HX160 in a 340cm BIB with the TL offset driver sheet. In contrast to the half wavelength TQWT (250cm, 50Hz) it would probably need corner loading, but it would still be there at 40Hz.
Cheers Greg, you beat me to it with those!
Zek, my Monacor BIBs are currently playing in the garage and they work very well indeed. The little SPH-60X is a cracking driver, and well worth pursuing.
Re the flare rate, Greg has already refered to this in previous posts a few pages ago. I can't remember which number off the top of my head though. Have a search and you should find them quickly enough.
Zek, my Monacor BIBs are currently playing in the garage and they work very well indeed. The little SPH-60X is a cracking driver, and well worth pursuing.
Re the flare rate, Greg has already refered to this in previous posts a few pages ago. I can't remember which number off the top of my head though. Have a search and you should find them quickly enough.
Inverted BIBs
GM wrote:
Hi,
It is my understanding that highish Fs drivers are more suitable for an Inverted BIB.
But here are some questions:
- Do low Fs and low Xmax drivers also benefit from a shorter pipe when used in an Inverted BIB? Example, 56Hz Fs and 1mm Xmax from the Veravox 7x.
- Zdriver is adjusted when pipe is shortened for a “Normal BIB”. I'm just not sure if/how this applies to Inverted BIBs and what variables are involved (?).
I'm uncertain which drawing below is correct. But I surmise it's the one on the left?
Thanks!
fred
GM wrote:
Hi,
It is my understanding that highish Fs drivers are more suitable for an Inverted BIB.
But here are some questions:
- Do low Fs and low Xmax drivers also benefit from a shorter pipe when used in an Inverted BIB? Example, 56Hz Fs and 1mm Xmax from the Veravox 7x.
- Zdriver is adjusted when pipe is shortened for a “Normal BIB”. I'm just not sure if/how this applies to Inverted BIBs and what variables are involved (?).
I'm uncertain which drawing below is correct. But I surmise it's the one on the left?
Thanks!fred
Attachments
fred76,
I'm about to go out and get wood for a pair of BiB's for my 871s. I'm have designed a floor loading enclosure similar to the BIB on the left in your picture.
GM,
Thanks for the specs. By the way, the manager said to come back next summer, but that I was going out of town too much this summer
Josh
I'm about to go out and get wood for a pair of BiB's for my 871s. I'm have designed a floor loading enclosure similar to the BIB on the left in your picture.
GM,
Thanks for the specs. By the way, the manager said to come back next summer, but that I was going out of town too much this summer
Josh
ff165k
good morning all
I have a pair of ff165k that are broken in and I have built the bib cab according to scottmoose's cab of 8.5x16.25 external using 3/4" poplar plywood; 7-7-7 at the bottom for the internal baffle and 69" high.
The other driver I have and will try in this bib is an eminence alpha 6". It is not very refined but a good performer and robust.
How critical is the driver distance from the bottom base? Scottmoose indicated 36". What are the effects of moving it up to 38 or 40" up, given that there is enough clearance behind the driver?
Thank you scottmoose and everyone involved in the bib.
cheers
doggy
good morning all
I have a pair of ff165k that are broken in and I have built the bib cab according to scottmoose's cab of 8.5x16.25 external using 3/4" poplar plywood; 7-7-7 at the bottom for the internal baffle and 69" high.
The other driver I have and will try in this bib is an eminence alpha 6". It is not very refined but a good performer and robust.
How critical is the driver distance from the bottom base? Scottmoose indicated 36". What are the effects of moving it up to 38 or 40" up, given that there is enough clearance behind the driver?
Thank you scottmoose and everyone involved in the bib.
cheers
doggy
Thanks edjosh23.
Yeah, the drawing on the left chops off the actual terminus at an angle, thus shortens the recommended pipe length - not right.
I'm still curious if a driver with 56Hz Fs and 1mm Xmax will work with a shortened pipe... Zdriver will be adjusted (I think higher) when pipe's shortened for a normal BIB... If the BIB is inverted, the driver postion becomes low, so an extra pedestal is needed to get the driver position circa ear-level .
fred
Yeah, the drawing on the left chops off the actual terminus at an angle, thus shortens the recommended pipe length - not right.
I'm still curious if a driver with 56Hz Fs and 1mm Xmax will work with a shortened pipe... Zdriver will be adjusted (I think higher) when pipe's shortened for a normal BIB... If the BIB is inverted, the driver postion becomes low, so an extra pedestal is needed to get the driver position circa ear-level .
fred
Well, I settled for 37" from top of base to speaker. Cab is 3/4" poplar. Still have to finish 2nd bib,then sand and apply clear nit. lac.
Have to make more room for the bib. The ff165k sounds clear and dynamic in this cab. Have not added any internal damping yet.
cheers
doggy
Have to make more room for the bib. The ff165k sounds clear and dynamic in this cab. Have not added any internal damping yet.
cheers
doggy
Attachments
Good man. They look very nice indeed from the pictures. Poplar? I don't think anyone's tried that before; could be good. Certainly looks the part!
Driver distance is really taken from the sealed end (the point), and is usually placed to help supress a null in the response. Given the reliance of these these enclosures on the room however, I don't think moving their position an inch or so from the ideal will have drastic consequences. Experimentation is the key! (within reason). It sounds like you've used my original dimensions with the larger terminus, and lower driver. The latest, available on Godzilla's wonderful BIB pages, have a smaller terminus and higher driver mounting. There shouldn't be much in it, especially as you've lifted the driver up a bit. In fact, if anything, you'll probably have better LF response. I might play around some more with the 165 dimensions for the 'Zilla pages -a combination of the two perhaps. The drivers are worth it. Enjoy & keep us posted.
Regards
Scott
Driver distance is really taken from the sealed end (the point), and is usually placed to help supress a null in the response. Given the reliance of these these enclosures on the room however, I don't think moving their position an inch or so from the ideal will have drastic consequences. Experimentation is the key! (within reason). It sounds like you've used my original dimensions with the larger terminus, and lower driver. The latest, available on Godzilla's wonderful BIB pages, have a smaller terminus and higher driver mounting. There shouldn't be much in it, especially as you've lifted the driver up a bit. In fact, if anything, you'll probably have better LF response. I might play around some more with the 165 dimensions for the 'Zilla pages -a combination of the two perhaps. The drivers are worth it. Enjoy & keep us posted.
Regards
Scott
I am about ready to build a pair of BIBs for the Fostex 168ES Sigmas. Using the guidelines, I came up with approx. internal dimensions of 6.5"(w) x 11.5"(d) x 60"(h).
After looking at Terry's latest Inverted BIB, which loads the floor rather than the ceiling, I was wondering on these lines:-
Use a 15" or 18" ELF type of sub and mount the 168 BIB above that to couple with the ceiling better (ceilings are usually 9'-10' high).
I would also like to use a Fountek JP3 ribbon in each BIB.
Set it up for active amplification with an active x-over and make the inputs switchable so that the 168 can be used either as the midrange in the 3-way active setup or as a Full Range.
This way it would be possible to have the best of all worlds ie., a 168 BIB that couples better with the ceiling and a switchable 3-way active system to handle even the most demanding type of music.
One more comment: How is the idea of either starting a thread or putting up the 'internal fill' details for each BIB in the zillaspeak website?
I had posted the above a couple of pages earlier; does anyone want to comment on some of the issues I've raised?
Thanks,
After looking at Terry's latest Inverted BIB, which loads the floor rather than the ceiling, I was wondering on these lines:-
Use a 15" or 18" ELF type of sub and mount the 168 BIB above that to couple with the ceiling better (ceilings are usually 9'-10' high).
I would also like to use a Fountek JP3 ribbon in each BIB.
Set it up for active amplification with an active x-over and make the inputs switchable so that the 168 can be used either as the midrange in the 3-way active setup or as a Full Range.
This way it would be possible to have the best of all worlds ie., a 168 BIB that couples better with the ceiling and a switchable 3-way active system to handle even the most demanding type of music.
One more comment: How is the idea of either starting a thread or putting up the 'internal fill' details for each BIB in the zillaspeak website?
I had posted the above a couple of pages earlier; does anyone want to comment on some of the issues I've raised?
Thanks,
construction
Thanks Scott for your reply. I have had the ff165k in other blh, and the bib not only give excellent low freq. but the midrange comes out better than I have heard it. I was kind of wondering about relections from the baffle to the cone. I can also stuff the top of the "so" to shorten the distance to the driver.
This poplar is 13 ply-$44 can. 4x8 sheet, it has some nice grain, which I put to the sides; chose the clear grain for the front panels. I use the butt joint method with glue and clamps, and cover the end ply with iron-on veneer. I tried a new glue the person at Windsor recomended. It's called bondrite, it is supposed to take stain and sanding. It works the same as regular wood glue.
Will report back after completion.
cheers
doggy
Thanks Scott for your reply. I have had the ff165k in other blh, and the bib not only give excellent low freq. but the midrange comes out better than I have heard it. I was kind of wondering about relections from the baffle to the cone. I can also stuff the top of the "so" to shorten the distance to the driver.
This poplar is 13 ply-$44 can. 4x8 sheet, it has some nice grain, which I put to the sides; chose the clear grain for the front panels. I use the butt joint method with glue and clamps, and cover the end ply with iron-on veneer. I tried a new glue the person at Windsor recomended. It's called bondrite, it is supposed to take stain and sanding. It works the same as regular wood glue.
Will report back after completion.
cheers
doggy
Attachments
Samuel Jayaraj,
Personally if you are going to have a 3 way and are going to use the 15" or 18", I think the BIB may not be the best idea. The BIB is a great way to get the LF and higher gain using a single driver. The 168Sigma BIBs go down to 40hz, a sub would be on a 40hz LP filter. I think that perhaps having the 168Sigma OB would be a good idea having the ribbon on there and using the 15" or 18" similar to the Basszilla. Just my
Josh
Personally if you are going to have a 3 way and are going to use the 15" or 18", I think the BIB may not be the best idea. The BIB is a great way to get the LF and higher gain using a single driver. The 168Sigma BIBs go down to 40hz, a sub would be on a 40hz LP filter. I think that perhaps having the 168Sigma OB would be a good idea having the ribbon on there and using the 15" or 18" similar to the Basszilla. Just my
Josh
Sam,
I followed Scott's recommended dimensions for my Fe168EZ BIB which were 6 3/4" X 11" internal and a length of 64". Based on the discussions in this thread, it appears that the dimensions are somewhat flexable.
Repeat: I also need sugestions regarding fill amounts.
Dmason--can you share your experience with fill in your 168 BIB?
I followed Scott's recommended dimensions for my Fe168EZ BIB which were 6 3/4" X 11" internal and a length of 64". Based on the discussions in this thread, it appears that the dimensions are somewhat flexable.
Repeat: I also need sugestions regarding fill amounts.
Dmason--can you share your experience with fill in your 168 BIB?
GM and I discussed floor loaded BIBs and stuffing options. One method he suggested was placing grill cloth around the back of the driver. Grill cloth cuts down on high frequencies and by placing it around the back of the woofer, high frequencies wouldn't even enter the BIB. He also suggested perhaps putting a small amount in the tip, but otherwise gain is decreased significantly by stuffing as are the low frequencies.
Josh
Josh
Ray Collins said:
Well, I actually used a piece of a car seat cover a friend had, a thick piece that had the consistancy of a lambswool. Pretty funny, as this guy has crap everywhere, but something that actually did come in handy. Anyway, just something to help stop reflections coming back into the driver.
Josh,
Thanks for the reply. In fact, for a long time I wanted to keep the 168ES 'Open Baffle(d)', for the 3 way active system. I asked for peoples opinions here, but one person replied in this thread saying that the mids/voice sounded much better in the BIB than open baffle.
With the ELF kind of subwoofer, one can easily cover 15Hz to 40 or 45Hz, then let the BIB take over and then crossover to the Ribbon upward of 7Khz. My take is that complex passages and rock music will not suffer.
My idea is to make the preamp/crossover out switchable, so that the 168SE BIB can be used as a true full range, thereby enabling a direct comparison between FR and 3-way active.
Ray Collins,
When you say a length of 64" do you mean 'L' of the BIB drawings or the actual measured height of the enclosure?
Thanks,
Thanks for the reply. In fact, for a long time I wanted to keep the 168ES 'Open Baffle(d)', for the 3 way active system. I asked for peoples opinions here, but one person replied in this thread saying that the mids/voice sounded much better in the BIB than open baffle.
With the ELF kind of subwoofer, one can easily cover 15Hz to 40 or 45Hz, then let the BIB take over and then crossover to the Ribbon upward of 7Khz. My take is that complex passages and rock music will not suffer.
My idea is to make the preamp/crossover out switchable, so that the 168SE BIB can be used as a true full range, thereby enabling a direct comparison between FR and 3-way active.
Ray Collins,
When you say a length of 64" do you mean 'L' of the BIB drawings or the actual measured height of the enclosure?
Thanks,