Wow.. By any chance are they still out there? From your flag I assume you are in malta correct.. If they look good maybe we can work something out to send them to me (I'm in Italy) haha
Yes, I actually came up with my old thread too when I tried searching for information again this month. On that old thread I got plenty of good info for "redesigning" and especially about trying proven kits to start with, but as mentioned I was thinking about a different approach at least for these specific speakers..
Oh well, it's good to know that it's not me that sucks at googling and it's just that there is no info out there on them
Thanks for checking too.
The 9V (I recommend a more gentle 1.5V) battery test is OK for woofers and mids, but would damage more fragile tweeters.
Furthermore, the idea of the battery test is that you can see if the cones of the woofers and mids move under test, but such movement is unlikely to be observed in a tweeter without it suffering damage.
A simple test I use is to wire the driver to the headphone output of a portable transistor radio and listen to see if the driver reproduces the signal clearly. This test can be used for tweeters provided you keep the volume very low.
Furthermore, the idea of the battery test is that you can see if the cones of the woofers and mids move under test, but such movement is unlikely to be observed in a tweeter without it suffering damage.
A simple test I use is to wire the driver to the headphone output of a portable transistor radio and listen to see if the driver reproduces the signal clearly. This test can be used for tweeters provided you keep the volume very low.
Last edited:
Hey! Im Back! I'm sorry for "reviving" this thread and the "tad late" reply, but I felt I needed to update and I have been stuck with thesis writing up until recently.
Any whooo.. So I ended up checking the speakers with my multimeter (checked ohms and continuity test) and well if I am not wrong my results hint to me that the project is a bust. The previous owner must have tampered with them since they were wired weirdly and some connexions where literally just done with tape.
Result of test: 1 tweeter and 1 mid (from separate speakers) don't work (i.e. multimeter did not pick up anything at all from them as opposed to the rest).
So here is my newbie question: Is this project a real bust? Would it be too much of a hassle to find suitable replacements (cheap ones of course)?
I have taken them completely apart and if you think it's still worth posting a diagram I could do that.. but let me know.. dont wanna waste your time
Thanks!
In case it helps, the only components I found wired in between the speakers were these capacitors below (I'm not confident yet in drawing a diagram so I hope my description helps illustrating how they are hooked up):
1) Bennic Bi-Polar 2.2mfd 50wv; hooked between woofer and mid (via the red striped cable)
2) Bennic Bi-Polar 1mfd 50wv; hooked between woofer and high (via the red striped cable)
In all honesty I do not know if this helps, but Im guessing if I get some guidance related to those capacitors that maybe I can find some replacement speakers.
I'd really appreciate some help and/or corrections, whatever is due
1) Bennic Bi-Polar 2.2mfd 50wv; hooked between woofer and mid (via the red striped cable)
2) Bennic Bi-Polar 1mfd 50wv; hooked between woofer and high (via the red striped cable)
In all honesty I do not know if this helps, but Im guessing if I get some guidance related to those capacitors that maybe I can find some replacement speakers.
I'd really appreciate some help and/or corrections, whatever is due
It's worth performing the 1.5V battery test on the suspect drivers to confirm the results of your continuity/ohms test. Making and breaking the battery connection should cause the drivers to emit a 'crackling' sound.
If we accept that we just want to make the speakers work again and not to make them work better than originally designed, then it may be possible to find suitable 'slot in' replacements for the closed back mid and tweeter.
When you are quite clear on which drivers are not working please measure the dimensions of their mounting plates and the diameter of their circular cutouts in the enclosure. Photographs, front and rear, of the offending drivers would be very useful.
Only after investigating the possibility of driver replacement would we look at the crossover/capacitors.
If we accept that we just want to make the speakers work again and not to make them work better than originally designed, then it may be possible to find suitable 'slot in' replacements for the closed back mid and tweeter.
When you are quite clear on which drivers are not working please measure the dimensions of their mounting plates and the diameter of their circular cutouts in the enclosure. Photographs, front and rear, of the offending drivers would be very useful.
Only after investigating the possibility of driver replacement would we look at the crossover/capacitors.
Hey Galu! Thanks for the reply.
So I went ahead and did both tests you mentioned on all the mids and highs.
a) 1.5 v battery test
b) the one you mentioned about hooking it up to a 3.5mm jack, etc.
The result was that both the suspect drivers (1 high and 1 mid) dont work. The others that had good readings with the multimeter did emit the crackling sound and also the sound from the radio receiver.
As for the solution being "just making them work again". I am ok with that.
I'm at peace with the fact that it is in no way gonna end up rocking my world.
I would also be okay with ending up with a 2-way if it's more feasible, even if that means doing a new enclosure; respecting the current volume for the woofer and adding a compartment for the other speaker (I assume that a small full range speaker would be the way to go). Also I assume maybe crossover/capacitor wise it might be simpler...
(and I sense there will be a much more in depth design so maybe I'm answering myself here haha)The main reason I mention the 2-way is because first I have been told it is easier to do (especially for newbies), and also given this is an experiment-project, if price:result ratio is better with a 2-way then I would rather that way (compared to buying 2 mids+2 highs+components).
But again, this is coming from a place of less experience, so I would be ok with just "filling in" those blown speakers if you think it's the best bet.
These are the measurements and the front/back pictures are at the end (the mid has a puncture on the rim).
Mid:
MPlate(edge to edge): 72mm
Diameter(cone): 52mm
Diameter(enclosure cutout): 64mm
High:
MPlate(edge to edge): 58mm
Diameter(cone): 42mm
Diameter(enclosure cutout) 54mm
View attachment 875988
View attachment 875989
And exactly where in all this do the loudspeaker units themselves get talked about if you plan to CHANGE them ?
This isn't as simple as being made out .
For a start if you plan to use a driver and tweeter system instead of a mid-range then ---SCRAP ! the crossover .
You then need to know the type of speaker you are using to replace it .
The crossover frequency is used as the reference point at which a speakers output is cut by ---minus (-) 3db .
Standard crossover is 3.5kHz -high pass , check out your intended replacement speaker,s frequency response .
If you are not well up on this buy an external crossover (passive ) and go by the instructions .
Everybody has to learn somewhere but loudspeaker design is an art in itself don't expect too much at the start guys go to college/university to obtain degrees in it .
This isn't as simple as being made out .
For a start if you plan to use a driver and tweeter system instead of a mid-range then ---SCRAP ! the crossover .
You then need to know the type of speaker you are using to replace it .
The crossover frequency is used as the reference point at which a speakers output is cut by ---minus (-) 3db .
Standard crossover is 3.5kHz -high pass , check out your intended replacement speaker,s frequency response .
If you are not well up on this buy an external crossover (passive ) and go by the instructions .
Everybody has to learn somewhere but loudspeaker design is an art in itself don't expect too much at the start guys go to college/university to obtain degrees in it .
We now have a new Plan A and Plan B - plus the addition of a Plan C!
Plan A: Replace the non-working tweeter and non-working mid (or all four of them?).
Plan B: Convert the existing enclosure to a two way (this has crossover design issues).
Plan C: Build a new enclosure, but...are you sure the woofer is of good enough quality to justify the cost and time of its construction?
The cheap and cheerful option is simply to throw in an inexpensive replacement tweeter and a midrange (if a suitable one can be found) and hope for the best.
Let me know which Plan you decide to adopt before we continue further.
P.S. Your images don't work!
Plan A: Replace the non-working tweeter and non-working mid (or all four of them?).
Plan B: Convert the existing enclosure to a two way (this has crossover design issues).
Plan C: Build a new enclosure, but...are you sure the woofer is of good enough quality to justify the cost and time of its construction?
The cheap and cheerful option is simply to throw in an inexpensive replacement tweeter and a midrange (if a suitable one can be found) and hope for the best.
Let me know which Plan you decide to adopt before we continue further.
P.S. Your images don't work!
You may also like to consider my very cheap and cheerful solution:
Remove all the present tweeters and mids.
Seal off the tweeter cut-outs.
In each mid cut-out, mount one of these Monacor cone tweeters, HT-22/8 | Monacor UK, selling for around £10 each.
We can design a simple crossover to suit, 12dB/octave at 2,500Hz.
Remove all the present tweeters and mids.
Seal off the tweeter cut-outs.
In each mid cut-out, mount one of these Monacor cone tweeters, HT-22/8 | Monacor UK, selling for around £10 each.
We can design a simple crossover to suit, 12dB/octave at 2,500Hz.
We now have a new Plan A and Plan B - plus the addition of a Plan C!
Plan A: Replace the non-working tweeter and non-working mid (or all four of them?).
Plan B: Convert the existing enclosure to a two way (this has crossover design issues).
Plan C: Build a new enclosure, but...are you sure the woofer is of good enough quality to justify the cost and time of its construction?
The cheap and cheerful option is simply to throw in an inexpensive replacement tweeter and a midrange (if a suitable one can be found) and hope for the best.
Let me know which Plan you decide to adopt before we continue further.
P.S. Your images don't work!
Hahahaha Sorry bout that
I did not mean it as a plan C I just mentioned it because I kept reading about pros steering newbies towards 2-ways (with tons of valid reasons), so I did not want to "sound" stubborn in sticking with a 3-way; I just wanted to let know that Im flexible 
I also saw some local prices of mids and highs and got a bit discouraged that it could end up being around 90-100EUR (4 speakers @ 15-20 a piece, plus shipping, plus components) I might as well get a kit 
The annoying thing is that if it were to be that both tweeters or mids were blown, I reckon it would be an easier thing to deal with, but of course this being 2020 it had to be one of each hahaha
But yeah Galu, if plan B has crossover design issues and C is too much since its an oldie (I only* considered this option for the woodworking fun), I'm good with the "cheap and cheerful option", and even the "very cheap and cheerful solution" too. It would depend on price:result = cheap:cheerful
I have a question for the "very cheap and cheerful" option (and this does not count as a plan, I'm just curious and trying to learn something with this question): When would someone use one of those small full range speakers as opposed to a mid/high/both when building a speaker?
Oh and about the pics, dunno what happened cause they work for me, but I'll try to attach them again:
My "very cheap and cheerful" option employs the HT-22/8 | Monacor UK which has a lowish resonant frequency and would be a 'reasonable' substitute, on its own, for your current mid/tweeter combination.
The fact that the Monacor HT-22/8 has a closed back means it can be incorporated into your cabinet with minimum fuss.
The trouble with using a small full range speaker instead is that it will have an open back, requiring you to provide it with a sealed enclosure within the existing cabinet. This would subtract volume from the existing cabinet, and alter its bass reflex tuning. Doable, but more of a hassle!
Additionally, since we do not know the parameters of the bass driver, we are shooting in the dark when it comes to matching any new drivers, of any description, to it.
If the "very cheap and cheerful" path doesn't work then you've not paid out too much money and the tweeters can be stored away for a future project.
If you want to experiment more widely on this speaker in order to gain knowledge then that's fair enough - just don't expect perfection.
Let me know the path you wish to take. Please note, I would struggle to make a recommendation if it comes to choosing a matching, small full range driver.
Hey! Ah ok, I did not know about that closed back detail, cool one more piece of info in my pocket, thanks!
.Yes, perfection in this case is negotiable haha since my goals here apart from "repairing" was experimenting with speakers, and if* possible even box building (I have access to plenty spare wood from a friend's business).
Ok so I think I can try the "very cheap and cheerful way" first and see how it goes like you mention
.I checked the site you provided but it turned out that for orders outside the uk it gets expensive fast in extra fees (for 8EUR speakers a bit too much); so I found a local website (Italy) and the cheapest ones I found were these:
Blocked
They were in the tweeter section of the website but on the manufacturer's site its a full range (FR 10 - 8 Ohm | Visaton).
Was the limitation of the full-range because of the open back and cabinet construction? Cause I can do one respecting the current inner volume of the original just for the woodworking fun
But if complications are far more than just box/compartment building then I can simply keep looking for a tweeter with similar specs like the one you sent
Last edited:
I didn't quite answer your original question. Builders often use a small, full range driver for mid and treble duties, but place it in a separate, small enclosure with an open back. This can give a degree of 'openness' to the sound.
A simple, single capacitor crossover would suffice for such an arrangement.
If you feel like building a small enclosure to sit on top of your present one, then go ahead with your choice of the RF10 - it will satiate your desire to do some woodwork! Don't forget to plug up the mid and treble holes left in the main enclosure though!
A simple, single capacitor crossover would suffice for such an arrangement.
If you feel like building a small enclosure to sit on top of your present one, then go ahead with your choice of the RF10 - it will satiate your desire to do some woodwork! Don't forget to plug up the mid and treble holes left in the main enclosure though!
I didn't quite answer your original question. Builders often use a small, full range driver for mid and treble duties, but place it in a separate, small enclosure with an open back. This can give a degree of 'openness' to the sound.
A simple, single capacitor crossover would suffice for such an arrangement.
If you feel like building a small enclosure to sit on top of your present one, then go ahead with your choice of the RF10 - it will satiate your desire to do some woodwork! Don't forget to plug up the mid and treble holes left in the main enclosure though!
Ah cool that sounds doable and cheerful! Note taken bout the holes
Did you mean literally like a small box 5 sides, no back-part? That'a a first for me
Thanks for this too. I have sent them a request for information (apparently they only take email order requests and here they sometimes take their sweet time answering), so now I'll wait to see what they say.
In the meantime do you mind if we chat a bit about the crossover part, and would it be too much to see both options (Monacor and RF10) in case one falls through, or would it get to complicated?
@ JMF - Thanks for the back-up! I'm really trying to steer NewGuy towards the Monacor HT 22/8. The present mid/tweeter arrangement is really just for show, and a single tweeter can do the job of both (particularly obvious if you look at the series capacitor values!).
@ NewGuy - The time for crossover information will be when you decide on which option you are taking. Time is precious and we must stay focussed.
@ NewGuy - The time for crossover information will be when you decide on which option you are taking. Time is precious and we must stay focussed.
Hey! Yeah I'm aiming at that option, the only real reason I brought up the other one (apart from curiosity) is because here in italy (at least in the region I am) it seems like a real pain in the butt to buy replacement parts for anything, except for that 1 website which had those full range ones. So far I have called 3 local places because they don't have prices online (email orders/requests only), and all they do is either try to hard sell me stuff I didn't even ask for, which of course I don't accept, or completely dismiss me cause I'm not making a bulk order or buying something expensive (for their commision I suppose)
I actually went yesterday to a local electronics store and all they had were car stereo parts (subwoofers and oval speakers) which I can't use cause they are 4 ohms and other specs that are way out of line with what I have been recommended. And the parts they can order are what they call "only hi-fi stereo" parts
Maybe I just have not had luck finding good local stores though, but like what you and galu say: this should be and stay a "cheap and cheerful way", and the time it seems will take for me to find a layman's store and cheap parts is just simply negating the cheerful part Btw, What did you mean by the generic neighbor and 70's japanese quality? that I should maybe look for a similar old used speaker and scrap it for parts of mine? Sorry maybe I missed something there or misinterpreted you
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.