Hi Audiostar
Sorry about the link, entering the correct data re-directs to madman4Q lol.
Maybe the moderators can sort it.
The 22 and 23 are the same animal except for some cosmetic stuff on the outside. The illuminated 'Yaqin' nameplate has been replaced by a single retina burning high brightness Blue LED.
Sorry about the link, entering the correct data re-directs to madman4Q lol.
Maybe the moderators can sort it.
The 22 and 23 are the same animal except for some cosmetic stuff on the outside. The illuminated 'Yaqin' nameplate has been replaced by a single retina burning high brightness Blue LED.
Now Now chaps, that was not the original intention of the work! It was to help all those poor peeps who had bought the Yaqin as it was advertised as Hi-End, Audiophile and sporting a wonderful yin-yang feedback equalization circuit. (Just love that yin-yang bit - their description not mine). Anyway, the idea was to turn something destined for the cupboard or landfill site into something that actually sounded quit good. I am putting together a little something but it is WORK IN PROGRESS but you can get a gist of the idea. The PSU you will probably dislike what with its safety relays but something we have to do in the UK if you are making for someone else. Proper Granny state over here - skipping ropes banned from schools and rubber coated asphalt in play areas etc. You can't legally replace a power socket in your own house now - crazy! Anyway, feel free to use another PSU or enclosures, the amp sounds - wow!
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/lez/LesBox/DIY RIAA Amp_PSU.doc
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/lez/LesBox/DIY RIAA Amp_PSU.doc
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My mate Rob came round to hear some Les Boxes against the MS23LB. After 30 seconds he begged me to turn off the MS23 and re-connect a Les Box. His comments about the MS23:- "it's awful.. I feel sorry for anyone who thinks it sounds good out of the box.. they must miss so much musical goodness! It's not a simple change in the sound.. its like the original circuit is squashing it.. there is no sound stage to speak of, things that should be engineered up in the mix just don't, things that supposed to jump out and have you wanting to grab the instrument just don't.It's not just top but mid or bottom it just squashes everything into muddy lifeless dullness and makes me want to cry! It still blows my mind the whole thing that it produces the correct curve yet can utterly destroy the sound when you have actual music playing! I think from this point forward I will be saying NO to listening to any un-modded 22b or 23b's.. my ears deserve better lol!"
Hi_Q,
Looking forward to you finishing your DIY RIAA Amp with PSU or the phono stage. I believe this diyAudio forum is the best in the world. That being the case, the diyAudio members here can support you and make your phono stage something to be proud of. Also it is time to create a separate thread for your DIY RIAA Amp.
Looking forward to you finishing your DIY RIAA Amp with PSU or the phono stage. I believe this diyAudio forum is the best in the world. That being the case, the diyAudio members here can support you and make your phono stage something to be proud of. Also it is time to create a separate thread for your DIY RIAA Amp.
How did the modded MS23LB fair against the Les Box? I'm not sure what you're saying, I'm guessing that you're comparing the un-modded MS23 with the Les Box.
FYI, since I built my 22LB (Les modded) and retubed my Yaqin 13S with FUll Music and Winged =C= tubes, My system has changed dramatically, so much so that I don't recognize some of my music anymore, ... seriously!.
I think you described the difference with the last statement I quoted from you about things jumping out.
Before the changes, somethings stood out in the soundstage, the rest was there but the images were not solid. Now every recorded instrument has become a solid image in the soundstage. The other thing is that there seems to be more detail as a singer or instrument volume trails off. I'm not sure how to describe that except to give an example... When a guitar string is strummed you can hear it vibrating until the next note is strummed. Now, when the performer lifts their fingers to change their fingers for the next note, you can hear the strings stop vibrating when they take their finges off the strings. It's very clear and very abrupt. Of course, you can also hear (depending on the recording) all the breaths a singer takes during the song.
Les, I do have one question...
The 22LB has a low level hum that I can hear when changing records and close to the speakers. Once the music starts, I can't hear it at all. Is that normal? Is there a way to get rid of this hum? Even if I can't, it isn't really a problem. Is this a grounding issue?
Hi Steven, Yes we listened to a straight out of the box MS23 to re-learn what it sounded like as we had forgot 
. It was just as the MS22, lack lustre in many areas, we then went ahead and converted it so that it had life! The hum should not be a problem, I can only hear it very slightly with all gains turned to max, my outside attenuator goes to level 11 (seriously) and I get neighbour knocking sound at a level of 3 to 4. It sounds to me like you do have a grounding issue, can you try the LB with no inputs from the TT including Ground wire? I like to fit shorting plugs into the front end when I am doing this as it rules out completely any pick up on the input jacks. I think the converted MS22/23 is cleaner than first thought as the very very slight hum at max volume is still there with the power switch set to off. If the hum goes with the TT disconnected then a ground issue is probably on the cards. Of course everyone has different decks and carts, even wiring so there is always a possibility that something like this may occur. My own deck, a rather ancient Leak 2001 give terrible hum if I connect the TT ground to the rear panel terminal. So I run my TT without a Ground and it is quiet as a church mouse. Just try some various wiring set ups, you may find one that clears the hum completely. Regards, Les
. It was just as the MS22, lack lustre in many areas, we then went ahead and converted it so that it had life! The hum should not be a problem, I can only hear it very slightly with all gains turned to max, my outside attenuator goes to level 11 (seriously) and I get neighbour knocking sound at a level of 3 to 4. It sounds to me like you do have a grounding issue, can you try the LB with no inputs from the TT including Ground wire? I like to fit shorting plugs into the front end when I am doing this as it rules out completely any pick up on the input jacks. I think the converted MS22/23 is cleaner than first thought as the very very slight hum at max volume is still there with the power switch set to off. If the hum goes with the TT disconnected then a ground issue is probably on the cards. Of course everyone has different decks and carts, even wiring so there is always a possibility that something like this may occur. My own deck, a rather ancient Leak 2001 give terrible hum if I connect the TT ground to the rear panel terminal. So I run my TT without a Ground and it is quiet as a church mouse. Just try some various wiring set ups, you may find one that clears the hum completely. Regards, Les
With regards to hum Steven, I just received this from a very happy listener in Canada who now has a MS23LB:-
Hi Les, it arrived late yesterday so the ETA was right on. I can't believe something can get here that fast from the UK. The LesBox came in one piece though so that's all that matters. I had a quick look at both units and its funny they increased the size of the transformer housing, I never really noticed that before. That front LED is new too, and definitely bright enough to signal ships in.
So down to the sound. I think the first thing I noticed is no more hum, its finally gone! The second is the detail for sure, it's not that there's more of it... it's that it was just completely missing altogether on stock, it's not flat sounding anymore and instruments pop out at you and you can distinguish one note to the next now. Listening to Pink Floyd's Animals and Led Zeppelin's III the instrumental separation is spot on and I can't believe I was missing this lol. Another thing I noticed is smoothness, oh lord is it smooth sounding! I don't remember if the conversion is the cause of this or if it was the GE 5751 black gates I was using on stock all this time. But being back on 12AX7s and not having to use lower gain tubes to hide nonsense hum, these Winged C's do kick some butt! Before, I was using the 5751 GE's on the stock Yaqin and a 5751 Raytheon Windmill Getter on my actual headphone amp, which could of maybe been too much of the same sort of sound. I remember reading something about it being a good idea to have the most neutral sounding tube in the phono, and if you're amp is tube as well, then that's where you want to put the "flavor tubes". This is some good stuff Les! All the little differences add up to something pretty fantastic. I won't get a chance to listen again until Sunday night sadly, but this put a smile on my face.
Hi Les, it arrived late yesterday so the ETA was right on. I can't believe something can get here that fast from the UK. The LesBox came in one piece though so that's all that matters. I had a quick look at both units and its funny they increased the size of the transformer housing, I never really noticed that before. That front LED is new too, and definitely bright enough to signal ships in.
So down to the sound. I think the first thing I noticed is no more hum, its finally gone! The second is the detail for sure, it's not that there's more of it... it's that it was just completely missing altogether on stock, it's not flat sounding anymore and instruments pop out at you and you can distinguish one note to the next now. Listening to Pink Floyd's Animals and Led Zeppelin's III the instrumental separation is spot on and I can't believe I was missing this lol. Another thing I noticed is smoothness, oh lord is it smooth sounding! I don't remember if the conversion is the cause of this or if it was the GE 5751 black gates I was using on stock all this time. But being back on 12AX7s and not having to use lower gain tubes to hide nonsense hum, these Winged C's do kick some butt! Before, I was using the 5751 GE's on the stock Yaqin and a 5751 Raytheon Windmill Getter on my actual headphone amp, which could of maybe been too much of the same sort of sound. I remember reading something about it being a good idea to have the most neutral sounding tube in the phono, and if you're amp is tube as well, then that's where you want to put the "flavor tubes". This is some good stuff Les! All the little differences add up to something pretty fantastic. I won't get a chance to listen again until Sunday night sadly, but this put a smile on my face.
To have less current.Or say the tube before it has a higher output impedance and less distorsion. And you will not hear more noise.
But you still write as irritant as before on other forums. So read and learn and please stay on the background.
Well, it's been a week and I'm still enjoying my MS23LB that Les was kind enough to liberate from stock. I have to agree with Steven, you really can hear a guitar string vibrate until the next note, that's definitely not there when I compare it against my stock 22B. Tube rolling seems to play a little nicer as well with a touch more impact, but I think the Winged Cs were a spot on choice. Keep up the good work Les!
