Humans are fragile, scared mammals…the perception of truth, fact and the ability to find and comprehend such placates fear and gives us a sense of stability and superiority (odds are anyone who joins ASR already thinks they know more then all the subjective souls who aren’t drinking the kool-aid). It makes us feel good to ‘know’ the answers and even better when we believe others just aren’t smart enough to get it. Poor misguided egotistical souls. It is well known that all our senses are subjective or better yet individual and while an objective approach may lead to balanced equations and nice charts the significance of these observations and conclusions are still subjective. So pompous are we that we believe we can find truth even as we do not understand MANY variables in the equation, even the questions we’re attempting to answer are unclear (42)
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I try to use terms and models from modern experimental cognitive psychology, and from other recent research in related fields. It may take some time and exposure to those types of ideas to more or less comfortably grok them.
One area of research that I sometimes like to point out has to do with dysrationality. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dysrationalia Stanovich has done some interesting work in that area.
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Had a colleague who told me because of an ear infection, they had to take out the whole thing; hook, line and sinker. The other ear still works. He told me he still hears music in stereo. Though physically not possible for him any longer, I've no doubt that's how it seems to him.
Going on step further, the human being is suspicious, consciously and subconsciously, of anything that is unnatural or in any way threatening to his prehistoric brain. A fight or flight response ensues, chemical and physical. It’s the subconscious reaction to everything in our environment that is the key to understanding our perception of sound. By perception I mean the same thing as hearing. When we listen to music we’re completely unaware of the subconscious’ goings on, we just take it for granted this is supposed to be how it sounds.
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If I record a tone and also its echo, which has "temporal", "phasic", otherwise a different quality, why shouldn't the hearing (the whole process of perception and interpretation) differentiate and interpret tone and echo, including temporal, phasic, otherwise: spatial?
The "spatial" perception in "real" is based not only on a "local" but also a temporal, phasic, otherwise quality.
The "spatial" perception in "real" is based not only on a "local" but also a temporal, phasic, otherwise quality.
It is even more complex.
Despite all research, scientist have never been able so far to find where in your body consciounceness and memory resides.
Even more mysterious, 25% percent of those having experienced a near death experience, with no heart beat and no detectable brain activities, saw themselves on the operation table, and can afterwards literally describe what discussions were going on between doctors and what instruments were used before being brought to life again by defribilation.
So consciousness and memory continued functioning while all vital body functions came to a halt.
Hans
All easily measurable vital bodily functions? EEG signals are pretty weak and tricky to measure in the first place.
Before "consciousness" comes "awareness"-)
And: Who is "aware" of what? A "whom", "I", must first be "defined" - the "conscious" relative, different (to it);-)
And: Who is "aware" of what? A "whom", "I", must first be "defined" - the "conscious" relative, different (to it);-)
Wow! I'm really surprised these these argument still happen. Who cares what someone thinks they hear or don't hear? How the hell could you prove to them they do or do not hear it? I don't believe in homeopathy or astrology or the flat earth, but I'm not gonna argue about it. Don't try to convince me of something and I won't tell you you're full of sh!t, that is the social contract.
I had a pair of those way back and in the day they were superb. However, things have moved on considerably since then and some really good headphones are available today. One bit of advice I’d give is to make sure you listen before buying. A good idea is to listen to a really good pair even if it’s way out of your price range because at least then you have a reference. When I lived in Japan, we had a ‘workshop reference’ Stax setup that I ended up taking home for a few months. That pretty much became my reference and I eventually chose a pair of Audio Technica ATH ‘Air’ 900’s. The design has been updated since when I got mine, but the open sound and great imaging are still
there if the reviews are accurate. The bass will benefit from being driven from a low output impedance source.
What about proving to them that an AP measurement is only model, and not a fully complete/correct one at that? 'AP/sound_card is all you need to design a good amp' is just as much of a belief system as anything else. It has a lot to do with Streetlight Effect and WYSIATI.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streetlight_effect
https://facilethings.com/blog/en/what-you-see-is-all-there-is
Because there is often some dysrationality involved there too. Too much emphasis on what is most easily measured.
It is not the sound quality it is the presentation. I have stuck my head under more than a few headphones since.
dave
Planar headphones can be pretty good, definitely worth a try. I use Audeze LCD-X, but have heard LCD-4 too. The more expensive ones do tend to sound more convincingly accurate. Will stick within my price range though. Also turns out custom cables can help. 22-Gauge star-quad can help a significantly. That and stripping off the rubber jacket but leaving everything else intact. Interesting finding, that. Sort of jives with what @sawyers described in another thread.
Here’s an example of how our surroundings affect our sensory perception. Write the word Hitler on a piece of paper and place it on top of one of the speakers. You should notice the sound instantly get worse, more compressed and distorted. Unmusical. To get the sound back tear up the paper and thrown it away. If there’s someone with you don’t tell him or her what you wrote but he/she will hear it too.
Medically pathologizing disagreement and opinion has a very ugly history. Hard pass.
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