I don't see any signs of death. diyaudio.com is pretty alert and not very sleepy. To be true, not many here and elsewhere have experience nor knowledge but who cares as the they are having fun?Pedja said:
peranders said:
Many "experienced" guys have gone away.
Those who ask for advice here may not find it so easily, I've seen posts recently saying that it's hard to get an answer here.
Times they are a'changin'.
Give us a break...
Carlosfm & Pedja,
Jumping from the outside (= with no personal interest in gainclones) into this "discussion" gives a very strange feeling. It looks very much like a personal vendetta against one guy.
I may be able to understand why you two are against group buys, but I disapprove your style of arguing. I also disagree with most of your arguments...
In my opinion the worst thing that has happened to this forum is the increase in such personal attacks. Doesn't feel as much fun any more.
Regards,
Pekka
Carlosfm & Pedja,
Jumping from the outside (= with no personal interest in gainclones) into this "discussion" gives a very strange feeling. It looks very much like a personal vendetta against one guy.
I may be able to understand why you two are against group buys, but I disapprove your style of arguing. I also disagree with most of your arguments...
In my opinion the worst thing that has happened to this forum is the increase in such personal attacks. Doesn't feel as much fun any more.
Regards,
Pekka
Carlos, many... it's not that many and I think there are plenty of competent "answeres" left. Don't forget that this is giving and taking. 19980 memebers taking and 20 giving and giving towards eternity. Life isn't so bad.
A few have left and many new has come. I'd say we are on plus here. we are growing in every respect.
Pekka, don't forget that two people have a different view of 20000! It means that this isn't the general attitude.
As a conclusion why this debate started: digi01 has made exellent pcb's of a idea which has popped up here, the level of the design work is low, the level of uniqueness is low, the level of demand is high, so it seems. The level of money digi01 will earn will not be millions but some and I think he should have something for his efforts. He has also promised to donate some money. You don't have to ask permisssion to use a public and general idea. The only time we may have opinions is if somebody kills an another persons group deal. Let's say Pedja had developed pcb's and started a group deal and then digi01 had come forward and offered dirt cheap pcb's, then we moderators probably had reacted.
A few have left and many new has come. I'd say we are on plus here. we are growing in every respect.
Pekka, don't forget that two people have a different view of 20000! It means that this isn't the general attitude.
As a conclusion why this debate started: digi01 has made exellent pcb's of a idea which has popped up here, the level of the design work is low, the level of uniqueness is low, the level of demand is high, so it seems. The level of money digi01 will earn will not be millions but some and I think he should have something for his efforts. He has also promised to donate some money. You don't have to ask permisssion to use a public and general idea. The only time we may have opinions is if somebody kills an another persons group deal. Let's say Pedja had developed pcb's and started a group deal and then digi01 had come forward and offered dirt cheap pcb's, then we moderators probably had reacted.
Re: Give us a break...
If you take that conclusion after reading these threads, then you miss the point.
I've said what I have to say.
Respect, fair play, education.
A last note: look at the title of this thread and look at the forum it is still placed.
Cheap propaganda.
Things could be done in a more civilized and ordered way.
Now you can spank me.
pekka said:
If you take that conclusion after reading these threads, then you miss the point.
I've said what I have to say.
Respect, fair play, education.
A last note: look at the title of this thread and look at the forum it is still placed.
Cheap propaganda.
Things could be done in a more civilized and ordered way.
Now you can spank me.
peranders said:
Why are you individualizing if several other members expressed similar points of view?
Have you asked the other 20000?
Some people read and don't post.
You are not playing fair.
This is incredible.
Cheap propaganda ? No Carlos, peranders only explain his opinions, same as you explain yours. Becouse he is perfectionics, his constructions can't make as " nest " on universal PCB. That's all. Make the same constuctions and you will must sell it. Maybe later you will change your opinions, becouse without selling is it rather difficult. 😉
Carlos, I say "few" you say "many". Of cource we have lot's of "non-members" sort of speaking but what I wanted to visualize was some perspective.
We have a huge increase of some things and we have nobody skilled left. Perspective Carlos.
Pavel, please...
The reason for me to offer a group buy of this particular design was to test the SMD idea. If I didn't have done that a very very few had tested it, and the reason why is because of the SMD. Now hopefully I can make a statement of something, compete with Brian and Peter? But it isn't any competition really because this is like comparing fish and meat. Which tastes the best?
From statistics we know that their project has been successful and rather many amps are built and even more kits have been sold.
After Christmas we will know more about my project, which I have high hopes in. I think everyone will be pleased but hardly those who haven't come near the amp nor heard it.
We have a huge increase of some things and we have nobody skilled left. Perspective Carlos.
Pavel, please...
The reason for me to offer a group buy of this particular design was to test the SMD idea. If I didn't have done that a very very few had tested it, and the reason why is because of the SMD. Now hopefully I can make a statement of something, compete with Brian and Peter? But it isn't any competition really because this is like comparing fish and meat. Which tastes the best?
From statistics we know that their project has been successful and rather many amps are built and even more kits have been sold.
After Christmas we will know more about my project, which I have high hopes in. I think everyone will be pleased but hardly those who haven't come near the amp nor heard it.
Upupa Epops said:
Of course.
But this thread should be located on Everything Else or Off-Topic.
You didn't get it, did you?
Upupa Epops said:
So he is Mr. perfectionics.😀
Look, Mr. Upupa: I make things on veroboard when I am testing, as it should always be done.
I have my PCBs.
I have PCBs with buffered inverted LM3886, buffered inverted LM4780, NI LM4780.
I have rectifier PCBs for MUR860 and big caps (not 4.7uf
).I'm not interested in selling PCBs, I made them for my own use.
Flashy PCBs don't tell me anything, you guys sell yours.
It's not because it's pretty that it has to be good.
You can make it gold plated but if the layout and/or implementation is not good, forget it.
I'm not criticizing your PCBs, I don't even know them in detail, just seen some pics, I don't even care, but you guys like to criticize what you have never seen.
Never seen, never heard.
Upupa, you are a very convinced guy.
I'm sure you never heard Peranders' SMD GC.
The world is full of commercial amps made by "experts" like you, and they are easily tweakable.
I, gewa, AndyB are the only ones at the moment.carlosfm said:
Carlos, you describe pretty good how you exercise your hobby and you are not alone using vero boards and possibly also etch your own boards. It's perfectly alright. I did that also when I was younger and a poor student. Back then I had loads of cheap or free parts and a huge collection of tools, machines and measurement instruments. It was really fun back then... but if there were "green cards", highly professional one, dirt cheap, I would probably have bought one or two.
Carlos you can't deny that pcb and pcb design is very important for the outcome of a project and it's more important the more "widebandish" the design gets. Try do to a Spitzenklasse DAC on Vero board. So, what I want to say is that some projects more or less need a professional pcb but this can't every DIY'er make.
You don't like "green cards" but hundres here, or maybe even thousands here like those pcb's. I like green cards. I think it's more fun when the design looks good but that's me.
Carlos, I'm not producer of commercial amps 😉 . If you send me your private mail, I can send you my full documentation and we can talk about tweaking. 😎 But so called GC amps aren't my main interest, I like more amps for "adults " 😉 .
peranders said:
I did it, so what?
TDA1543 or TDA1541A, pick one.
Wanna take a listen?
If you are very careful, make a tight layout and know what you are doing, even veroboard can work very well.
I can make PCBs if I want to.
Yes, this is pure DIY, isn't it what we are here for?
Or are we here just to sell/buy PCBs?
Do you think your (or Upupa's) PCB is the best thing that can be done with LM chips, just because of the "professional" looks?
Seriously, this sounds like beginners' talk.
Give me good reasons, not these.
Sincerely...
In most cases are GC's for kids 😉 - you can get all around a bag of miracle devices and still it will be for kids, 'cos for " kids " is it designed by National Semiconductor. 😉
Carlos, what if you had put your TDA1541 on a really good pcb...? I'll guess nobody knows if it would have improved the sound.
Pavel, your are right about LM3886. It's a little bit boring but at the same time it's also good to have a realiable, cheap and easy-to-get going solution... which sounds pretty good.
Pavel, your are right about LM3886. It's a little bit boring but at the same time it's also good to have a realiable, cheap and easy-to-get going solution... which sounds pretty good.
But I agree, this chip amp is not bad amp 😉 ! But if is presented as state of art of amp technology, with arguments, that guys never heard nothing better, so it is not thruth. It have own position, it is good thing for learning about electronic. Is sad, that many industrial amp, designed by profi designers have much more worse sound, but it don't give to this circuit any exceptional position on scale of quality, I'm sorry. 😎
peranders said:
The thing is: I made 3 different prototypes:
I don't go into details but they are (in order of preference/sound quality):
1. TDA1541A with OPA627 biased to class-A analog stage.
2. TDA1543 with OPA627+BUF634 analog stage.
3. small TDA1543 dac with OPA2132 analog stage.
Of course these are each very different implementations and I made them in veroboard.
It could improve with a PCB, but it's not just because a DAC has a PCB that it has to be good.
I can make PCBs when I want to, but for now I all I can say is that all these dacs sound very good indeed.
My TDA1541A dac beats my very modified and improved Audio Alchemy DDE v3.0 dac anyday, any time, even with HDCD discs.😀
I love
the TDA1541A, and it's what I use on my main system.Upupa Epops said:
Have in mind that what you've heard from these chips is your implementation.
If it could be bettered, you don't know.
Upupa Epops said:
Oh.
You are certainly not talking to me.
Ok.😉
Carlos, as I saw you many times saying your amps are great and so on and so forth, I'd love to be pointed to one of your posts where I could read what makes your amps so special.carlosfm said:
If there is no so post, can you describe briefly what brings the most improvement to you chip amps? I have a gainclone as of now, I'm working on this new smd amp from peranders and I'd like to improve the sound of this amps. I am all about chips so far because I find them easier to build, maybe in the future I will try some discret amps too(no A for me tho) but for now I'd like to get the best out of what I have.
thanks.
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